We are NOT in the End Times

[Lehigh3]

Actually, Jesus Christ is purposefully delaying His coming .

2Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning [His] promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Careful analysis by scholars of whether Jesus knows His coming reveals that the Greek word used in that verse refers to 'at that moment'. Hence, Jesus will surely know when He is coming.

I disagree. Peter was already troubled by the Jewish scoffers. The Jews after the flesh wanted to know why Christ was taking so long to return as He promised (to the apostles & disciples especially) the scoffers knew it was taking decades already- so they said that since the fathers fell asleep (ie: Abraham, Isaac) that all things are continuing the same since the beginning of creation- But Peter tells us they willfully forget the Flood destroyed that creation that was in the beginning - but the heavens & earth which were present in Peter's day have been preserved by the same word & reserved to punish ungodly men by "fire" (& not flood waters this time)
Then Peter tells believers that God is not slack (even though it's taking decades for the judgment & return of Christ) - God still wants all to come into repentance (Israel) & be saved.
God's desire is for all men to come into repentance- even though we can testify that "all" do not care to come to Him & receive life.

So, no, Christ didn't delay His coming past the 40 yr. mark when Israel was once again in the wilderness- God gave them 40 yrs. to merge with Christianity.

If you'd like to know more, please do pm me!

 

[felix]

Then Peter tells believers that God is not slack (even though it's taking decades for the judgment & return of Christ) - God still wants all to come into repentance (Israel) & be saved.

The 1st part of the verse says He is not delaying... However, when I say 'purposefully delaying', I meant the statement 'longsuffering toward us' - meaning 'patiently waiting' which is the actual cause of the delay for His coming.

Other reference Christ delaying purposefully is:
Rev 10:5-7. The angel whom I saw standing on the sea and on the land raised up his hand to heaven and swore by Him who lives forever and ever, who created heaven and the things that are in it, the earth and the things that are in it, and the sea and the things that are in it, that there should be delay no longer, but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets.

 

[Stormcrow]

...that there should be delay no longer, but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets.

So tell us, what is this "mystery of God" and when will it be finished?

 

[smaller]

Interesting! Right out of Matt. 24!!

[48] But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; (hey, this above is even posted up! See Eccl. 12:13-14!)

[49] And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

(not partipating except by associating! See Rev. 18:4 and smite his fellow servants?? calling them fanatics, huh;) See Matt. 10:25!:waving)

[50] The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

[51] And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (Very Sad!)

Note Luke 12:47-48!


--Elijah

Kinda hard to weep and gnash yer teeth when you are cut asunder eh?

Nice observation on the turnabout though.

As to Jesus' coming, I was not aware that He left:

Matthew 28:20
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Romans 8:9
But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Romans 8:10
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

In actuality Jesus never left. Those waiting for Him to show up have kinda missed the point of life In Him and with Him.

There is 'an end time' for all who have lived or ever will live on the earth, when the end of their time here arrives.

There are then 'many' endings.

enjoy!

smaller

 

[felix]

So tell us, what is this "mystery of God" and when will it be finished?

The answer is in the same verses (Rev 10:5-7) - sounding of the 7th angel. If we look what happened when the 7th angel sounded,

Rev 11:15 Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdoms of this world have become [the kingdoms] of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!"

 

[Lehigh3]

The 1st part of the verse says He is not delaying... However, when I say 'purposefully delaying', I meant the statement 'longsuffering toward us' - meaning 'patiently waiting' which is the actual cause of the delay for His coming.

Yes, but "when" was Peter referring to about this longsuffering or patience? Peter said "the end of all things is at hand" He was referring to the Old Covenant age & the Law.

Other reference Christ delaying purposefully is:
Rev 10:5-7. The angel whom I saw standing on the sea and on the land raised up his hand to heaven and swore by Him who lives forever and ever, who created heaven and the things that are in it, the earth and the things that are in it, and the sea and the things that are in it, that there should be delay no longer, but in the days of the sounding of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets.

Yikes felix, who was seeing this vision? John the apostle right? The "there shall be delay no longer" meant that the time of the resurrection of the dead of Israel should happen THEN or "SOON" or must "shortly" come to pass! That was the promise to Israel to be fulfilled - & at the last trumpet.

 

[MMarc]

If no one knows but the Father when Jesus returns, then when will we know? When He is back.

His bride has already seem Him and will be revealed more and more as the Day gets brighter...

 

[Lehigh3]

If no one knows but the Father when Jesus returns, then when will we know? When He is back.

His bride has already seem Him and will be revealed more and more as the Day gets brighter...

And what miracles are you expecting to change then?

Yes, only the Father knew. Jesus said that to the apostles before He left. Then he said the Father would send the Holy Spirit would would tell them of all things to come!
Hello, then we read God the Father giving Jesus giving John the apostle the Revelation. Now, tell me, why can't you understand that the Father revealed the signs of the times of the Revelation of Jesus Christ they were to look for?

The kingdom & its blessings are here now. And Christ defeated death for us. There is no more death. Amen.

 

[ILTL888]

Avoid emotional and fanatical people who claim Jesus is coming "soon" and the kingdom is at hand etc. They are fanatical people and violate what Bible teaches that we are not to start setting dates etc.

Cults set dates and claim "Jesus is coming, Jesus is coming.. We are in the END TIMES!!!".

And many Cult members are deceived and misled by "END TIMES" messages that they sell up their homes, quit their jobs, and give their money away, and then when "END TIMES" don't occur, they lose faith in God and their children are made to suffer and have nowhere to live and no food to eat.

Jesus didn't even know when He was set to return, so no human on Earth has any idea either.

Jesus is not near to returning at all! It's a long way away and in the meantime Christians should live each day carrying their Crosses and helping the needy and sharing the Gospel.

Jesus is not near....there are still a lot of things to happen. Every day around the world there are thousands of people being born again and saved. If Jesus had have returned yesterday, that means thousands of people would have been denied the chance to be saved and go to heaven.

Jesus cannot return as long as there is a single soul who is coming to Christ for salvation. How evil would it be for God to come a day before you were saved! Can you see where I am coming from?

Jesus will only return when the world has become so evil, like Sodom and Gomorrah was, that not a single person on Earth is coming to Christ anymore for salvation. And this is years and years away, probably decades and maybe centuries.

For hundreds and hundreds of years, fanatical misled people have been shouting, "the time is close, Jesus is returning in our lifetime, he comes soon, the kingdom is near", but then Jesus did not return and all it achieved was driving people away from Christ and losing faith when they see Jesus never returned.

Stop being deceptive and fanatical, instead focus each day on helping those in need and share the Gospel with as many as you can, and be thankful that Jesus is not returning soon, because every single day, thousands of new people are added to the kingdom of God.

I refuse to ignore the irony in this thread. You claim to ignore them who set dates of the end times, yet you yourself are doing the same thing by saying we're not in the end time.

 

[tim-from-pa]

I remember something funny years ago I heard on the radio. Remember that book 88 reasons why Christ is returning in 1988? It was during that time frame and they said Jesus was going to return at the Feast of Trumpets.

This was the age where computer and more communication was fast approaching and the old style evangelists were around yet --- probably trying to get his people to hang on to old ideas yet. He did not accept that Jesus was coming back on that date. He said, "I don't know when Christ is coming back, but it will NOT happen on the feat of Trumpets!"

Suddenly, it hit me. He just made an adamant prediction like he was supposedly debunking, except it was in the negative, i.e. "it will not be on...."

I thought it was hilarious. Since the inception of Internet and faster communication, I noticed Christians in general have markedly changed their beliefs from the old school evangelism. I'm surprised at the diversity of beliefs, and I did not realize there was a sizable percentage that do not believe in a literal return (as I do) either that of somehow he returned already back whenever in early AD (which I sware most people missed. )

 

[Acebopata]

While I do believe that we are fast approaching the end times, I am against date setting and such. I don't even trust when people say the lord could return this decade. Although that could be a distinct possibility.

It's much more important to be living our lives as if the lord could return this nano-second. This is not only commanded by the lord, but it also pleases him and can inspire people to accept the Lord as their savor.

 

[noble]

Hi TruthSeeker2012

Avoid emotional and fanatical people who claim Jesus is coming "soon" and the
kingdom is at hand etc. They are fanatical people and violate what Bible
teaches that we are not to start setting dates etc.

That is a given.

Jesus is not near to returning at all! It's a long way away and in the
meantime Christians should live each day carrying their Crosses and helping the
needy and sharing the Gospel.

Jesus is not near....there are still a lot of things to happen. Every day
around the world there are thousands of people being born again and saved. If
Jesus had have returned yesterday, that means thousands of people would have
been denied the chance to be saved and go to heaven.

In that scenario nothing can ever come to an end because there will always be more people coming into the world.......

How about this? Jesus did come immediately after the great trib back in the first century. Jesus did not return physically but in the spiritual realm and established forever the kingdom of God. At that point He went thru the resurrection of the dead which took all the righteous dead to eternal life in heaven. That was the last trump and after that it was no longer necessary to sleep. So after that point the dead met with Jesus after death and are taken immediately to eternal life in heaven.
Here is how I would illustate all this with biblical back-up.

Paul tells us that we will not all sleep at the last trump.
1 Cor 15
51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet.

Paul includes Himself in the WE. There is only ONE generation thru all time in which SOME will die and some will not. That generation is the one who is living on the planet at the time this last trump hits. The 'changed' card is always played here and great gobs of whatever are processed about the 'change'... BUT the change is not the issue here, SLEEP is. All are changed at the last trump and only SOME sleep. We are cocerned with the sleepers. Okay, clue 1 is that some generation somewhere in time will be alive on earth when the last trumpet sounds and as Paul writes WE, it points here to Paul's generation.

Paul also gives us the same reference in 1 Thess 4:15 where Paul includes himserlf as the WE who may be alive at teh coming of the son.

Pul woud be aware of the prediction Jesus made here:

Mark 13
30 I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

By the way the 'YOU' Jesus is talking to there is the private audience mentioned here:
3 As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter, James, John and Andrew asked him privately

So we have Paul indicating in his writing that he feels he may be alive at the time of the coming or the time of the great trib/parousia.

Other writers think the same thing.
Matthew 10
23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. I tell you the truth, you will not finish going through the cities of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

John 21
23 Because of this, the rumor spread among the brothers that this disciple would not die. But Jesus did not say that he would not die; he only said, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you?â€

Rev 2
25 Only hold on to what you have until I come.

So how about verses which straight point at this generation of Paul being in the one which is alive on the planet at the time of the great trib/parousia? Verses which biblically explain the end of the world timing.

Hebrews 9
26For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

1 Corinthians 10:11
Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come

The most convincing story is the private conversation between Jesus and Martha.
Lasurus had died and was about to be resusitated by Jesus Christ. Jesus and Martha spoke:

24 Martha answered, “I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.â€

Martha had heard of the resurrection of the dead.

25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies;

That would cover every body but for sure those who die BEFORE the last trump. Before the last trump those who believe will DIE but they will LIVE! In other words they die but are resurrected to LIFE at the last day.
Then Jesus says to Martha,"26 and whoever lives and believes in me will never die."

Something about 'LIVING' and believing is significant in NEVER DYING! Martha physically 'lives' because Jesus is right at that time standing out in her yard with her, talking to her! Lazurus lived until recently too but he physically died and had to wait for the resurrection so what is going on here? Well, Martha would LIVE physically and biologically on planet earth until the actual time the last trump sounds. Because Martha is one who will LIVE until that last trump sounds Martha will NEVER DIE. Martha passes on from this earthly life and instantly begins her spiritual life living eternally in heaven and therefore NEVER DIES. 2 COr 5:1.

That is why I say we are not in the end times... they are long since past and will never come again!

noble



Do you believe this?†27 “Yes, Lord,†she told him, “I believe that you are the Christ, the Son of God, who was to come into the world.â

 

[Sinthesis]

How about this? Jesus did come immediately after the great trib back in the first century. Jesus did not return physically but in the spiritual realm and established forever the kingdom of God. At that point He went thru the resurrection of the dead which took all the righteous dead to eternal life in heaven. That was the last trump and after that it was no longer necessary to sleep. So after that point the dead met with Jesus after death and are taken immediately to eternal life in heaven.

 

[LastSeven]

So .... what defines "the end times"? If it's the time that Satan has authority for 42 months, then no I don't think we're there yet. But I think we're very close.

 

[Chris]

To declare we are or are not in the end times means you must know when it will be. To declare when something is means one has special knowledge of these things.

I am not going to meet anyone in my lifetime who could have this knowledge for certain because scrpitures say nobody knows except the father. When Jesus returns we will all know at the same time.

Till then I'm not listening to end time declarations

 

[n2thelight]

To declare we are or are not in the end times means you must know when it will be. To declare when something is means one has special knowledge of these things.

I am not going to meet anyone in my lifetime who could have this knowledge for certain because scrpitures say nobody knows except the father. When Jesus returns we will all know at the same time.

Till then I'm not listening to end time declarations

We don't know the exact time,but we are to know the season,that's the purpose of watching.....

 

[Chris]

We don't know the exact time,but we are to know the season,that's the purpose of watching.....

yeah its our best guess it could be but we cant know for sure. Its all a guess.

In the early 1980's people were telling me we are in the last days I have lived through the end of the world a few times since then as well. Oh, and the last rapture in May this year!

If it were the last days or if it wasn't the requirements of the christian life are the same.

The best idea is ignore it all and go about your life.

I always think of this advice-

Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or praiseworthy--think about such things.

 

[LastSeven]

Yes, we should continue to live our lives and live them in accordance with the teachings of Jesus, but on the other hand, I think realizing that we are close to the end puts a sense of urgency on the learning that we should be doing to prepare for what lies ahead.

I think too many Christians are easy targets for the deception that Satan will bring simply because they've not educated themselves.

 

[Gazelle]

Well, I'm not here to change your mind, and you won't be changing mine.

However, I will be receiving the crown of righteousness because I eagerly await and watch for His coming. It appears to be important to God that I do this.

2 Timothy 4:8 (NIV)

Now there is in store for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day—and not only to me, but also to all who have longed for his appearing.

 

[Hitch]

Yes, we should continue to live our lives and live them in accordance with the teachings of Jesus, but on the other hand, I think realizing that we are close to the end puts a sense of urgency on the learning that we should be doing to prepare for what lies ahead.

I think too many Christians are easy targets for the deception that Satan will bring simply because they've not educated themselves.

but on the other hand, I think realizing that we are close to the end


Define 'close to the end' please. In common terms.