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Who do you think has control of our weather?

Kathi said:
God is in control of all things, including the weather, and through His providence, provides for and protects His children, but He also ordains or permits Satan, demons, and mankind to exercise their limited will to commit acts of sin, evil, and wickedness. These same beings are fully responsible for any and all man-made disasters and tragedies they cause. We know that God has ordained whatsoever comes to pass (Ephesians 1:11; Romans 11:36), and therefore His invisible hand is in our pain, even though He cannot sin or be the perpetrator of evil (James 1:13-17).

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/weather-Satan.html#ixzz2saZsm9YN
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Actually He's not in control of everything (even Proverbs 18:21 says life and death (and then Deut 30:19 with blessing and cursing) are in YOUR tongue, not His)).

He gave all His authority on the Earth to Adam in Genesis 1 and Satan won it from him and had it until Jesus took it and gave it back to us again to share with Him.
People will say prove it, Satan never had authority on the Earth! But the Scripture says Jesus was tempted by him when Satan said he had all the kingdoms of the world and would give them to him. Yes Satan is a liar, but the Holy Spirit says Jesus was tempted - He can't be tempted by a lie.
If God were in control of everything, then how do the wicked people who work for the Devil prosper while Believers at large do not? Surely God would give to the Believers not to the wicked. You don't need to have an IQ higher than 25 to know this is true.
If God were in control, you are holding Him responsible for every rape that's ever happened, for every instance of autism, for every sickness and for every disease. Follow that out, and you see that you have Jesus SINNING because He rebels against the Father's will and HEALS people who come to Him of everything. Now how is Jesus rebelling against the Father's will by healing those He has already afflicted by sickness and disease? That doesn't even begin to make a little bit of sense...

Additionally, you are blaming Him as well for every birth defect, every murder...I mean, why is God holding Cain responsible for murdering Abel when you say God ordained that murder? Is not God then unjust? It's preposterous! Blasphemous!

No, the Devil comes to STEAL, KILL AND DESTROY, and he comes to all, especially the Believers ( who are the ones with all the authority) so that they in their ignorance, invent traditions of men to explain their problems and make the Word of God of none effect in their lives...
It's what happened when Jesus came on the scene - the ones that should have been preaching what Jesus was preaching were preaching how awful everyone was and made up all kinds of extra rules that God never commanded and came up with ridiculous notions of where their problems came from and all the time preached that God would do awful things to people and so on and so on. Whereas Jesus came and preached the Blessing, and that God loved them and they could have what He had with the Father.
ALL authority and power in the Earth has been given to us, Jesus said so. So if you want to see things change, the buck stops with YOU. See also Joshua 1:8.
 
Evil can only operate in the sphere in which God ALLOWS evil to operate in.

God allowing evil is how we reconcile a God who is ultimate control of everything and a devil who exercises his control over various situations and matters.

"10 So Pilate *said to Him, “You do not speak to me? Do You not know that I have authority to release You, and I have authority to crucify You?”11 Jesus answered, “You would have no authority over Me, unless it had been given you from above..." (John 19:10-11 NASB)
 
The Psalms even say that the Earth God has given to men, which is where Adam got the authority, and then the rest of what I pointed out from the Scriptures.
 
TheCurseoftheRodain said:
... #2 part of Jesus' unique mission to go to and through the cross. What I put forth above is still valid.
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It is (mostly) valid. But as I said, we need to reconcile what you said with what Kathie said. The scriptures do that for us. Evil can only move freely in the part of the rat maze God has allowed it to do that. And believers do have tremendous authority over evil where that evil can move freely about.
 
No God does not allow evil. To allow is say that God is responsible for it. David says in the Psalms that if you see someone committing a sin and YOU don't speak up against it, YOU are just as guilty as the one who committed the sin. Does evil = sin? Of course it does. So for you to say that God sits back and "allows" evil, though He isn't doing it directly, is to accuse God of doing it to you and it is to accuse God of sinning against you.
Again, if He did, you would have to credit Him with all the evil deeds ever done. You would also be laying at His feet every rape, every murder, every crime, etc, and again, if that is the case, how can He be just by then holding mankind responsible for those evil deeds? These things obviously do not add up, but rather, what I put forth in #24 above does make faith and sense.
He does not allow evil, He had to allow for the possibility for evil to happen so that there can be actual free will and love. Otherwise we're just all robots.
It all goes back to Satan getting Adam to commit high treason against God by eating the fruit that Adam ate with full knowledge of what He was doing. That one act caused sin and death and evil to enter the Earth and what was the Blessing in Adam's hands now became the curse in Satan's hands. He is the source of EVERYTHING that steals from you, kills things in your life or destroys things in your life. Does evil fall into that category? Do storms? Does bad weather? Of course it all does.
Whereas Jesus said, after saying that, that HE came that WE might have LIFE, and that more abundantly. So whatever brings LIFE into your life, or ZOE (the life of God) is from God.
It is also says in James 1:13 that God does not tempt anyone.
So to clear up, God is not "allowing" or creating or bringing to anyone anything but life, and the THIEF, the Devil, is the one who is stealing, killing and destroying.

The sooner you get that cleared up the sooner you will start to see your Father clearly and for Who He is (only doing good to you, and never allowing evil) and you can turn and resist and shut down everything the Devil is sending your way in the form of whatever steals, kills or destroys.
The DEVIL is the problem, NOT God. To get everything unclogged prayerwise, I would repent of accusing Him of causing evil in Believer's lives.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
But now I'm offended...but I guess that doesn't matter since I'm a man, lol.

To be politically correct I guess we should call them spiraly thingys.
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directional spirally thingys. we don't want to offend the leftists either. typhoons turn to the left and cause more damage.lol
 
and god brought evil unto isreal. I would say god does uses evil for his glory. it means judgement there. god could stop satan any second and killed adam and eve at the fall and satan. why didn't he if he didn't allow evil?
 
God is not allowing evil because of the lines of authority, just as He is not "allowing" good. He is not in charge of things down here - we are, the Church. It's the Devil who has worked ceaselessly to convince the Church otherwise, so that he can run amuck doing whatever and everything gets blamed on God.
Judgement on a nation's decisions are different. They are the same as someone choosing to touch a hot pot - when someone gets burned, do we say "God allowed that evil to teach that person?" of course not, that's absurd - the person made a decision and they received the bad consequences of that decision. Or better I suppose would be choosing to borrow money instead of ask God for it and get it through the Blessing of the Lord - that nation will experience the problems that debt brings. Or if the nation decides to partner with an evil nation, they will open the door for the Devil to get in because of that choice and whatever the nation deserves for what they help that evil nation do.
When a nation decides to murder babies that nation opens itself up to the judgement for that crime, as well as giving a place for the Devil. Same with any decision a nation makes, whether they be Israel, the USA or Australia...whatever. Every decision carries good or bad consequences, as well as judgements.
 
TheCurseoftheRodain said:
God is not allowing evil because of the lines of authority, just as He is not "allowing" good. He is not in charge of things down here - we are, the Church. It's the Devil who has worked ceaselessly to convince the Church otherwise, so that he can run amuck doing whatever and everything gets blamed on God.
Judgement on a nation's decisions are different. They are the same as someone choosing to touch a hot pot - when someone gets burned, do we say "God allowed that evil to teach that person?" of course not, that's absurd - the person made a decision and they received the bad consequences of that decision. Or better I suppose would be choosing to borrow money instead of ask God for it and get it through the Blessing of the Lord - that nation will experience the problems that debt brings. Or if the nation decides to partner with an evil nation, they will open the door for the Devil to get in because of that choice and whatever the nation deserves for what they help that evil nation do.
When a nation decides to murder babies that nation opens itself up to the judgement for that crime, as well as giving a place for the Devil. Same with any decision a nation makes, whether they be Israel, the USA or Australia...whatever. Every decision carries good or bad consequences, as well as judgements.
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really,? god has to save man? he worries if man will obey him? uhm no to both. he is not obligated to save you nor me. he choose to. we are his. he choose us. we don't say yes to him of our own free will. whom made you love hiM?
john says we love him because HE loved us first! if god didn't first choose us. we would NEVER, ever love god. finally. god says I give you the will to both to good and to be able to do it. its all from him. we merely say yes to that, but even that yes at first came from the first time we were touched by him.

I have a Calvinistic leaning.i do believe in the idea of some form of tulip. total depravity, unmerited grace, limited atonement, irrestable grace and perserverance of the saints.

where I mainly differ on that is the last and the idea of we have no will or limited will, but we must first have been touched by god to make the choice of now. if he didn't choose us, we wont choose him. god may call us but not all of us will say yes. some will reject him, when that happens all those curses are sign to those that did repent of how blessed we are that we wont be in hell. that is what I meant by evil is used for his glory.

satan is allowed by god to do what he did. god set that up. did god create the tree of knowledge? or did satan? the answer is god.
 
Hey Jason,
Paul answered that in Romans when he posited whether we should say that we should sin more because then God can make grace abound more, and he criticized that thinking. It is the same to say that God allows Satan to carry out his evil plans against us, when in reality, whenever Jesus, as the Son of Man, ran up against the Devil, He shut him down and cast him out. He didn't allow the Devil to take His life either, but rather He said HE laid it down when and where HE chose. Then He gave us all the same rights and privileges and authority He had, which is what Adam had at the beginning. So you see, you have authority over Satan totally, in every way and in every place.
The Devil is called a Thief, a thief will steal, kill and destroy in someone's life until that someone enforces the law on them or uses a weapon against them or shuts them down somehow.
And yes, God has to do what God has already said in His written Word, His covenant. Otherwise, He would have to cease to exist. Read Psalm 89:34. God has to perform the oath He has sworn to us. He can only treat Believers according to the terms of the New Covenant, and nothing else can He do, and He cannot refuse it. He keeps His Word brother. If you don't believe that, we cannot even have this discussion, because you have been spoiled by man's vain philosophies and traditions which make the Word of God of none effect in your life (Colossians 1).
 
TheCurseoftheRodain said:
Hey Jason,
Paul answered that in Romans when he posited whether we should say that we should sin more because then God can make grace abound more, and he criticized that thinking. It is the same to say that God allows Satan to carry out his evil plans against us, when in reality, whenever Jesus, as the Son of Man, ran up against the Devil, He shut him down and cast him out. He didn't allow the Devil to take His life either, but rather He said HE laid it down when and where HE chose. Then He gave us all the same rights and privileges and authority He had, which is what Adam had at the beginning. So you see, you have authority over Satan totally, in every way and in every place.
The Devil is called a Thief, a thief will steal, kill and destroy in someone's life until that someone enforces the law on them or uses a weapon against them or shuts them down somehow.
And yes, God has to do what God has already said in His written Word, His covenant. Otherwise, He would have to cease to exist. Read Psalm 89:34. God has to perform the oath He has sworn to us. He can only treat Believers according to the terms of the New Covenant, and nothing else can He do, and He cannot refuse it. He keeps His Word brother. If you don't believe that, we cannot even have this discussion, because you have been spoiled by man's vain philosophies and traditions which make the Word of God of none effect in your life (Colossians 1).
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really? what is this part?i will have mercy upon whom he shall have mercy upon.

and what about this? and this? god didn't exactly stop satan did he? god isn't all knowing? he was where when satan deceive eve ? hiding? blind. in fear? why didn't god stop satan? I will tell you why? because he wants man to choose god. he has to let us reject him.

we have that choice. we reject god and that is what I meant. reread my posts. god doesn't do any evil we have a will. other wise the bible would nothing about to about us choosing to repent. we wouldn't have to. we have a will. don't confuse that. god choose to forgive. its always a choose. oddly why does god not choose to forgive blaspheming the HOLY SPIRIT of which the Pharisees did? the blood doesn't save one from that. can you actually honestly say god choose to do that? I can. he said I WIILL NOT forgive that. forgiveness is a choice. the offender has to chose to forgive. god may have that nature but he chose to be that way. I also add these demillas for you. btw that is why I don't like prosperisity gospel

read romans 9, for whom he foreknew he predestined to be children of god. jermemiah one. before I made thee I knew thee jeramiah. Jacob I have loved but esau I have hated. he already knows what we will do. we are on the limited perspective of time. he isn't. does any sin surprise him? no. you make him sound weak that he doesn't know what tomorrow is and cant save. he choose to love us. he created satan. why didn't he saVe him? he choose not to. god choose to slay babies. why? were they evil? no. but he killed them in the flood. he killed them in the first Passover. he told the isrealites to slay young and old of Jericho.its a miracle that we are saved. jesus didn't have to die. theres that part where jesus said if there is any OTHER way let this cup pass but never the LESS THY WILL be done. that to me is a choice to die.
 
Kathi said:
God is in control of everything including the weather.Sometimes people give Satan too much credit.He loves that.
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yes, he allows what happens to happen. he doesn't make it happen, but he allows it. he allowed satan to rebel. he didn't stop adam from eating that fruit. he allowed it.
 
jasoncran said:
yes, he allows what happens to happen. he doesn't make it happen, but he allows it. he allowed satan to rebel. he didn't stop adam from eating that fruit. he allowed it.
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Yes....we are not puppets.God is not a cosmic rapist.If a man should have to put a gun to his wifes head and demand that she love him is that love?Jesus will not drag those who do not love him into heaven.He loves them.They would not be happy.
 
I don't think you are seeing the same thing here;
By saying God "allows" evil I think what you hopefully mean to say is that God has allowed for the possibility of evil to exist so that free will and therefore LOVE can exist. A lot of people say God allows evil and they equate that to mean that God is standing back and authorizing evil to be done by someone, which of course is not true.
So, unless you say otherwise, I will take you saying that God allows evil to mean literally "God HAS allowed free will, and therefore some people choose to do evil."
 
TheCurseoftheRodain said:
I don't think you are seeing the same thing here;
By saying God "allows" evil I think what you hopefully mean to say is that God has allowed for the possibility of evil to exist so that free will and therefore LOVE can exist. A lot of people say God allows evil and they equate that to mean that God is standing back and authorizing evil to be done by someone, which of course is not true.
So, unless you say otherwise, I will take you saying that God allows evil to mean literally "God HAS allowed free will, and therefore some people choose to do evil."
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Yes,that sounds about right.
 
TheCurseoftheRodain said:
I don't think you are seeing the same thing here;
By saying God "allows" evil I think what you hopefully mean to say is that God has allowed for the possibility of evil to exist so that free will and therefore LOVE can exist. A lot of people say God allows evil and they equate that to mean that God is standing back and authorizing evil to be done by someone, which of course is not true.
So, unless you say otherwise, I will take you saying that God allows evil to mean literally "God HAS allowed free will, and therefore some people choose to do evil."
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Jer 32:35 And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

Verse 32, says THEY caused Judah to sin. And those are God's words not Jeremiah's.

However, God did cause bad things to happen to the people because of their sin.
 
Deborah13 said:
Jer 32:35 And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

Verse 32, says THEY caused Judah to sin. And those are God's words not Jeremiah's.

However, God did cause bad things to happen to the people because of their sin.
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Did he cause it to happen or did he allow it to happen?
 
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