Bible Study Where In Heaven Do Christians Go When They Die.

[Chopper]

I have found that most Christians don't know anything about this topic other than we go to heaven when we die. Part of my studies in the Scriptures each morning is the blessed Book of Revelation. One of my early hero's of Bible exposition after I got saved was and still is, Dr. John MacArthur.

Quite a while ago I purchased his two volume commentary on Revelation and had never studied the entire two volumes until recently. The following information is mostly his, I'll try and use quotation marks to indicate Dr. MacArthur's views to separate them from mine.

Revelation 21:2 "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

Now, what we have to realize is that God has destroyed the heaven and earth that we know exists now. God has created a new heaven and earth. There is a heavenly Jerusalem that in no way is connected with the earthly Jerusalem where David was King and the Jerusalem of the New Testament.

Notice that this New Jerusalem was already with God in heaven, protected from the destruction of the present heaven and earth. Once God creates the new heaven and earth, He can, as Dr. MacArthur says, "The New Jerusalem, which will come down to the new earth, that City will be the bond between the new earth and the new heaven."

What most Christians don't know, and is the purpose of this thread is, there always has been a particular place in heaven where the redeemed in Christ Jesus have all gone when they died and went to heaven. Just to say when asked where the Christian went after they died, "O they went to heaven" Just never made sense to me.

Dr. MacArthur says, "The holy city, new Jerusalem, is an actual city. The new Jerusalem is not heaven, but heaven's capital." John Gill who has written about the size of this Holy City, "And he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs; or fifteen hundred miles; a monstrously large city indeed! such an one as never was upon earth; see Eze_48:35 and which shows, that this is not to be understood literally, but mystically; and intends the capaciousness of it, here being room enough for all the twelve tribes of Israel; that is, for all the elect of God; for as in Christ's Father's house, so in this kingdom state of his, there will be many mansions, or dwelling places, enough for all his people. This city will hold them all. The Jews (h) say of Jerusalem, that in time to come it shall be so enlarged, as to reach to the gates of Damascus, yea, to the throne of glory."

Dr. MacArthur writes what my thoughts are on the purpose of this thread a lot better than I would be able. "All of heaven is currently contained in the new Jerusalem; it is separate from the from the present universe, which is tainted by sin. Believers who die go to the "heavenly Jerusalem," where Jesus has gone before them to prepare a place for them (John 14:1-3). But when God creates the new heaven and the new earth, the new Jerusalem will descend into the midst of that Holy new universe (21:10), and serve as the dwelling place of the redeemed for all eternity.

I hope this will give each of you a new love and hope with a better understanding of where exactly we go when we pass from this old sinful life to our eternal Heavenly home. As Bill Gaither says, "See you at the House".

 

[smaller]

The "City" is constructed of people. God Himself by His Spirit MOVES through the City, which is the people.

Rev. 21:
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.

Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

There is a processing that transpires prior to entry. Our hearts are opened and cleansed, completely, by The Spirit of Christ, washing away (or firing, if you prefer) every aspect of our mind and heart that is not worthy. And it's all forgotten and seems as if it is nothing. And it is nothing, by comparison.

Rev. 21:
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

There is an acquaintance time, prior to City entry, when those who passed on before us come to greet us. And celebration, "like" a Divine Musical or Festival, prior to joining the City. Where we then know what it is to live in transparency, without our 'guards up.' There is no guard. Everything is beautifully transparent and clear. We do not currently know what it is "like" to live in this kind of "openness." Robed with Heavenly Garb, of real love.

This City will be on the New Earth, and we will go in and out of it, in a New Body, as One, with Him.

I would not place this "New Earth" as some type of 'constellation' body set into this current universe.

It is an Eternal City in an Eternal Environment with Eternal Dwellers. There is no "time" as we know it.

 

[reba]

Some verses left out for space ...

Heb 11:8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
Heb 11:9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
Heb 11:10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
after speaking of the wonderful faith of our forefathers the Word goes on
Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Heb 12:12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
Heb 12:13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
Heb 12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.
Heb 12:18 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
Heb 12:19 And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
Heb 12:20 (For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:
Heb 12:21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake
Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

 

[LovethroughDove]

Believers who die go to the "heavenly Jerusalem," where Jesus has gone before them to prepare a place for them (John 14:1-3).

John 14:2 In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you.

Jeremiah 17:10 "I the Lord search the heart and examine the mind, to reward a man according to his conduct, according to what his deeds deserve."

The heavenly Jerusalem is where God resides, but there will be a specific place for each of us who have made it there. I'm sure we can congregate with others, or go to the place Jesus specifically prepares for "You".

 

[iLOVE]

The one who is victorious I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will they leave it. I will write on them the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on them my new name. Revelation 3:12 NIV

 

[Chopper]

The "City" is constructed of people. God Himself by His Spirit MOVES through the City, which is the people.

Rev. 21:
17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.

Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

There is a processing that transpires prior to entry. Our hearts are opened and cleansed, completely, by The Spirit of Christ, washing away (or firing, if you prefer) every aspect of our mind and heart that is not worthy. And it's all forgotten and seems as if it is nothing. And it is nothing, by comparison.

Rev. 21:
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

There is an acquaintance time, prior to City entry, when those who passed on before us come to greet us. And celebration, "like" a Divine Musical or Festival, prior to joining the City. Where we then know what it is to live in transparency, without our 'guards up.' There is no guard. Everything is beautifully transparent and clear. We do not currently know what it is "like" to live in this kind of "openness." Robed with Heavenly Garb, of real love.

This City will be on the New Earth, and we will go in and out of it, in a New Body, as One, with Him.

I would not place this "New Earth" as some type of 'constellation' body set into this current universe.

It is an Eternal City in an Eternal Environment with Eternal Dwellers. There is no "time" as we know it.

Thank you Smaller for that wonderful addition to this thread. I really, really appreciate you taking of your time to respond with such a biblical response. It's no wonder that I love you Brother/friend.

 

[Chopper]

Some verses left out for space ...

Heb 11:8 By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.
Heb 11:9 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:
Heb 11:10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
after speaking of the wonderful faith of our forefathers the Word goes on
Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Heb 12:12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
Heb 12:13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
Heb 12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Heb 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
Heb 12:16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
Heb 12:17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.
Heb 12:18 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
Heb 12:19 And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
Heb 12:20 (For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:
Heb 12:21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake
Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

Oh Reba, how do I thank such and old friend as you for responding with so many valuable Scriptures that speak so well to our thread. I'm almost in tears over the value of those Verses. You are such a good friend with a great heart for God....I can't believe that in our new eternal home, Angels will reside with us. I really don't have any real theology on that, other than to say, I can't wait! Won't it be great?

Thank you my dear, dear Reba for your concern and spiritual love for me. I have never met a woman of God with such spiritual love for others. And!! You have a boldness to mix rebuke with your love anytime anyone steps out of line, I honor you for your stand for the Lord.

 

[Chopper]

John 14:2 In my Father's house are many rooms; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you.

Jeremiah 17:10 "I the Lord search the heart and examine the mind, to reward a man according to his conduct, according to what his deeds deserve."

The heavenly Jerusalem is where God resides, but there will be a specific place for each of us who have made it there. I'm sure we can congregate with others, or go to the place Jesus specifically prepares for "You".

My dear friend Dove, thank you so very much for adding those thoughts and valuable Scriptures to our thread. John 14:2 is so accurate to our thinking about this place where Jesus is busy preparing a wonderful, unbelievable, room or dwelling place for you in our Heavenly Home. Sometimes it seems impossible that the Son of God, after the beating and torture of the cross would even continue to forgive all my sins and prepare a place for me in His New Jerusalem, His and my home. Oh Dove, I just praise and honor our Savior.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I have found that most Christians don't know anything about this topic other than we go to heaven when we die. Part of my studies in the Scriptures each morning is the blessed Book of Revelation. One of my early hero's of Bible exposition after I got saved was and still is, Dr. John MacArthur.

Quite a while ago I purchased his two volume commentary on Revelation and had never studied the entire two volumes until recently. The following information is mostly his, I'll try and use quotation marks to indicate Dr. MacArthur's views to separate them from mine.

Revelation 21:2 "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

Now, what we have to realize is that God has destroyed the heaven and earth that we know exists now. God has created a new heaven and earth. There is a heavenly Jerusalem that in no way is connected with the earthly Jerusalem where David was King and the Jerusalem of the New Testament.

Notice that this New Jerusalem was already with God in heaven, protected from the destruction of the present heaven and earth. Once God creates the new heaven and earth, He can, as Dr. MacArthur says, "The New Jerusalem, which will come down to the new earth, that City will be the bond between the new earth and the new heaven."

What most Christians don't know, and is the purpose of this thread is, there always has been a particular place in heaven where the redeemed in Christ Jesus have all gone when they died and went to heaven. Just to say when asked where the Christian went after they died, "O they went to heaven" Just never made sense to me.

Dr. MacArthur says, "The holy city, new Jerusalem, is an actual city. The new Jerusalem is not heaven, but heaven's capital." John Gill who has written about the size of this Holy City, "And he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs; or fifteen hundred miles; a monstrously large city indeed! such an one as never was upon earth; see Eze_48:35 and which shows, that this is not to be understood literally, but mystically; and intends the capaciousness of it, here being room enough for all the twelve tribes of Israel; that is, for all the elect of God; for as in Christ's Father's house, so in this kingdom state of his, there will be many mansions, or dwelling places, enough for all his people. This city will hold them all. The Jews (h) say of Jerusalem, that in time to come it shall be so enlarged, as to reach to the gates of Damascus, yea, to the throne of glory."

Dr. MacArthur writes what my thoughts are on the purpose of this thread a lot better than I would be able. "All of heaven is currently contained in the new Jerusalem; it is separate from the from the present universe, which is tainted by sin. Believers who die go to the "heavenly Jerusalem," where Jesus has gone before them to prepare a place for them (John 14:1-3). But when God creates the new heaven and the new earth, the new Jerusalem will descend into the midst of that Holy new universe (21:10), and serve as the dwelling place of the redeemed for all eternity.

I hope this will give each of you a new love and hope with a better understanding of where exactly we go when we pass from this old sinful life to our eternal Heavenly home. As Bill Gaither says, "See you at the House".

Dr. John MacArthur says that the shed blood of Christ on the cross has nothing to do with our salvation.
It is well documented that this is what he continues to preach.
I. for one, wouldn't listen to a word he says.

 

[smaller]

Dr. John MacArthur says that the shed blood of Christ on the cross has nothing to do with our salvation.
It is well documented that this is what he continues to preach.
I. for one, wouldn't listen to a word he says.

Some stuff he has is good. Some not. Just like everyone else.

In chopper's behalf, you'll probably be pleased to know that there will not be any doctrinal arguments on the other side of the cross, or any difficulties with perceptions. Transparency cleans up everything. I'd like to say each and every one of the things in our own lives plays some kind of role, but would maybe describe that as "not personal" on the ill side of the ledgers. More like a spiritual database of a massive amount of subjectivity that has some type of Divine purpose, this vanity of present life. I like to image it as God being able to make not only good, but Perfect, of said vanity, and it will have shown it's purpose, if for no other reason, to show God's Superiority over "all things," with His Hands upon them. In many ways New Jerusalem is like God's Jewel. And in His Storehouse, He has many treasures to be examined. Beyond what we can even think of or conceive of, presently.

 

[younglite]

There is no teacher who teaches everything correctly. John M. is no exception. I even look over my old sermons, and say, "Yikes! I used to teach THAT??!"

I have taught for years that hell (hades) is a current holding place until the final judgment. As we see in the parable of the rich man and Lazarus, it is a terrible place. But hell is not the lake of fire. It is not the final place for Satan, his demons and unbelievers. Hell itself will be thrown into a lake of fire. Rev 20:14-15.

But where is this "particular place in heaven" found in Scripture? This is new to me, and I thought I had pretty much heard it all, though I'm always open to learning new things.

I also agree there will be a new heaven and earth. I agree the New Jerusalem will be our larger dwelling place of many dwelling places. But as far as it being the bond between the new heaven and earth? Where is this in Scripture?

Peace.

 

[Chopper]

Rollo, that's not true. You'd better go to his website and see what he really said because you are spreading false information.

 

[Chopper]

Rollo, that's not true. You'd better go to his website and see what he really said because you are spreading false information. Look folks, my focus is on the New Jerusalem, not Dr. MacArthur. Please save your comments to the theme of the OP. Be very careful how you think and speak about another man of God who has served the Lord with noble intentions. Perfect? No, and neither are you.

 

[LovethroughDove]

I wanted to add a little tidbit about "a place" that Jesus prepares. My best friend since I was eleven years old says she doesn't believe in God. She had this cat who was literally like her baby, since she and her husband don't want children. The cat died recently and she was devastated! The one thing I know about Jesus, is he is so loving! I told my friend about Jesus going ahead to prepare and place for her and that I know 100% that this place will include her beloved cat. Do I think my friend knows this? Maybe she didn't, but now she knows. That little cat was a glimpse to the love God has for her.

 

[Chopper]

I wanted to add a little tidbit about "a place" that Jesus prepares. My best friend since I was eleven years old says she doesn't believe in God. She had this cat who was literally like her baby, since she and her husband don't want children. The cat died recently and she was devastated! The one thing I know about Jesus, is he is so loving! I told my friend about Jesus going ahead to prepare and place for her and that I know 100% that this place will include her beloved cat. Do I think my friend knows this? Maybe she didn't, but now she knows. That little cat was a glimpse to the love God has for her.

A lot of Christians don't agree with me but I believe that our loving Jesus has made a way for special pets to be with us in our new home. There is no debate on whether or not animals will be there, rather than God creating new animals for the Kingdom, I believe He will resurrect that special pet. No scripture, boo hoo, just saying.

 

[reba]

you got guts Chopper

 

[SpagLard]

There is no debate on whether or not animals will be there, rather than God creating new animals for the Kingdom, I believe He will resurrect that special pet. No scripture, boo hoo, just saying.

The Bible does contain clues that the reincarnated pets will have to become vegetarian pacifists first though

Isaiah 11:6-9
6 The wolf will live with the lamb, the leopard will lie down with the goat, the calf and the lion and the yearling together; and a little child will lead them.
7 The cow will feed with the bear, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox.
8 The infant will play near the hole of the cobra, and the young child put his hand into the viper's nest.
9 They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the waters cover the sea.

 

[Chopper]

I thought it would be wise to apologize to Rollo Tamasi for my quick response to his statement about not liking John MacArthur. I'm sorry Rollo that I answered so quickly and not really in a loving manner to you, my dear Brother, I'm sorry.

It's been a long time since I went over MacArthur's theology on the Blood of Jesus that he made in the middle 70s. in which he puts more emphasis on the death of his body than the Blood for the forgiveness of our sins. Most solid teachers of the Word of God including myself believe that MacArthur is in error. The problem is, and still exists as far as I know, that he refuses to admit that his statements to a member were wrong. Perhaps pride is in his way.

Dr. John MacArthur is a great Pastor/teacher. I have followed his teachings for years and never found anything that was against the Word of God. This unfortunate error in his theology marks everything that He teaches. Just like how Rollo responded, "Dr. John MacArthur says that the shed blood of Christ on the cross has nothing to do with our salvation.
It is well documented that this is what he continues to preach.
I. for one, wouldn't listen to a word he says." Rollo is right, and his statement about what MacArthur teaches is true. What bothered me was that he said, "I for one, wouldn't listen to a word he says."

When I studied what MacArthur said, I could see that he was trying to seek a balance between Christ's Blood, and the death of His body having an equal function in providing Salvation for the world. I personally believe that the shedding of Christ's Blood, according to the Scriptures is most important.

I still believe that because Dr. MacArthur is a highly educated man in the original languages, history of Israel, and New Testament theology, he may have seen something about the sacrifice that Christ, in His body, went thru, might have seen a sacrificial element in that death. Was his theology on the Blood of Jesus wrong? Yes, without a doubt. Am I going to throw out all his other teachings and theology? No. I have, over the years learned very valuable theology from the man. Do I agree with all that he teaches? Certainly not. I do not adhere or teach his theology on, lets say the Pentecostal movement. He believes that "tongues" are not for today, I disagree.

Ok folks, I repent of how quickly, in the flesh, I was, in my response to Rollo Tamasi. And if anyone thought ill of my response to him, I'm sorry. I try to live above the energy of the flesh, and respond being led by the Spirit of God....I love you all, and especially you Rollo in this incident....

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Hi Chopper, I always say the wrong thing at the wrong time.
Sorry.

 

[Sinthesis]

I learn a lot from people with whom I disagree in some areas, Dr. John MacArthur included.