Why beg?

[XTruth]

Rom.12:1-2
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

When one is a Christian's brother in Christ, which can only be said of one who has been born-again and are therefore children of God, they are all told here to live obediently to the Word of God, to be as holy as God and to be as perfect as God (complete in conformity to the gospel), if this were something that automatically happens as a child of God, or as some have even said that this obedience is actually the work of God and we really have no choice in the matter, then why would Paul exhort his brothers in Christ to do what will be automatic?

 

[Jon-Marc]

Living for Christ is not automatic for most people. We need to be taught what it is that Christ expects from us. New Christians are not generally knowledgeable in God's word (Many veteran Christians can't quote anything other than John 3:16--if that) and don't know the verses that say that we are new creatures in Christ, and that old things are supposed to pass away, and all things are supposed to be new in our lives. They just keep on pretty much as before--ignorant of the change that has taken place in them.

 

[Good News Brown]

Rom.12:1-2
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

When one is a Christian's brother in Christ, which can only be said of one who has been born-again and are therefore children of God, they are all told here to live obediently to the Word of God, to be as holy as God and to be as perfect as God (complete in conformity to the gospel), if this were something that automatically happens as a child of God, or as some have even said that this obedience is actually the work of God and we really have no choice in the matter, then why would Paul exhort his brothers in Christ to do what will be automatic?

In regards to this verse, let me ask you:

Matthew 11:27-28 "All things have been delivered to Me by my Father, and no one knows the Son
except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and he to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
"Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest."

Would this invitation by Jesus exclude alcoholics and drug addicts? Or would such an individual today first need to get clean and sober before accepting this invitation? Would Jesus never reveal Himself to an alcoholic or drug addict?

I think we both agree that Jesus will readily accept a repentant alcoholic or drug addict, justify the person, make clean the person. In essence, the person will become Born-Again upon his/her believing in Jesus Christ at that moment. However, do really think that in every situation, the person with the addiction will never give in to the addiction/temptation? There are times where those with addictions are perhaps supernaturally delivered, but many times they are not. They face a continuous battle, and upon certain implications I see in this forum, as Solo has pointed out a number of times, the person would have to be re-born again and again monthly-weekly-daily.

This of course is just one example as there are many struggles Christians go through.

 

[Pogo]

Amen, XTruth!!!

Your presence here on this site is truly a blessing to us all!

I'm sure that there are many areas that our interpretations of the scriptures will differ...but, so far I have yet to find one.

Please keep sharing the truths of the Bible, brother!

In Christ,

Pogo

 

[XTruth]

Rom.12:1-2
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

When one is a Christian's brother in Christ, which can only be said of one who has been born-again and are therefore children of God, they are all told here to live obediently to the Word of God, to be as holy as God and to be as perfect as God (complete in conformity to the gospel), if this were something that automatically happens as a child of God, or as some have even said that this obedience is actually the work of God and we really have no choice in the matter, then why would Paul exhort his brothers in Christ to do what will be automatic?

In regards to this verse, let me ask you:

Matthew 11:27-28 "All things have been delivered to Me by my Father, and no one knows the Son
except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and he to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
"Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest."

Would this invitation by Jesus exclude alcoholics and drug addicts? Or would such an individual today first need to get clean and sober before accepting this invitation? Would Jesus never reveal Himself to an alcoholic or drug addict?

I think we both agree that Jesus will readily accept a repentant alcoholic or drug addict, justify the person, make clean the person. In essence, the person will become Born-Again upon his/her believing in Jesus Christ at that moment. However, do really think that in every situation, the person with the addiction will never give in to the addiction/temptation? There are times where those with addictions are perhaps supernaturally delivered, but many times they are not. They face a continuous battle, and upon certain implications I see in this forum, as Solo has pointed out a number of times, the person would have to be re-born again and again monthly-weekly-daily.

This of course is just one example as there are many struggles Christians go through.

Some Christians do struggle w/ ongoing temptation. They should repent after each time they fall. God has not allowed anything to come on them that they cannot handle.

My stance is not that all will automatically obey God and not sin. I don't know how you feel about it, but many OSAS believers believe that automatic obedience occurs at the rebirth. Some even believe that God draws in who will be saved and it's like free will is thrown out the door. I believe Paul that it is up to us to submit fully to God and live in His ways. We have help in this, but if we fail, we are w/o excuse. The responsibility is ours alone. Solo is right in saying a sinning Christian has to be reborn-again, but he doesn't really understand what being born-again means or believe that's possible to be done more than once, even though nothing can be done again that hasn't been done at least once before; yet we are said to be born of the Spirit again...to be born again.