What is as bad as romes stuff?

[EDEN2004]

Hardly so! Say that the death bed convert was me. And then the Lord answered my [[mother's prayer]] for my healing. And what now would I do because I had just now been Born Again, and with Agape Love in my heart for my [New Master?]

If one does not know, it just says that they need to be Born Again in the first place as far as I see it! And a change in the law? 1 John 2:4 tell's one of the change!

[4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, [[is a liar, and the truth is not in him]].
[5] But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are [[in him]].

Have it as you desire!
--Elijah

Elijah, do you realize that the word "keep" does not mean obey. Here is the definition of keep:

keep/kēp/
Verb:
Have or retain possession of: "my father would keep the best for himself".
Synonyms:
verb. hold - maintain - retain - preserve

Or if you prefer Strong's:

H8104
שׁמר
shâmar
shaw-mar'
A primitive root; properly to hedge about (as with thorns), that is, guard; generally to protect, attend to, etc.: - beware, be circumspect, take heed (to self), keep (-er, self), mark, look narrowly, observe, preserve, regard, reserve, save (self), sure, (that lay) wait (for), watch (-man).

Notice that obeying or working are not in either definition.

I hope this helps.

 

[jasoncran]

when elijah can show me that paul and the acts15 council got it wrong on the sabbath then he has a point. the church is a primarily gentile not hebrew in nature.

 

[Elijah674]

Elijah, do you realize that the word "keep" does not mean obey. Here is the definition of keep:

keep/kēp/
Verb:
Have or retain possession of: "my father would keep the best for himself".
Synonyms:
verb. hold - maintain - retain - preserve

Or if you prefer Strong's:

H8104
שׁמר
shâmar
shaw-mar'
A primitive root; properly to hedge about (as with thorns), that is, guard; generally to protect, attend to, etc.: - beware, be circumspect, take heed (to self), keep (-er, self), mark, look narrowly, observe, preserve, regard, reserve, save (self), sure, (that lay) wait (for), watch (-man).

Notice that obeying or working are not in either definition.

I hope this helps.

:silly:silly

 

[wayseer]

when elijah can show me that paul and the acts15 council got it wrong on the sabbath then he has a point. the church is a primarily gentile not hebrew in nature.

The Church is more Jewish that it cares to admit.

 

[jasoncran]

The Church is more Jewish that it cares to admit.

yes i know that but the covenant that was given is most gentile in nature.

take acts 15 and compare it to the noahide laws. not a coincidence. the church btw isnt fully hebrew either in that most gentiles(im not and im shedding that thinking slowly but i wont go kosher nor do the shabat alot). we read the bible from our greek/gentile thinking instead of the ways the hebrews see it. i had an orthodox laughing when i said that the athiests ask where did cains wife come from?

 

[Elijah674]

when elijah can show me that paul and the acts15 council got it wrong on the sabbath then he has a point. the church is a primarily gentile not hebrew in nature.

+++++++++

OK Friend: Let me try again;)
Read just the verses below a couple times without me even saying anything. I will just highlite! But put EMPHASIS on the highlites, OK?


Acts 15

[1] And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye [[be circumcised after the manner of Moses,]] ye cannot be saved.
[2] When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about [[this question.]]
....

[4] And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
[5] But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to [[circumcise them]], and to [[command them to keep the law of Moses]].
[6] And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of [[this matter.]]


[7] And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

[8] And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
[9] And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
[10] Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

[11] But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
[12] Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.
[13] And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
....
[19] Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
[20] But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
[21] For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
[22] Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
[23] And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:

[24] Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, [[Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment]]:
[25] It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
[26] Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
[27] We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.
[28] For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

[29] That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.


OK: My turn:yes
If you read the verses you will find nothing there about the Ten Commandments. The only things were as said, Moses Law & Circumcism. And then ther were the verse 29 additions that were from Moses requirements.

Circumcism is easy to understand, but the Deut. 31:9-26 Inspiration of the Law that Moses wrote takes just a tad bit more study. Let me just give a couple verses that should help one to see perhaps? (with my highlites for emphasis)

Deut. 31
[9] And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.
[10] And Moses commanded them, saying, At the end of every seven years, in the solemnity of the year of release, in the feast of tabernacles,
[11] When all Israel is come to appear before the LORD thy God in the place which he shall choose, thou shalt read this law before all Israel in their hearing.
....(Again, this is call the book of Moses that he wrote. Not the Eternal ten Commandment's that Christ wrote.. also note the Ark above & where these laws of Moses were put as we go on.)

[23] And he gave Joshua the son of Nun a charge, and said, Be strong and of a good courage: for thou shalt bring the children of Israel into the land which I sware unto them: and I will be with thee.
[24] And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
[25] That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD,[[ saying,
[26] Take this book of the law, and put it in the side]] of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

See if you can get anything from that? Just forget all of the distraction from the christian's who just want to bash the post person!;) Matt. 10:25

--Elijah

 

[jasoncran]

+++++++++

OK Friend: Let me try again;)
Read just the verses below a couple times without me even saying anything. I will just highlite! But put EMPHASIS on the highlites, OK?


Acts 15

[1] And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye [[be circumcised after the manner of Moses,]] ye cannot be saved.
[2] When therefore Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and disputation with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, should go up to Jerusalem unto the apostles and elders about [[this question.]]
....

[4] And when they were come to Jerusalem, they were received of the church, and of the apostles and elders, and they declared all things that God had done with them.
[5] But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to [[circumcise them]], and to [[command them to keep the law of Moses]].
[6] And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of [[this matter.]]


[7] And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

[8] And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
[9] And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
[10] Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

[11] But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
[12] Then all the multitude kept silence, and gave audience to Barnabas and Paul, declaring what miracles and wonders God had wrought among the Gentiles by them.
[13] And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me:
....
[19] Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
[20] But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
[21] For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.
[22] Then pleased it the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas; namely, Judas surnamed Barsabas, and Silas, chief men among the brethren:
[23] And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia:

[24] Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, [[Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment]]:
[25] It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul,
[26] Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
[27] We have sent therefore Judas and Silas, who shall also tell you the same things by mouth.
[28] For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

[29] That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.


OK: My turn:yes
If you read the verses you will find nothing there about the Ten Commandments. The only things were as said, Moses Law & Circumcism. And then ther were the verse 29 additions that were from Moses requirements.

Circumcism is easy to understand, but the Deut. 31:9-26 Inspiration of the Law that Moses wrote takes just a tad bit more study. Let me just give a couple verses that should help one to see perhaps? (with my highlites for emphasis)

Deut. 31
[9] And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.
[10] And Moses commanded them, saying, At the end of every seven years, in the solemnity of the year of release, in the feast of tabernacles,
[11] When all Israel is come to appear before the LORD thy God in the place which he shall choose, thou shalt read this law before all Israel in their hearing.
....(Again, this is call the book of Moses that he wrote. Not the Eternal ten Commandment's that Christ wrote.. also note the Ark above & where these laws of Moses were put as we go on.)

[23] And he gave Joshua the son of Nun a charge, and said, Be strong and of a good courage: for thou shalt bring the children of Israel into the land which I sware unto them: and I will be with thee.
[24] And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished,
[25] That Moses commanded the Levites, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD,[[ saying,
[26] Take this book of the law, and put it in the side]] of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

See if you can get anything from that? Just forget all of the distraction from the christian's who just want to bash the post person!;) Matt. 10:25

--Elijah

the law of moses includes the ten commandments!the shabat isnt for you? you arent of isreal. you are and old gentile.

 

[Elijah674]

the law of moses includes the ten commandments!the shabat isnt for you? you arent of isreal. you are and old gentile.

Whatever? But there was not any pedigree Jew the day before Adam's first 7th Day Sabbath! The Earth's MEMORIAL! (BIRTH'day) Ps. 135:13

And are you to lax to quote scripture??

 

[Sinthesis]

And are you to lax to quote scripture??

Hbr 7:15 - And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
Hbr 7:16 - Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
Hbr 7:17 - For he testifieth, Thou [art] a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
Hbr 7:18 - For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
Hbr 7:19 - For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope [did]; by the which we draw nigh unto God.


Rom 13:8 ¶ Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom 13:9 - For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Rom 13:10 - Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love [is] the fulfilling of the law.​

I'm too lax to spoon feed an interpretation of said scripture.

 

[jasoncran]

so why didnt my dad or the sages mention that?

surely if it was for adam and he did it and men didnt after him god would have judged them for that. yet that isnt the case. the shabat would be already be known to the hebrews at sinai.

just like circumision was.

 

[Elijah674]

Hbr 7:15 - And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
Hbr 7:16 - Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
Hbr 7:17 - For he testifieth, Thou [art] a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
Hbr 7:18 - For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
Hbr 7:19 - For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope [did]; by the which we draw nigh unto God.


Rom 13:8 ¶ Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom 13:9 - For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if [there be] any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Rom 13:10 - Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love [is] the fulfilling of the law.
​

I'm too lax to spoon feed an interpretation of said scripture.

When you Matt. 25 Awaken check out what you penned in Rom 13:10 - Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love [is] the fulfilling of the law.

So when Christ said [IF] ye [[Love Me keep My COMMANDMENTS]]. He meant then all! James. 2:10!
And who does Love Him? Rev. 12:17 documents these ones only..
Rev. 12
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which [[keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ]]. (And that is the last Eccl. 3:15 repeat of 666 time period)


And the posting of scripture was mesnt for my other friend! But thanks anyway!;)

--Elijah