What happens when you knowingly disobey the word of God?

[yunig320]

I hear my Pastor say sometimes that it is the worst thing to know the word of God and knowingly disobey it and stray in the opposite path. But I am curious to know what exactly happens when Christians do this thing? Does it mean they lost God forever? I know the Bible mentions a lot of men who repented after disobeying and were able to enjoy God in their lives again, but to what extent is this possible?

 

[Mike S]

I hear my Pastor say sometimes that it is the worst thing to know the word of God and knowingly disobey it and stray in the opposite path. But I am curious to know what exactly happens when Christians do this thing? Does it mean they lost God forever? I know the Bible mentions a lot of men who repented after disobeying and were able to enjoy God in their lives again, but to what extent is this possible?

It is always possible to repent and turn back to God, even if a man has heard and rejected God in the past. A recurring theme throughout the entire Bible is that of turning away from God, suffering the wrath of God, repenting, and returning to God.

If a man persists in his rejection of God's word, his heart hardens and he is given over to pervrsion and degradation. In Romans, Paul goes on a little rant about what happens when men reject God and begin worshipping themselves or their created false gods.



Romans 1:19-32

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

30Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

 

[Angel]

I was in a situation where I knew I was sinning, but was trapped and I remained back slidden. Even at my lowest, I cried to God, telling Him how much I loved Him. He miraculously got me out of the situation. Because of my disease I was still 19 in my early and late 20's. God waited for me, always being there, answering prayers and guarding my life. I have been very rebellious, but I am very in love with the Father. I think because of this I never lost my salvation. I think there is a difference between back sliding and walking the broad path. There someday will be a point in time where they know that they must choose between the narrow and the wide path. If someone knowingly refuses Christ and what he offers, than I think they may not make it in heaven. I think it is best to work out your own salvation, and treat others the way God wants you to.

 

[farouk]

1 John 1.9 is a good basis for considering this.

But the believer learns instinctively to follow the Lord in his or her conscience.

Blessings.

 

[andy]

Hi Farouk. What is important is your attitude having committed a sin. A christian will feel he has let God down more than anything else,and will therefore ask for forgiveness.Don't forget also that the Holy Spirit has begun a good work in you,which will continue throughout your lifetime - if we were made perfect in one day,God would soon lose His appeal.The world is racing faster and faster;everybody wants things instantly.To God 1,000 years is but a second,so we just have to be patient every day,keep learning step by step,and praying for enlightenment,and we will get there in the end,by His grace.God knows our human weaknesses,this is why He repeats things in scripture to reassure us - "I will never leave you,nor forsake you". Psalm 40:1-3 is a wonderful example of these things.God bless you. Andy

 

[farouk]

Hi Farouk. What is important is your attitude having committed a sin. A christian will feel he has let God down more than anything else,and will therefore ask for forgiveness.Don't forget also that the Holy Spirit has begun a good work in you,which will continue throughout your lifetime - if we were made perfect in one day,God would soon lose His appeal.The world is racing faster and faster;everybody wants things instantly.To God 1,000 years is but a second,so we just have to be patient every day,keep learning step by step,and praying for enlightenment,and we will get there in the end,by His grace.God knows our human weaknesses,this is why He repeats things in scripture to reassure us - "I will never leave you,nor forsake you". Psalm 40:1-3 is a wonderful example of these things.God bless you. Andy

Andy:

Yes, I am reminded of Paul to the Philippians, when he says: 'He that hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ' (Philippians 1.6).

Blessings.

 

[Brother Mike]

Philippians 1:6 has saved me more than once from condemnation. I will break down the process of what happens when we disobey God. I am not talking about sin such as Porn, or drugs, or drinking issues. If your trapped in that vicious circle of repenting and sinning again then there is a way out of that which we know.

I am talking about knowing to do the Will of the Lord and not doing it. Everyone has a call on their life and is a body part with a function. Not taking heed to the workmanship for which you were created is a defeated life.
Disobedience comes when light is given. Knowledge of knowing to do, or not do brings some steps.

1) Chastisement. First step in the Lord trying to correct you. You can find this in Hebrews as the Lord chastises those he loves. This always comes in the form of God sending someone, or instruction through the word, something you heard your Pastor say. As you know the word Chastise means to instruct such like a school setting. God gets your attention.

2) If you refuse the correction, there will be a point of being self deceived. This is a bad place to be. A self deceived person has excuses for why the do or allow what they do. Living with someone your not married to for example will often produce responses that we love each other and plan to get married anyway. All the time violating what they know is right in their heart. Not obeying God, and finally what your doing is not as bad anymore, after all, other do it. This part normally effect finances first, then health, and on down the line. Things go wrong and the person can't fathom why.

3) Judgment.

1Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep (DEAD)(.
1Co 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1Co 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

This would be the final result. It ends in death. You will be powerless to stop Satan from destroying you. The hope is that you repent before death comes.

1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

I can't stress enough that disobedience to God brings entrance to the enemy. Obedience to God brings protection and peace. It brings prosperity and health. Choose which one you want, the blessing or the cursing. It's our choice.

Remember, I am not talking about baby Christians stuck in some stupid sin. I am talking about the ones that know the will of God, and won't do it. Saul was a good example of this.

Mike.

 

[yunig320]

I can't stress enough that disobedience to God brings entrance to the enemy. Obedience to God brings protection and peace. It brings prosperity and health. Choose which one you want, the blessing or the cursing. It's our choice.

Remember, I am not talking about baby Christians stuck in some stupid sin. I am talking about the ones that know the will of God, and won't do it. Saul was a good example of this.

Mike.

Brother Mike, Thank you so much for this explanation. I see and understand what you are saying. I get it. I am so glad there are sites like these where people can find help when they are confused or just have a doubt. It is easier when the judging from others is not there. Thanks again!

 

[yunig320]

What is important is your attitude having committed a sin. A christian will feel he has let God down more than anything else,and will therefore ask for forgiveness.Don't forget also that the Holy Spirit has begun a good work in you,which will continue throughout your lifetime - if we were made perfect in one day,God would soon lose His appeal.The world is racing faster and faster;everybody wants things instantly.To God 1,000 years is but a second,so we just have to be patient every day,keep learning step by step,and praying for enlightenment,and we will get there in the end,by His grace.God knows our human weaknesses,this is why He repeats things in scripture to reassure us - "I will never leave you,nor forsake you". Psalm 40:1-3 is a wonderful example of these things.God bless you. Andy

I am reminded of this verse every single day. I am so thankful to God for not ever leaving me. Thanks for your reminder Andy!

 

[yunig320]

1 John 1.9 is a good basis for considering this.

But the believer learns instinctively to follow the Lord in his or her conscience.

Blessings.

Hi Farouk, I really like that verse and I understand what it says. But my question refers to those instances when you just continue sinning, even when you know you are wrong and dont repent and just find an excuse for what you are doing. What happens then?? I think Brother Mike got really close to the answer there. I think is like a process that ultimately ends in death :/

 

[yunig320]

I was in a situation where I knew I was sinning, but was trapped and I remained back slidden. Even at my lowest, I cried to God, telling Him how much I loved Him. He miraculously got me out of the situation. Because of my disease I was still 19 in my early and late 20's. God waited for me, always being there, answering prayers and guarding my life. I have been very rebellious, but I am very in love with the Father. I think because of this I never lost my salvation. I think there is a difference between back sliding and walking the broad path. There someday will be a point in time where they know that they must choose between the narrow and the wide path. If someone knowingly refuses Christ and what he offers, than I think they may not make it in heaven. I think it is best to work out your own salvation, and treat others the way God wants you to.

Very interesting your answer Angel. It really leaves me thinking. I dont think God ever gets tired of waiting for us to come back to Him, but what if we take too long. Im really glad you found your way back. How did you do it?? I wander what would have happened if you had not constantly prayed. I know God knows what's in our hearts, but do we?? This really concerns me :,(

 

[yunig320]

If a man persists in his rejection of God's word, his heart hardens and he is given over to pervrsion and degradation. In Romans, Paul goes on a little rant about what happens when men reject God and begin worshipping themselves or their created false gods.

Mark, this is really interesting. How do you know when your heart is hardened?? Is there a way to find out?? How is it possible to know what we have inside when there is no prayer or communication with God?? I would really like to know what others have to say about this

 

[Mike S]

If a man persists in his rejection of God's word, his heart hardens and he is given over to pervrsion and degradation. In Romans, Paul goes on a little rant about what happens when men reject God and begin worshipping themselves or their created false gods.

Mark, this is really interesting. How do you know when your heart is hardened?? Is there a way to find out?? How is it possible to know what we have inside when there is no prayer or communication with God?? I would really like to know what others have to say about this

Yunig,

I don't know if we can know our heart is hardening...at least after a point. I suspect that there may be a tipping point beyond which our ego is so involved that we would find it nearly impossible to repent. I don't think, however that most of us are near that point, that takes a lot of hate.

In our Wesleyan tradition, we have an understanding of "prevenient grace," a grace given by God that exists prior to any human decision to recognize Christ as Savior. It's described in our Book of Discipline as

" ...the divine love that surrounds all humanity and precedes any and all of our conscious impulses. This grace prompts our first wish to please God, our first glimmer of understanding concerning God's will, and our 'first slight transient conviction' of having sinned against God. God's grace also awakens in us an earnest longing for deliverance from sin and death and moves us toward repentance and faith."

It is God at work in us in such a way that is usually enough to keep us from becoming so far from God that we aren't able to repent.

 

[farouk]

1 John 1.9 is a good basis for considering this.

But the believer learns instinctively to follow the Lord in his or her conscience.

Blessings.

Hi Farouk, I really like that verse and I understand what it says. But my question refers to those instances when you just continue sinning, even when you know you are wrong and dont repent and just find an excuse for what you are doing. What happens then?? I think Brother Mike got really close to the answer there. I think is like a process that ultimately ends in death :/

It needs to be made clear, amidst speculation, that someone who lies and dies in sin and unbelief was never a truly born again believer in the first place, whatever the person might have once professed.

The promise to true believers at the end of Romans 8 is very clear.

 

[Sparkey]

How sweet is the promise of the Lord to David and his seed in Psalm 89:30-34:

Psalms 89:30(NKJV) "If his sons forsake My law And do not walk in My judgments, 31 If they break My statutes And do not keep My commandments, 32 Then I will punish their transgression with the rod, And their iniquity with stripes. 33 Nevertheless My lovingkindness I will not utterly take from him, Nor allow My faithfulness to fail. 34 My covenant I will not break, Nor alter the word that has gone out of My lips. 35 Once I have sworn by My holiness; I will not lie to David: 36 His seed shall endure forever, And his throne as the sun before Me; 37 It shall be established forever like the moon, Even [like] the faithful witness in the sky." Selah

[Psa 89:30-37 NKJV]

If David and his descendants, the kings of Judah, should break God's statutes and keep not His commandments, then God promised to visit their transgression with the rod and their iniquity with stripes; but God would never utterly take His loving kindness from these, and God's faithfulness would not fail, and God would never break His covenant nor change the thing He promised! That is the way God deals with men.

We are being given entrance to a kingdom whose King is greater than David.

"The gifts and calling of God are without repentance" (Rom. 11:29).

God does not mean that we shall never repent of His gifts and His callings. Rather, He promises that He will never repent, will never change, will never turn from even so much as one of His gifts and even so much as one of His callings.

Hebrews 6:1(NIV) Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God, 2 instruction about cleansing rites, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment. 3 And God permitting, we will do so.

4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

But we may not stop there...

Hebrews 6:7(NIV) Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. 8 But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.

9 Even though we speak like this, dear friends, we are convinced of better things in your case—the things that have to do with salvation. 10 God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them. 11 We want each of you to show this same diligence to the very end, so that what you hope for may be fully realized. 12 We do not want you to become lazy, but to imitate those who through faith and patience inherit what has been promised.

 

[George Muller]

I hear my Pastor say sometimes that it is the worst thing to know the word of God and knowingly disobey it and stray in the opposite path. But I am curious to know what exactly happens when Christians do this thing? Does it mean they lost God forever? I know the Bible mentions a lot of men who repented after disobeying and were able to enjoy God in their lives again, but to what extent is this possible?

Any so-called pastor that attempts to make the scriptures into a legalistic code, to earn salvation by works, is not a true minister of the New Covenant.

2Co 3:6 ¶ Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Our odbedience is based upon the "law of faith" not "law of works" we believe in our hearts and we act according to what we believe, not in trying to keep a written code or standard. Now the word itself will judge the heart of honest men as to if they are in obedience to what they believe. The New Covenant is based upon the heart not a written code, OLD OR NEW.

 

[Brother Mike]

farouk

It needs to be made clear, amidst speculation, that someone who lies and dies in sin and unbelief was never a truly born again believer in the first place, whatever the person might have once professed.

The promise to true believers at the end of Romans 8 is very clear.

I do not believe in OSAS, but once a child of God it would take an act of faith to willfully and knowingly leave God and the promise. You can't sin your way to hell is what I am saying once saved.

Hardened Heart:

Act_24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void of offence toward God, and toward men.

1Ti 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;


Jas 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

Jas 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
Jas 1:23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:

God is not hardening the Hearts of His Children. That is not what happens. I said we become "SELF-DECEIVED" God's position is to get the lost sheep back in the pen. A deceived person will hear lots of word, go to church, but not be a doer of the Word. They talk a good talk, but not following what they hear.

If your mouth is out of line with God, then you are Self deceived. I can pretend to be a godly man, but if I curse my wife out then something is wrong with me, there will be no power in my life.

Violating your conscience on a consistent bases numbs you from hearing God and being corrected. Meeting that co-worker for coffee who is pretty seems innocent enough, but it bugs my conscience. I ignore that and have coffee anyway because it's innocent. Already I have passed through my first defense of protection from sin and allowed something in that I should not have allowed. It won't be long before this is taken further.

Practice not violating your conscience. Go to bed every night with a clear conscience. If you do this, you open yourself to hearing the quit promptings and direction from the Holy Spirit. For example.....................

Lets say there are a pile of dishes in the sink. Your tired and think you should wash them before going to bed, but instead you decided to put them off for the next day. Once in bed those dishes are on your mind, but you think again that you can just do them in the morning. You left something on your conscience that does not seem like a big deal, but it really is because you violated your own conscience. You better believe the enemy has taken note of this, and now formulates other ways He can entice you to ignore those things on your conscience.

This is how we get into things that are painful and hard to get ride of in our life. Once that affair starts with my co-worker I then have heart strings attached and shared things that I should have never shared.

Self Deception comes in when I make excuses for seeing this Co-worker. After all, my wife is not loving anymore and God knows I am a man with needs. This is the point I am in serious trouble because what once bothered my conscience is now acceptable.

Once it becomes acceptable, not even the Lord can get through because He has already sent people my way, showed me things, and now I just have a good reason in my mind to keep the relationship. This is where Judgment must come, because after given all the benefit and information I did not judge myself. This type of judgment always heads towards physical sickness and death. It starts with money issues, loss of relationships I valued. We are told this death is so that the spirit might be saved.

Story:

A man that did praise and worship for us in Prison, and taught the word was about to be released. Through the years, God kept his wife for him and kids. God also set up a Pastor to take him in and make him assistant pastor in a big Word of faith type church. This man knew about obeying God, and believing God, and taught others how to do it. His dream of being a Pastor was right there with doors open to what God called him to do.


The wife wrote us this:
When He got home, He started with the Church, Got to preach on a regular basis, and was promoted. Things were going just great for him. He had some past bills though that were bugging him, and so His wife said they were standing on the Word to get them paid. He met with some of his old gang friends and the wife said this bother her and he admitted that He should not see them again. This was on his conscience. His wife said the cut it off for awhile but then started to see them again. It was not long that he figured that if he just did one more drug run, then all his bills would be caught up and he could focus his duties on the Church. It was just one run, real simple as all he had to do was drop the drugs off in exchange for money, something he did a lot of times before going to prison.

He went out to do that one run his wife said and someone found him the next morning with a bullet in the back of his head. It devastated His wife and children.

--------------------------
I was wondering where the Mercy of God was through all this, and the Lord told me this. Whom much is given, much is required. We are judged by the light we have and violate.

Practice not leaving even the small things on your conscience. Clean that room, clean that garage out you have promised weeks to clean out. Just live a life of keeping your conscience clear at all times and you will find that hearing God is super easy, and the enemy has no place to grab you by.

Mike.

 

[Angel]

Very interesting your answer Angel. It really leaves me thinking. I dont think God ever gets tired of waiting for us to come back to Him, but what if we take too long. Im really glad you found your way back. How did you do it?? I wander what would have happened if you had not constantly prayed. I know God knows what's in our hearts, but do we?? This really concerns me :,(

Well, when I was a young adult I allowed myself to be taken away to sin by hanging out with people who did drugs. I moved to another city but again got caught up in drugs. Wound up homeless and alone. I remember being in the mental hospital and crying out to God through Lamentations. I was so wounded in my heart, and I had known God in my youth. I fell in love with the Father. I prayed when I was 17 that I would not die without knowing the Father. I think that is a gift he gave me. You know your own nature, and if we don't know whats in our hearts, then there is something masking or meditating with it by some addiction.

 

[yunig320]

Yunig,

I don't know if we can know our heart is hardening...at least after a point. I suspect that there may be a tipping point beyond which our ego is so involved that we would find it nearly impossible to repent. I don't think, however that most of us are near that point, that takes a lot of hate.

In our Wesleyan tradition, we have an understanding of "prevenient grace," a grace given by God that exists prior to any human decision to recognize Christ as Savior. It's described in our Book of Discipline as

" ...the divine love that surrounds all humanity and precedes any and all of our conscious impulses. This grace prompts our first wish to please God, our first glimmer of understanding concerning God's will, and our 'first slight transient conviction' of having sinned against God. God's grace also awakens in us an earnest longing for deliverance from sin and death and moves us toward repentance and faith."

It is God at work in us in such a way that is usually enough to keep us from becoming so far from God that we aren't able to repent.

Wow! I had never heard of this before. This is a relief. It means that even if we walk away from God, there is always that something of Him inside of us that will not let us be totally lost right?? Thats what I get from it. It is a comforting thought

 

[yunig320]

Very interesting your answer Angel. It really leaves me thinking. I dont think God ever gets tired of waiting for us to come back to Him, but what if we take too long. Im really glad you found your way back. How did you do it?? I wander what would have happened if you had not constantly prayed. I know God knows what's in our hearts, but do we?? This really concerns me :,(

Well, when I was a young adult I allowed myself to be taken away to sin by hanging out with people who did drugs. I moved to another city but again got caught up in drugs. Wound up homeless and alone. I remember being in the mental hospital and crying out to God through Lamentations. I was so wounded in my heart, and I had known God in my youth. I fell in love with the Father. I prayed when I was 17 that I would not die without knowing the Father. I think that is a gift he gave me. You know your own nature, and if we don't know whats in our hearts, then there is something masking or meditating with it by some addiction.

Uhhmm.. I see what you are saying. This is definitely worthy of some thought And possibly some action to go with it too!.. Thanks a lot for sharing!