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Bible Study Where do we go when we die?

Where do I go at death?

  • Heaven

    Votes: 8 80.0%

  • hell

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • pergatory

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • limbo

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • to the outer reaches of our knowledge

    Votes: 1 10.0%

  • soul sleep

    Votes: 1 10.0%
  • Total voters
    10

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Poet of Ephraim said:
We go to Sheol

The womb of the earth awaits those who sleep,
Pulling us into recesses of our deserved keep.
Enveloped by darkness or tormented with shame,
Or resting in great peace with those of good name.
But once there we can’t leave in any direction,
As chasms and angels serve as the protection.
And there we’ll all wait until time’s at its end,
To be spat out corrupted or gloriously born again.

Inspired by Luke 16:19-31, 2 Esdras 7:75-101, 1 Enoch 22

~Poet of Ephraim
Click to expand...


So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. For we walk by faith, not by sight. We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. 2 Corinthians 5:6-8


  • We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.





JLB
 
Doug Brents said:
I think the translators put the punctuation in the wrong place in the statement by Christ to the thief on the cross.

They put it as, “I tell you, ‘today you will be with me in paradise’”.

But I think it more appropriately should be, “I tell you today, ‘you will be with me in paradise’”.

Do you see the difference?

I do not believe that we go straight to Heaven when we die. When Christ comes back, He will not only gather the righteous living to Himself, but also the righteous dead from their graves. The righteous dead will not already be with Him.
Click to expand...
Of course I see the difference, and your way of understanding this and placing the very important comma, is not accepted by most theologians and the reason why is that Jesus never spoke about time. It's not a way that He would have stated what He did.

So, if we could get that out of the way, what exactly makes you believe as you do?
The problem I have with this idea is that we have a soul that is alive and living.
We have a spirit that is alive and living.

What happens to this soul and spirit when we die?
If it also dies, then maybe there's no life after death after all?

The resurrection will be for the body, not the soul and spirit - which continue to live on.

Any comment?


New International Version
Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

New Living Translation
And Jesus replied, “I assure you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

English Standard Version
And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

Berean Study Bible
And Jesus said to him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

Berean Literal Bible
And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise."

King James Bible
And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

New King James Version
And Jesus said to him, “Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

New American Standard Bible
And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

NASB 1995
And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.”

NASB 1977
And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.”

Amplified Bible
Jesus said to him, “I assure you and most solemnly say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

Christian Standard Bible
And he said to him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

Holman Christian Standard Bible
And He said to him, “I assure you: Today you will be with Me in paradise.”

American Standard Version
And he said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To-day shalt thou be with me in Paradise.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
But Yeshua said to him, “Amen, I say to you that today you shall be with me in Paradise.”

Contemporary English Version
Jesus replied, "I promise that today you will be with me in paradise."

Douay-Rheims Bible
And Jesus said to him: Amen I say to thee, this day thou shalt be with me in paradise.

English Revised Version
And he said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in Paradise.

Good News Translation
Jesus said to him, "I promise you that today you will be in Paradise with me."

GOD'S WORD® Translation
Jesus said to him, "I can guarantee this truth: Today you will be with me in paradise."

International Standard Version
Jesus told him, "I tell you with certainty, today you will be with me in Paradise."

Literal Standard Version
and Jesus said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”

NET Bible
And Jesus said to him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

New Heart English Bible
And he said to him, "Assuredly I tell you, today you will be with me in Paradise."

Weymouth New Testament
"I tell you in solemn truth," replied Jesus, "that this very day you shall be with me in Paradise."

World English Bible
Jesus said to him, "Assuredly I tell you, today you will be with me in Paradise."

Young's Literal Translation
and Jesus said to him, 'Verily I say to thee, To-day with me thou shalt be in the paradise.'
 
wondering said:
Of course I see the difference, and your way of understanding this and placing the very important comma, is not accepted by most theologians and the reason why is that Jesus never spoke about time. It's not a way that He would have stated what He did.

So, if we could get that out of the way, what exactly makes you believe as you do?
The problem I have with this idea is that we have a soul that is alive and living.
We have a spirit that is alive and living.

What happens to this soul and spirit when we die?
If it also dies, then maybe there's no life after death after all?

The resurrection will be for the body, not the soul and spirit - which continue to live on.

Any comment?
Click to expand...
First, from what I have read, the original language does not have anything that indicates one way or the other. But if you consider 1 Pet saying that Jesus went to “preach to the lost in Gehenna”, He did not return to Heaven until 40 days later. If that is the case, the the thief was not in paradise with Him “today”.

But since we cannot know for sure either way, it is just an interesting point of discussion, not something over which I will stress.

As for the eternal nature of the soul, that is certain. The soul does not die when the body does, not does it cease to exist after a time in either Heaven or Hell. Torment for the lost will be night and day for all eternity. Paradise with God in Heaven will also be eternal. We will have new bodies, spiritual bodies, when we are gathered by Jesus at His second coming. (See 1 Cor 15:50-54).

Honestly, I don’t know if our soul will leave time behind at the instant of death and we will meet Jesus at His return immediately (which seems unlikely), or if our soul will “sleep” as Paul puts it until the second coming (which seems more likely to me). Either way, we will be changed when Jesus comes again, and we will then exist eternally in Heaven or Hell without end.
 
Doug Brents said:
First, from what I have read, the original language does not have anything that indicates one way or the other. But if you consider 1 Pet saying that Jesus went to “preach to the lost in Gehenna”, He did not return to Heaven until 40 days later. If that is the case, the the thief was not in paradise with Him “today”.
Click to expand...

The bible was translated by very intelligent theologians and they did not place the comma after the word today, as evidenced by all the bible verses I posted.

Jesus going to preach to those in Gehenna....
What's important here is that Jesus returned to heaven after 40 days but He did not take the thief on the cross with Him but sent him to paradise.
It could be questioned if PARADISE here means heaven or if Luke 16 is meant....the holding place for those that were in Abraham's Bossom.
Which, BTW, is also called paradise.
Those in Abraham's bossom would not be released until the resurrection of Jesus and so the thief most probably went there and not to heaven.

Doug Brents said:
But since we cannot know for sure either way, it is just an interesting point of discussion, not something over which I will stress.
Click to expand...

Agreed.

Doug Brents said:
As for the eternal nature of the soul, that is certain. The soul does not die when the body does, not does it cease to exist after a time in either Heaven or Hell. Torment for the lost will be night and day for all eternity. Paradise with God in Heaven will also be eternal. We will have new bodies, spiritual bodies, when we are gathered by Jesus at His second coming. (See 1 Cor 15:50-54).
Click to expand...

OK. So if the soul does not die - where does it go after death?

Doug Brents said:
Honestly, I don’t know if our soul will leave time behind at the instant of death and we will meet Jesus at His return immediately (which seems unlikely), or if our soul will “sleep” as Paul puts it until the second coming (which seems more likely to me). Either way, we will be changed when Jesus comes again, and we will then exist eternally in Heaven or Hell without end.
Click to expand...
Paul also states that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
The priests I've spoken to believe that we go to be immediately where we belong.
It makes the most sense to me,,,but, as you've stated, it's nothing to stress over.
I do find, however, that it makes more sense and God seems to be a sensible God.
 
It seems that no one really knows where paradise is, so wherever it is, is any one's guess.
I like to believe that when Jesus takes hold of you, he won't let go, ever.
 
The Bible says it like this in Romans 8:38-39: “I am convinced that nothing can ever separate us from his love. Death can’t, and life can’t. The angels won’t, and all the powers of hell itself cannot keep God’s love away. Our fears for today, our worries about tomorrow, or where we are — high above the sky, or in the deepest ocean — nothing will ever be able to separate us from the love of God demonstrated by our Lord Jesus Christ when he died for us” (TLB).

That’s good news. When you put your hand in God’s hand, he grabs it and won’t let go. God holds on to you with all he has.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
The Bible says it like this in Romans 8:38-39: “I am convinced that nothing can ever separate us from his love. Death can’t, and life can’t. The angels won’t, and all the powers of hell itself cannot keep God’s love away. Our fears for today, our worries about tomorrow, or where we are — high above the sky, or in the deepest ocean — nothing will ever be able to separate us from the love of God demonstrated by our Lord Jesus Christ when he died for us” (TLB).

That’s good news. When you put your hand in God’s hand, he grabs it and won’t let go. God holds on to you with all he has.
Click to expand...
Hi Rollo
I agree with you that God never lets go.

But can we let go?

I say we can.
Paul says we can.
Jesus says we can.
 
Doug Brents said:
I am not really sure where the soul goes. My guesses are just that, educated guesses.

But I am sure that the soul is eternal. That one thing from Scripture I do find for sure.
Click to expand...
Could it be better than an educated guess?
Paul said when Jesus comes back the ones that remain (those alive on the earth) will be taken up and then the dead will follow.
This clearly means bodily.

John sees the saints already in heaven in Revelation.

Even if we do not go directly to heaven....when we wake up it will seem as though it happened suddenly.

Some Christian denominations believe in soul sleep. I just have a difficult time believing that the soul could sleep.

The soul is eternal, as you've stated, and the spirit is eternal.

Luke also states that there is a resting place. I should say that JESUS said this since it was in story He told.
Lazarus and the Rich Man....
 
wondering said:
Could it be better than an educated guess?
Paul said when Jesus comes back the ones that remain (those alive on the earth) will be taken up and then the dead will follow.
This clearly means bodily.

John sees the saints already in heaven in Revelation.

Even if we do not go directly to heaven....when we wake up it will seem as though it happened suddenly.



Some Christian denominations believe in soul sleep. I
just have a difficult time believing that the soul could sleep.

The soul is eternal, as you've stated, and the spirit is eternal.

Luke also states that there is a resting place. I should say that JESUS said this since it was in story He told.
Lazarus and the Rich Man....
Click to expand...
Lazarus and the rich man is a parable
"Even if we do not go directly to heaven....when we wake up it will seem as though it happened suddenly."
You have doubts.
Get rid of them.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
Lazarus and the rich man is a parable
"Even if we do not go directly to heaven....when we wake up it will seem as though it happened suddenly."
You have doubts.
Get rid of them.
Click to expand...
Yes, it sounds like I have doubts...but I don't.
I've said that the soul and spirit are alive and they remain so after death.

Some theologians think Lazarus and the Rich Man is not a parable.
 
wondering said:
Yes, it sounds like I have doubts...but I don't.
I've said that the soul and spirit are alive and they remain so after death.

Some theologians think Lazarus and the Rich Man is not a parable.
Click to expand...
Yes, some theologians do press for attention, and saying this is not a parable is a good way to get attention.
 
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