What is real Faith, by Martin Luther

[Danus]

Martin Luther's Definition of Faith:
An excerpt from
"An Introduction to St. Paul's Letter to the Romans,"
Luther's German Bible of 1522
by Martin Luther, 1483-1546
Translated by Rev. Robert E. Smith
**********************************************************

Faith is not what some people think it is. Their human dream
is a delusion. Because they observe that faith is not followed by
good works or a better life, they fall into error, even though they
speak and hear much about faith. ``Faith is not enough,'' they
say, ``You must do good works, you must be pious to be saved.''
They think that, when you hear the gospel, you start working,
creating by your own strength a thankful heart which says, ``I
believe.'' That is what they think true faith is. But, because
this is a human idea, a dream, the heart never learns anything
from it, so it does nothing and reform doesn't come from this
`faith,' either.

Instead, faith is God's work in us, that changes us and gives
new birth from God. (John 1:13). It kills the Old Adam and makes us
completely different people. It changes our hearts, our spirits,
our thoughts and all our powers. It brings the Holy Spirit with
it. Yes, it is a living, creative, active and powerful thing, this
faith. Faith cannot help doing good works constantly. It doesn't
stop to ask if good works ought to be done, but before anyone
asks, it already has done them and continues to do them without
ceasing. Anyone who does not do good works in this manner is an
unbeliever. He stumbles around and looks for faith and good
works, even though he does not know what faith or good works are.
Yet he gossips and chatters about faith and good works with many
words.

Faith is a living, bold trust in God's grace, so certain of
God's favor that it would risk death a thousand times trusting in it.
Such confidence and knowledge of God's grace makes you happy,
joyful and bold in your relationship to God and all creatures. The
Holy Spirit makes this happen through faith. Because of it, you
freely, willingly and joyfully do good to everyone, serve
everyone, suffer all kinds of things, love and praise the God who
has shown you such grace. Thus, it is just as impossible to
separate faith and works as it is to separate heat and light from
fire! Therefore, watch out for your own false ideas and guard
against good-for-nothing gossips, who think they're smart enough
to define faith and works, but really are the greatest of fools.
Ask God to work faith in you, or you will remain forever without
faith, no matter what you wish, say or can do.

http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/wittenberg/luther/luther-faith.txt

 

[Mike]

Good post, Danus. I can't think of anything in that statement I'd disagree with. These lines stood out to me:

It brings the Holy Spirit with
it. Yes, it is a living, creative, active and powerful thing, this
faith. Faith cannot help doing good works constantly. It doesn't
stop to ask if good works ought to be done, but before anyone
asks, it already has done them and continues to do them without
ceasing. Anyone who does not do good works in this manner is an
unbeliever.

I've always maintained that God gives us the capacity to have faith and this faith gives us the desire to do good works. They have always been a response, IMO. But I don't want to change the subject. Coming to faith means being a new creation; one that seeks to "be about the work of my Father".

Thanks for posting this. (and not just because my church bears his name ;))

 

[glorydaz]

Good post, Danus. I can't think of anything in that statement I'd disagree with. These lines stood out to me:


I've always maintained that God gives us the capacity to have faith and this faith gives us the desire to do good works. They have always been a response, IMO. But I don't want to change the subject. Coming to faith means being a new creation; one that seeks to "be about the work of my Father".

Thanks for posting this. (and not just because my church bears his name ;))

Amen, Ye shall know them by their fruits.

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

 

[Grubal Muruch]

Martin Luther's Definition of Faith:
An excerpt from
"An Introduction to St. Paul's Letter to the Romans,"
Luther's German Bible of 1522
by Martin Luther, 1483-1546
Translated by Rev. Robert E. Smith
**********************************************************

Faith is not what some people think it is. Their human dream
is a delusion. Because they observe that faith is not followed by
good works or a better life, they fall into error, even though they
speak and hear much about faith. ``Faith is not enough,'' they
say, ``You must do good works, you must be pious to be saved.''
They think that, when you hear the gospel, you start working,
creating by your own strength a thankful heart which says, ``I
believe.'' That is what they think true faith is. But, because
this is a human idea, a dream, the heart never learns anything
from it, so it does nothing and reform doesn't come from this
`faith,' either.

Instead, faith is God's work in us, that changes us and gives
new birth from God. (John 1:13). It kills the Old Adam and makes us
completely different people. It changes our hearts, our spirits,
our thoughts and all our powers. It brings the Holy Spirit with
it. Yes, it is a living, creative, active and powerful thing, this
faith. Faith cannot help doing good works constantly. It doesn't
stop to ask if good works ought to be done, but before anyone
asks, it already has done them and continues to do them without
ceasing. Anyone who does not do good works in this manner is an
unbeliever. He stumbles around and looks for faith and good
works, even though he does not know what faith or good works are.
Yet he gossips and chatters about faith and good works with many
words.

Faith is a living, bold trust in God's grace, so certain of
God's favor that it would risk death a thousand times trusting in it.
Such confidence and knowledge of God's grace makes you happy,
joyful and bold in your relationship to God and all creatures. The
Holy Spirit makes this happen through faith. Because of it, you
freely, willingly and joyfully do good to everyone, serve
everyone, suffer all kinds of things, love and praise the God who
has shown you such grace. Thus, it is just as impossible to
separate faith and works as it is to separate heat and light from
fire! Therefore, watch out for your own false ideas and guard
against good-for-nothing gossips, who think they're smart enough
to define faith and works, but really are the greatest of fools.
Ask God to work faith in you, or you will remain forever without
faith, no matter what you wish, say or can do.

http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/wittenberg/luther/luther-faith.txt

If Luther was saying, you must ask God for "initial" faith, then he was wrong...If he was saying, man must place his faith and be given the "faith of Christ" for salvation then he was right...All of humanity have a, God given free-will in which to choose, what we will believe...

 

[Danus]

If Luther was saying, you must ask God for "initial" faith, then he was wrong...If he was saying, man must place his faith and be given the "faith of Christ" for salvation then he was right...All of humanity have a, God given free-will in which to choose, what we will believe...

What do you think he's saying?

I'll tell you what he's not saying. He's not saying that those without faith, or those with a "said" faith, can not find real faith.

He's describing a real faith that comes from God and not from man. How does one find this faith? From God.

 

[Eventide]

Standing on the promises of God..

We need not find the answer from men (even men like Luther), but rather from simply hearing God's word..

These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

 

[Danus]

Re: Standing on the promises of God..

We need not find the answer from men (even men like Luther), but rather from simply hearing God's word..

These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

Well then, you just opted-out of making your own opinion as well. So no one is to talk about this and we'll just all go on our marry way? ssshhhhhh (faith is a secrete only between each man and God) ....don't talk or describe of it.

 

[Eventide]

Re: Standing on the promises of God..

Well then, you just opted-out of making your own opinion as well. So no one is to talk about this and we'll just all go on our marry way? ssshhhhhh (faith is a secrete only between each man and God) ....don't talk or describe of it.

Not sure I understand what you're talking about.. it's a simple biblical explanation of faith and what it actually looks like.. people being persuaded by God and embracing His promises.

 

[reba]

Re: Standing on the promises of God..

We need not find the answer from men (even men like Luther), but rather from simply hearing God's word..

These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

We all put our opinions in writing every day around here. Why not some of the "old" guys? Who here posts only scripture?

 

[Eventide]

Re: Standing on the promises of God..

We all put our opinions in writing every day around here. Why not some of the "old" guys? Who here posts only scripture?

I actually enjoy reading commentary from people (even Luther etc) although we must realize that it's just that.. the real deal comes from the word of God.. and obviously some men preach with an agenda so we to be extra careful with embracing the words of men rather than the word of God.

 

[reba]

Really nice Danus.. Nice to have some biblical sound positive, objective thoughts.
I do like a lot of what Mathew Henry has to say also



ET

I actually enjoy reading commentary from people (even Luther etc) although we must realize that it's just that.. the real deal comes from the word of God.. and obviously some men preach with an agenda so ween to be extra careful with embracing the words of men rather than the word of God.

Totally agree!

 

[Danus]

Really nice Danus.. Nice to have some biblical sound positive, objective thoughts.
I do like a lot of what Mathew Henry has to say also



ET

Totally agree!

Cool.

It's like a 500 year old bottle of Chablis.

What's really neat about it, is being able to relate to it, and the fact that this man's words are so old to us, yet he struggled with the same things we do, and this is his opinion from his many years of reading and studying the same book we have today, and it's as true to us as it was to him. It's a testament to the endurance of God's never ending truth. It strengthens my hope for the lost and aids to comfort me in the midst of my own salvation.

If Luther where alive today, he'd have posted this here. So I thought it fitting to honor him as well since he has something to say on the many topics being discussed. I'm hoping it might also inspire some to learn more about his life, and how God used him in his day.

Clearly God wants us to learn from each other, if we are to say that he does anything through us at all. He surly did with Martin Luther, and many others.

 

[childeye]

I see faith as belief or trust relative to God and so ones image of god is what is his faith. Everyone has an absolute but not evey absolute is the absolute. As Christ was sent by God as the True Image of God, he is the absolute.

The thing about freewill and works that really bugs me, is man imagines they are like God as if men can decide what Truth is for themselves rather than acknowledging that is ignorance. God is Holy and to have faith in God is to understand that man is corruptible and his corruption is in degrees being apart from God. That's why we have sin (seperation from God) which is reconciled through Christ's intercession, and that's why righteousness is by faith. Therefore faith is also trusting that what you put your faith in is true, and in our case it is the Truth of the personal character of the Eternal Spirit. This was the faith of Christ.

 

[Grubal Muruch]

Re: Standing on the promises of God..

I actually enjoy reading commentary from people (even Luther etc) although we must realize that it's just that.. the real deal comes from the word of God.. and obviously some men preach with an agenda so we to be extra careful with embracing the words of men rather than the word of God.

Amen to that

 

[Grubal Muruch]

What do you think he's saying?

I'll tell you what he's not saying. He's not saying that those without faith, or those with a "said" faith, can not find real faith.

He's describing a real faith that comes from God and not from man. How does one find this faith? From God.

All of humanity is born with an ability to "choose" what they will believe and what they will not believe in...Call it "free-will" or "free-choice" or whatever you desire...Throughout Scripture we see clearly that this is the case... There's no doubt about it...Except in the minds of men that can not see...

 

[Grubal Muruch]

What do you think he's saying?

I'll tell you what he's not saying. He's not saying that those without faith, or those with a "said" faith, can not find real faith.

He's describing a real faith that comes from God and not from man. How does one find this faith? From God.

I might add that, by you implying that "God gives us the faith" I assume your speaking of the "elect" is this not so?? Which is not Biblical by "any" means...

 

[glorydaz]

What do you think he's saying?

I'll tell you what he's not saying. He's not saying that those without faith, or those with a "said" faith, can not find real faith.

He's describing a real faith that comes from God and not from man. How does one find this faith? From God.

There are many aspects of faith. He is certainly talking about one - comparing false faith with real faith.
To talk about what he is not saying is to imply this is his entire understanding of faith. I don't know the entirety of Luther's belief, but I do know what the Word teaches. Personally, I wouldn't be too happy with someone who claimed I was not saying something, when I was only talking about one aspect of it.


The gospel is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth. We are persuaded and believe -our faith in Him. By our faith in Him we are justified (declared righteous) by the faith of Christ. Faith to faith.

For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Our faith in His blood.

Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

 

[Danus]

I might add that, by you implying that "God gives us the faith" I assume your speaking of the "elect" is this not so?? Which is not Biblical by "any" means...

Was I implying that? I meant to fanatically state it. So let me try it again.

God Gives US FAITH. God Gives of the FAITH, The very faith we need to have a relationship with him.

There. That's better.

 

[Grubal Muruch]

Was I implying that? I meant to fanatically state it. So let me try it again.

God Gives US FAITH. God Gives of the FAITH, The very faith we need to have a relationship with him.

There. That's better.

However, the faith you speak of,could just as easily believed in something else?? Because we "all" have a "free-choice" to believe what we will... God does not "force" us to believe...

 

[Danus]

Re: Standing on the promises of God..

We need not find the answer from men (even men like Luther), but rather from simply hearing God's word..

These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

Well then, you just opted-out of making your own opinion as well. So no one is to talk about this and we'll just all go on our marry way? ssshhhhhh (faith is a secrete only between each man and God) ....don't talk or describe of it.

Not sure I understand what you're talking about.. it's a simple biblical explanation of faith and what it actually looks like.. people being persuaded by God and embracing His promises.

What's in your heart that would make you speak like that to Eventide? He was making the very valid point that our opinions should always be backed up by Scripture. All men are fallible, but the Word of God never is.

If you're a man then you might as well not tell anyone about your faith, or what it's like to have faith, or try to teach about faith either if you are going to make a statement like..... "We need not find the answer from men"

However, Martin Luther was not just providing answers that God himself could not provide. He was quite aware of this. He knew full well that God did not NEED him to teach anyone anything. He said what he said, because we was instructed to do so in his own heart by God. He did not do what he did for the fun and joy of it. or for his own safety.

Those who understood Martin then and now, know exactly what he means with his every word of describing the faith as he did. Those who don't, don't. That's not to say they can't, yet they will not take the advise of Martin who is clearly pointing to God. Instead they will fumble over Martins words, argue with it, maybe dismiss it, and that's odd, since he's basically saying where to go to find what he is describing and has even agreed with you Eventide, not to simply take his word for it.


Faith is a living, bold trust in God's grace, so certain of
God's favor that it would risk death a thousand times trusting in it.
Such confidence and knowledge of God's grace makes you happy,
joyful and bold in your relationship to God and all creatures. The
Holy Spirit makes this happen through faith. Because of it, you
freely, willingly and joyfully do good to everyone, serve
everyone, suffer all kinds of things, love and praise the God who
has shown you such grace. Thus, it is just as impossible to
separate faith and works as it is to separate heat and light from
fire! Therefore, watch out for your own false ideas and guard
against good-for-nothing gossips, who think they're smart enough
to define faith and works, but really are the greatest of fools.
Ask God to work faith in you, or you will remain forever without
faith, no matter what you wish, say or can do.