We are called to love one another. So why don't we do it?

[Not_Now.Soon]

Jesus said the two laws that all other laws stem from are to love God with all your heart, all your might, and all your soul and intellect, and the second love your neighbor as yourself. (Mathew 22:36-40). Then later on in an explaination of the Kingdom of Heaven Jesus describes separating people like a Shepard seperates sheep from goats. Those that were accepted into the Kingdem of are described in Mathew 25:34-40 (NIV).

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink?38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

Once more Jesus spoke on love, this time in direction to loving Jesus. Jesus said if you love me obey my commands. (John 14:15).

And once more Jesus says to love your neighbor, even so much to love your enemy. Luke 6:27-31.

27 “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.29 If someone slaps you on one cheek, turn to them the other also. If someone takes your coat, do not withhold your shirt from them.30 Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back.31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

-----------------------------
With all this in mind we can not say we are not called to love one another. That is not my question. My question is why don't we do it? We should all know from our own lives when this has been difficult, or when we have failed to show love. For me, my latest example was last night at not an enemy, but a fellow Christian whom I was losing patience with in a discussion. Fed up I replied rudely to what I thought was his pride filled rudeness at me.

I have to ask. Why? We are called to love, so why is it hard? Why do we not do it, or worse encourage it to not be done in our actions or in others. Should I encourage another person who with wit and savagery tore down another person I had an issue with? But this is done so often. In the world and even among Christians.

Why is it difficult? More so if you can, do you know any ways to make it easier or to strengthen our resolve to love in the situtions we face when love is hard to give?

 

[antipasta]

I imagine myself driving the spike into Jesus' wrists on the cross, because, in truth, I did. We all did. So I imagine myself doing that and I consider the fact that he still loved me. A little silly perhaps, maybe even morbid, but it works for me to keep my own struggles to love others in perspective.

 

[LovethroughDove]

I can only speak from my experience. I'll give an example and maybe someone can relate? I have been married almost 20 years (in Dec.). I am finally submitting to my husbands love. Ridiculous. Why? I don't trust anyone with my feelings. I'm understanding finally that everyone but God is flawed. I need to accept my husbands love from where it comes from, a flawed individual........but I know 100 percent he loves me and I am flawed and I love him.

God's love expressed from us, is willing to love even though that person ain't perfect. And in the case of an "enemy" very flawed. Jesus has experienced our pain and can comfort through any physical and emotional pain we are receiving from others. God experienced our fallen flesh. Wow.

Bottom line, our flesh wants to react to "hurt" and that is why we fail to show love in it's purest form.

 

[Kidron]

I have to ask. Why? We are called to love, so why is it hard?

-
Its difficult because our Adamic nature is the opposite of God's Agape` love.
Our Adamic nature always tends towards taking instead of giving... a natural selfishness which leads us to be self centered, whereas real love is about sacrifice and giving of ourselves with a pure motive.

Consider that the Adamic nature is the nature of the Devil.
It was Lucifer-Satan who had everything, was once a special and beautiful creation in heaven, but He wanted God's power and position because that is how the selfish nature in Him required Him to behave.
When you read about him, you see the human nature in him, as he created this fallen adamic "type", that is in us....this "me, me, me, what I I I I want, ... its all about me me me"....."take, take, take, take, "
So, we contend with this aspect of ourselves that we are become more sensitive to and notice about ourselves because after we are born again BECAUSE we have now something Holy in us that shines a bright light on it.

 

[Wrg1405]

Jesus said the two laws that all other laws stem from are to love God with all your heart, all your might, and all your soul and intellect, and the second love your neighbor as yourself. (Mathew 22:36-40). Then later on in an explaination of the Kingdom of Heaven Jesus describes separating people like a Shepard seperates sheep from goats. Those that were accepted into the Kingdem of are described in Mathew 25:34-40 (NIV).

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink?38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

Once more Jesus spoke on love, this time in direction to loving Jesus. Jesus said if you love me obey my commands. (John 14:15).

And once more Jesus says to love your neighbor, even so much to love your enemy. Luke 6:27-31.

27 “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.29 If someone slaps you on one cheek, turn to them the other also. If someone takes your coat, do not withhold your shirt from them.30 Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back.31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

-----------------------------
With all this in mind we can not say we are not called to love one another. That is not my question. My question is why don't we do it? We should all know from our own lives when this has been difficult, or when we have failed to show love. For me, my latest example was last night at not an enemy, but a fellow Christian whom I was losing patience with in a discussion. Fed up I replied rudely to what I thought was his pride filled rudeness at me.

I have to ask. Why? We are called to love, so why is it hard? Why do we not do it, or worse encourage it to not be done in our actions or in others. Should I encourage another person who with wit and savagery tore down another person I had an issue with? But this is done so often. In the world and even among Christians.

Why is it difficult? More so if you can, do you know any ways to make it easier or to strengthen our resolve to love in the situtions we face when love is hard to give?

What a great question. I really hope we can all chew the fat and help each other regarding this. All of us will have different experiences and a different understanding of love based on those experiences. They will be positive and they will be negative. Those experiences will shape how we think God loves us which will shape how love others.

You quote great scriptures that really challenge us, that's why Jesus told us such things. These scriptures along with many others given to us by Jesus and not mentioned by Jesus are to reveal the love the God has for us.

When Adam sinned in a sense he slapped God on the cheek, having been slapped on the cheek God still came looking for him. He asked Adam "Where are you"? Adam said "I heard you but I was afraid and hid from you"

After the discourse that follows what does God do? He clothed them. He made garments of for them. To me that is the first act of grace from God.

At the same time God put a plan in place.

Genesis 3:15
And I will put enmity
Between you and the woman,
And between your seed and her Seed;
He shall bruise your head,
And you shall bruise His heel.”

This plan was Jesus.

That culminated with.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

That's the live we aspire to BE and walk in.

Quoting scripture is great, walking in it is different ad you and identified.

Let's help each other here, what's helped or helping. LovethroughDove thanks for sharing.

Hope I've made some sense and as said looking forward to this thread expanding.

 

[Wrg1405]

I can only speak from my experience. I'll give an example and maybe someone can relate? I have been married almost 20 years (in Dec.). I am finally submitting to my husbands love. Ridiculous. Why? I don't trust anyone with my feelings. I'm understanding finally that everyone but God is flawed. I need to accept my husbands love from where it comes from, a flawed individual........but I know 100 percent he loves me and I am flawed and I love him.

God's love expressed from us, is willing to love even though that person ain't perfect. And in the case of an "enemy" very flawed. Jesus has experienced our pain and can comfort through any physical and emotional pain we are receiving from others. God experienced our fallen flesh. Wow.

Bottom line, our flesh wants to react to "hurt" and that is why we fail to show love in it's purest form.

I totally relate to your experience, only difference being I've been married 22 years next week and I'm finally understanding my wife's love for me.

She is still chinking away at the armour, knocking away at the bricks in my wall. Not by battering it by with soft, gentle tough love. Now amazing to know that your husband loves you and my wife love me 100% where we are and for what we are. That breaks down barriers that we put up. This love casts out all fear and as it does it releases us mor into love and more into loving.

Isn't God good?

 

[smaller]

There is and will remain a very great difficulty in the task the opening poster seeks to fulfill. It is a God built in problem that is meant to be overcome:

Galatians 5:17
For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

 

[LovethroughDove]

I totally relate to your experience, only difference being I've been married 22 years next week and I'm finally understanding my wife's love for me.

Congrats brother, you are blessed! God is so good :woot

She is still chinking away at the armour, knocking away at the bricks in my wall. Not by battering it by with soft, gentle tough love. Now amazing to know that your husband loves you and my wife love me 100% where we are and for what we are. That breaks down barriers that we put up. This love casts out all fear and as it does it releases us mor into love and more into loving.

100% true. You reminded me of this
1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

I imagine myself driving the spike into Jesus' wrists on the cross, because, in truth, I did. We all did. So I imagine myself doing that and I consider the fact that he still loved me. A little silly perhaps, maybe even morbid, but it works for me to keep my own struggles to love others in perspective.

I've heard of simular outlooks that really put our actions in place. Thanks Antipasta.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

-
Its difficult because our Adamic nature is the opposite of God's Agape` love.
Our Adamic nature always tends towards taking instead of giving... a natural selfishness which leads us to be self centered, whereas real love is about sacrifice and giving of ourselves with a pure motive.

Consider that the Adamic nature is the nature of the Devil.
It was Lucifer-Satan who had everything, was once a special and beautiful creation in heaven, but He wanted God's power and position because that is how the selfish nature in Him required Him to behave.
When you read about him, you see the human nature in him, as he created this fallen adamic "type", that is in us....this "me, me, me, what I I I I want, ... its all about me me me"....."take, take, take, take, "at
So, we contend with this aspect of ourselves that we are become more sensitive to and notice about ourselves because after we are born again BECAUSE we have now something Holy in us that shines a bright light on it.

I'm not so sure we're better off with our conscience and our moral nature after being Christian, compared to a nonchristian. But I think your right about having something Holy in us shines something in us to fight and be strengthened against sin. For me it seems the battles I have in me seem harder after I fall in a sin, or that other sins more easily come to me after one fall. And I wonder if it's like a slap in the face or an insult to the gift God has given me and His holy relationship that sturs sin more easily away. I think I've noticed God's hand on restrengthening me after I sin when I actually go back to Him and ask for forgiveness and strength.

So yeah, there's definitely something in a Holy nature that helps. But still we sin, (or at least I do), and there are many moral nonbelievers out there that could be counted just as right and moral as a Christian who feels God is in their life.

I think your right that we need God's love to be stronger then our sinful nature. So as a follow up thought, what do you think are some things that strengthens our relationship with God and help feed that relationship with His love and the Holy something He gives inside of us?

 

[Wrg1405]

I've heard of simular outlooks that really put our actions in place. Thanks Antipasta.

What's amazing that even having done that, with every bang of the hammer, the pain the anguish. Knowing that at some point soon he would be separated from the Father, "My Father, my father why have you foresaken me, forgive them for they don't know what they are doing, now into your hand I place my spirit, it is finished" then he gave up his last breath.

What's amazing is that the very people (all of us) who caused these spikes to be nailed into him, when he rose again he sought them out, he came after them and is saying "I did it for you, I did it because I LOVE YOU, you wanna spend eternity with me?

Amazing Grace how sweet that sound.
That saved a wretch like me.
I once was lost but now I'm found.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

There is and will remain a very great difficulty in the task the opening poster seeks to fulfill. It is a God built in problem that is meant to be overcome:

Galatians 5:17
For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

I've found on occasion that following what it says in the bible helps either strengthen against the force we've termed the flesh, or following some of what is said avoids completely some of the areas of the flesh. I think it was in proverbs a verse or two that say do not argue aimlessly or enter into arguments. The temptation for doing this has from my experience been on an intelectual level and a level to defend or correct or give my (self evaluated) inspiring advise. Conversations debates and issues to talk and talk about spark inspiration to be in them. At least for me. But avoiding engaging the arguments and the aimless debate has helped me avoid being hostile to another person, and helps keep my arrogance and pride in check by avoiding that sitution that feeds both.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said that this is a God build in problem. And that He's supplied many solutions, if we'd only apply them.

 

[smaller]

I've found on occasion that following what it says in the bible helps either strengthen against the force we've termed the flesh, or following some of what is said avoids completely some of the areas of the flesh. I think it was in proverbs a verse or two that say do not argue aimlessly or enter into arguments. The temptation for doing this has from my experience been on an intelectual level and a level to defend or correct or give my (self evaluated) inspiring advise. Conversations debates and issues to talk and talk about spark inspiration to be in them. At least for me. But avoiding engaging the arguments and the aimless debate has helped me avoid being hostile to another person, and helps keep my arrogance and pride in check by avoiding that sitution that feeds both.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said that this is a God build in problem. And that He's supplied many solutions, if we'd only apply them.

There is a two fold state of affairs. I will guarantee that the "harder" we try to LOVE, the more the flesh will resist that direction.

It's quite an odd state of affairs, but it is a proven reality.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

What's amazing that even having done that, with every bang of the hammer, the pain the anguish. Knowing that at some point soon he would be separated from the Father, "My Father, my father why have you foresaken me, forgive them for they don't know what they are doing, now into your hand I place my spirit, it is finished" then he gave up his last breath.

What's amazing is that the very people (all of us) who caused these spikes to be nailed into him, when he rose again he sought them out, he came after them and is saying "I did it for you, I did it because I LOVE YOU, you wanna spend eternity with me?

Amazing Grace how sweet that sound.
That saved a wretch like me.
I once was lost but now I'm found.

One of the things that keeps me going in awe sometimes is while on the cross Jesus prayed, "forgive them Father. They know not what they do."

Every time I can see God's love, it amazes me. This occasion as well. That (I think) has helped me with some of my sinfulness nature. Knowing and remembering the times in my life I've witnessed and found Go's love.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

There is a two fold state of affairs. I will guarantee that the "harder" we try to LOVE, the more the flesh will resist that direction.

It's quite an odd state of affairs, but it is a proven reality.

I can relate to that. When I was younger I faught to love God and to stay strong my not sinning. And often not too long after an emotional and uplifting time in prayer, the next morning I was only tempted the worse by the flesh that resists that direction. But that was then and I think it's gotten easier over the years (that or I don't notice my sins as easily), and I wonder if it's something besides my fight against sin or my age adding maturity to my abilities. Leaning on God has strengthened a lot of me, but it's always after the fact that I notice it and realize it. Same when I've successfully been able to apply a bible lesson or teaching in my life. It's strengthened me, often without my realization, and therefore it's kind of out of my control and leaves out parts of the hard battle to stay close to God, to love Him, or to stay pure against any sins that I've struggled with.

 

[smaller]

I can relate to that. When I was younger I faught to love God and to stay strong my not sinning. And often not too long after an emotional and uplifting time in prayer, the next morning I was only tempted the worse by the flesh that resists that direction. But that was then and I think it's gotten easier over the years (that or I don't notice my sins as easily), and I wonder if it's something besides my fight against sin or my age adding maturity to my abilities. Leaning on God has strengthened a lot of me, but it's always after the fact that I notice it and realize it. Same when I've successfully been able to apply a bible lesson or teaching in my life. It's strengthened me, often without my realization, and therefore it's kind of out of my control and leaves out parts of the hard battle to stay close to God, to love Him, or to stay pure against any sins that I've struggled with.

The same rule applies in golf. A beautiful long drive straight down the fairway is almost always followed by a really BAD approach shot to the green.

In all seriousness though I have had some amazing encounters with God in Christ, followed shortly thereafter by the most horrific encounters. This pattern, I believe, is found in Mark 4:15, and has proven to be a real matter. Whether we see it or perceive it as such is another matter altogether, but then again that's exactly what Mark 4:15 shows us happens. And it does happen, seen, perceived or not. Most times it's not directly seen. But the resistance factor/bad actor is real.

When you walk in Love and you hear the howls and scowls from others just by walking by them, you'll know yer on the right track.

God has called light to shine from the darkness. So Shine, He Will. That's Love shining from our own darkness.

 

[Wrg1405]

I'm not so sure we're better off with our conscience and our moral nature after being Christian, compared to a nonchristian. But I think your right about having something Holy in us shines something in us to fight and be strengthened against sin. For me it seems the battles I have in me seem harder after I fall in a sin, or that other sins more easily come to me after one fall. And I wonder if it's like a slap in the face or an insult to the gift God has given me and His holy relationship that sturs sin more easily away. I think I've noticed God's hand on restrengthening me after I sin when I actually go back to Him and ask for forgiveness and strength.

So yeah, there's definitely something in a Holy nature that helps. But still we sin, (or at least I do), and there are many moral nonbelievers out there that could be counted just as right and moral as a Christian who feels God is in their life.

I think your right that we need God's love to be stronger then our sinful nature. So as a follow up thought, what do you think are some things that strengthens our relationship with God and help feed that relationship with His love and the Holy something He gives inside of us?

I think we are better off. Yes it's hard because now our conscience has been seared and is now having to learn to be more Christ like. Everyone has a moral nature whether Christian or not but not everyones moral nature is inclined towards Christ because they don't beleive in him and don't want to be like him.

A moral nature in its sense can be base and seeks to be moral for the wrong reasons, whether it be to seek praise to puff ones ego, seek reward or to feel proud. Yet with Christ it starts to change, we don't do it to seek praise of men, we don't do it puff up our ego, feel pride and so on.

We do it because he first loved us and we love him and want the world to see that.

We will always sin, even the same as non beleivers. Both have character traits that are sinful. The difference is that we know our sins are against God. David said to God, "against you and only you have I sinned"

He knew is sin was only against God. Now we are like that with God and we don't to be.

I hate my sin with a passion, I hate my sinful character traits that seem to control me, I pray for release in areas that don't seem to happen and get upset with those areas, yet there are areas that God graciously healed.

But do you know what? I'd rather be like that and not give two hoots, it shows the Holy Spirit is in me, bending my mind towards God. If I didn't give two hoots or didn't care I'd be more worried.

We are counted moral and right before God because of what Jesus did and not what we do or don't do. No one can meet the absolute moral standard of God, not just because we are sinners but also because we have no realisation of Gods absolute moral standard and holiness.

We need to allow God to move in us, that strengthens us. If we try to please God by our works that weakens us.
When we allow God to work in us he sure does so. He healed my gambling addiction, I tried not to gamble for 30 years to try and earn his favour and it got worse and worse. For 20 years I woke up every night with shame and fear because of my gambling, I even got to the point when prayed "God kill me know so I know where I and going, am I with you forever or not" He never took my life so there was a reason. In the end I said "I can't do it I really need your help" praise him he did. Now I walk alongside a non Christian with a gambling problem. He comes to me when he struggles because he does not feel condemned, I get the opportunity to walk along side him in love, I do tell him that he is responsible for his actions but he does not have control over them. However God can heal him through Jesus.

So to me what helps us strengthen our relationship with God is to be totally honest about everything, allow him to work in us rather than us work for him, if we allow him to work in us we will automatically work for him.

When God does work in us and heals our weakness we need never be afraid or ashamed to allow God to use us. My example of the guy I came alongside with gambling was because an employee of mine came to see me over a period of months needing to borrow money. I then said what's going on, she admitted her husband had a gambling problem. In an instant God said to me "tell her how had one and that you are happy to come alongside" which I did.
That helped me strengthen my relationship with God. Wow something so shameful for me was now being putting to good use.

I have also found that when praying the Lord's Prayer the first part up to "Forgive us our sins" we find that it's all about focusing on God, our Father and his kingdom. When I get to the part forgive me of my sins I'm thanking him that I'm forgiven and because I realise I am it causes me to forgive those who have sinned against me. At that point in time if I haven't forgiven someone then God raises it and I deal with it.

Sorry to ramble on

 

[Wrg1405]

The same rule applies in golf. A beautiful long drive straight down the fairway is almost always followed by a really BAD approach shot to the green.

Very funny, as a golfer I appreciate that. My father in law used to wind me up, he called me a military golfer. This is true I could hit a 300 yard drive. Problem was it could go left or could go right. So as I was about to tee off he would say to our playing partners "you look left, you look right and I'll look down the middle just in case he manages it"

As funny as it is that's what our walk with God can be like. I have two dogs that I take for a walk on a lead that extends, when I give them the freedmen they rush off into the bushes or towards the road, when they do I pull the lead back in. I felt one day God say to me as I was praying "You are on my lead, I give you a bit of slack but alas you wander off the path, you sniff hear and then walk towards danger, when you do so then I pull the lead back in and walk alongside me" when he does I'm a happy dog.

 

[smaller]

Very funny, as a golfer I appreciate that. My father in law used to wind me up, he called me a military golfer. This is true I could hit a 300 yard drive. Problem was it could go left or could go right. So as I was about to tee off he would say to our playing partners "you look left, you look right and I'll look down the middle just in case he manages it"

"If it goes left it's a hook, if it goes right it's a slice, if it goes straight it's a MIRACLE." Old golfer quote.

As funny as it is that's what our walk with God can be like. I have two dogs that I take for a walk on a lead that extends, when I give them the freedmen they rush off into the bushes or towards the road, when they do I pull the lead back in. I felt one day God say to me as I was praying "You are on my lead, I give you a bit of slack but alas you wander off the path, you sniff hear and then walk towards danger, when you do so then I pull the lead back in and walk alongside me" when he does I'm a happy dog.

I've heard the oddest and most profound things pop out of my mouth when confronted with temptations. I don't even have to think about them. I know the responses are "heavenly sent." Unless I happen to hit my thumb with a hammer. Then it's profound, from the other direction.

 

[Kidron]

I'm not so sure we're better off with our conscience and our moral nature after being Christian, compared to a nonchristian.

-
Have you noticed that a Christian sins, knowing its a sin, feeling the sting, battling within themselves......feeling the temptation, resisting it, sometimes giving in.....

Whereas the unbeliever has no battle, within.
Its a pig in slop, wallowing around and loving it., bragging about it later..... and this is because the Holy Spirit is not in them.
Nothing is in them except a deadened conscious and Lust.