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Why do we deceive the lost in this way to their destruction in our error of truth?

4afaithfulone

4afaithfulone

Member
Why do we speak beautiful things with lies and deception covering up the truth over our Lost loved ones at their passing, when we know the lifestyle they lived and their works they did, are not one in Christ, but one in the image(attributes) of the devil? They very well may have had good qualities, but the fact is they died unsaved and going to hell, just as we all are born good and evil and we all need to receive Jesus to rectify this.
Yet we deceive all who attend the glorified funeral by saying this was a good man or woman who is in heaven now and in the arms of Jesus and is resting in peace, Farrrr…. from the torments of this world? They are now in a better place!!

Is this what the Bible says will happen to those who reject to walk with Christ? Jesus said that We must be born again to enter into heaven and rest in peace. The story of the rich man and Lazarus tells us that the wicked get no peace after death.

We may not want to eat any of this spiritual food, but it is truth:
When a minister giving the service or a Christian who attends, does not speak the truth and say this man or woman, sad to say, did not receive the free gift of God to know the Lord His Son, and Has passed on UNSAVED, and we know what happens to them when unsaved, but chose for themselves to live a life of sin, loving their (wicked ways)life unto death, in addictions, alcoholism, unbelief, lies, dishonest ways, fornication, adultery etc…. We deceive!
For when we do that, we give all who are lost in that group False Hope that they are fine without Christ, for they make the erroneous mistake of looking at their own flesh and boasting, surely if this man made heaven in his wickedness…which was WAY worse then my sins,…... I certainly will make it as well.
Making them never see the need for Christ!
I know that this is a hard thing to hear, but we are about truth! Not the smooth things that only deceive.
Blessings
 
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4afaithfulone said:
Why do we speak beautiful things with lies and deception covering up the truth over our Lost loved ones at their passing, when we know the lifestyle they lived and their works they did, are not one in Christ, but one in the image(attributes) of the devil?
Click to expand...

Probably because some of the people attending the funeral service are having to contend with moving on without one of their loved ones. A child perhaps, a wife or a mother. Regardless of who they are, no one grieving over the loss of a loved one needs to hear that kind of condemnation.

/
 
Because the people for the most part that do funerals do so to please the loved ones or the living and not to preach the word of God and take a chance on hurting some one or getting into trouble.

There are quite a few pastors that will not do funerals for just this reason...
Then there are the other breed of pastors which will ONLY preach the gospel at funerals, and sadly they do not get asked much to do so.....
That is what I have come to learn.
Sad but true
Jim
 
yes.. how true. I did not even think of that until now. That's why its up to (us) to bring them into the kingdom now. Not complain later when it is too late for that soul. And as Gary said... people are already in terrible pain from losing the loved one. On top of that they don't need to hear that the person went to hell. The funerals are to help tie over the pain and loss at least some for those family members. I don't think that's the time or place for that 4aFaithfulOne
 
do understand that it can Will hurt people to hear truth. That is why we suffer persecution for Christ's name sake. But it will hurt worse if they go to hell when there was opportune time to get them to think and get saved.
I am not talking about a bashing where they speak harshly about them and trash their name. This is not at all what I mean. In fact, we should never speak evil of anyone.
But perhaps just a question such as.. "Do you know if they had accepted Christ and were saved before they passed ?" That is enough to get minds thinking without being unkind and hurtful. But we must be concerned with the souls who are hearing what is being said. God's desire is for all men to repent and be saved. We can not to be just men pleasers, or more will not make it.
When do you think Most people cry out to God? In times of disaster and woes! And while some die, many others may come to receive Christ because of them.

It is an outright lie and deception to say such things as "They are now in a better place in heaven with Jesus, resting in peace, no more suffering for them in this life".
It is the next life they must worry about now!
That person has now lost his chance to be saved, how scary is that, if we believe the Bible? And to not bring up his lack of salvation, will misled the lost souls who are still alive sitting in the service and they will be deceived by them hearing a minister say such a thing when they knew what kind of life he really lived, and it wasn't a honorable one, so if they made it without Jesus, so will I.
The deceased won't be effected in the least by bringing up his not being saved, for he is gone. But he may have made an opportunity for his family and friends to not make that same mistake.

I know it is hard at a time like that, but to play charades is not being kingdom minded, but carnally minded. When Jesus told the disciples that he was going to be placed in the hands of man and be killed. Peter said no Lord, we won't let them. But Jesus said get ye behind me Satan, for Peter was walking in his carnal way of thinking and was worried about losing Jesus and not about how this would advance God's kingdom. Truth be known, Peter didn't understand any of it, but Jesus was letting us know that we too must have this kind of faith to be kingdom minded, not led by our feelings.
 
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Gary said:
The thief on the cross displayed evidence of a contrite heart just before his death. How can you be certain that the deceased didn't do the same?

.
Click to expand...
It isn't a question of rather he did just before passing unless someone knew of it. The problem is if no one knew of it, then to hear the words spoken that he is now in a better place in heaven with Jesus, after knowing how he lived, leeds them to be deceived into thinking if everyone goes to heaven no matter how they lived, then I don't need Jesus either.

Even once we are saved to live again, we have this warning that not all who say Lord, Lord enter the kingdom of heaven:
Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
KJV
Matt 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
KJV
 
mswright6488 said:
yes.. how true. I did not even think of that until now. That's why its up to (us) to bring them into the kingdom now. Not complain later when it is too late for that soul. And as Gary said... people are already in terrible pain from losing the loved one. On top of that they don't need to hear that the person went to hell. The funerals are to help tie over the pain and loss at least some for those family members. I don't think that's the time or place for that 4aFaithfulOne
Click to expand...

I think that my post was about us lying to others about a lost soul's destination at his death, claiming to all in the service that he is in heaven with Jesus and is in a better place and resting now. There seems to be a hang up on all the feelings that will be hurt, and no care about the lie nor the souls that believe it to their destruction!
 
The point is, no one knows if a person is unsaved in the moments preceding death. It's quite possible that salvation was finally achieved. Therefore, providing a brief spot of comfort for the bereaved is fine. No one can accurately state in each and every case that the comfort is a lie.

And that very brief moment of comfort just might lead someone to seek our Lord in a very true, real and meaningful relationship.
 
Further, to ask the bereaved
"...a question such as.. "Do you know if they had accepted Christ and were saved before they passed ?"
Click to expand...
could very easily be viewed as nosy, rude... not in line with the love of our Lord. Those hearing an alleged Christian asking such a question at a funeral could potentially equate the questioner with some uber-out-there group like Westboro Church, thereby defeating the purpose.

(I noticed you edited out the part of your OP that I quoted)
 
Ecc 3:1 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
Ecc 3:2 A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
Ecc 3:3 A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
Ecc 3:4 A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
Ecc 3:5 A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
Ecc 3:6 A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
Ecc 3:7 A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
Ecc 3:8 A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace.
 
Why do we speak beautiful things with lies and deception covering up the truth over our Lost loved ones at their passing, when we know the lifestyle they lived and their works they did, are not one in Christ, but one in the image(attributes) of the devil? They very well may have had good qualities, but the fact is they died unsaved and going to hell, just as we all are born good and evil and we all need to receive Jesus to rectify this.
Yet we deceive all who attend the glorified funeral by saying this was a good man or woman who is in heaven now and in the arms of Jesus and is resting in peace, Farrrr…. from the torments of this world? They are now in a better place!!
Click to expand...
I've asked this question too and this is my conclusion. In my opinion we should avoid making any statement of declaration one way or the other because none of us knows who truly is or is not saved and therefore to make a statement like this is quite potentially a lie, which we should also avoid. We don't know if they're going "to a better place" or not. What we do know is they have left this world and from that point their fate is in God's hands. All we truly can do is offer our condolences and support in their loss.
 
4afaithfulone said:
Why do we speak beautiful things with lies and deception covering up the truth over our Lost loved ones at their passing, when we know the lifestyle they lived and their works they did, are not one in Christ, but one in the image(attributes) of the devil? They very well may have had good qualities, but the fact is they died unsaved and going to hell, just as we all are born good and evil and we all need to receive Jesus to rectify this.
Yet we deceive all who attend the glorified funeral by saying this was a good man or woman who is in heaven now and in the arms of Jesus and is resting in peace, Farrrr…. from the torments of this world? They are now in a better place!!

Is this what the Bible says will happen to those who reject to walk with Christ? Jesus said that We must be born again to enter into heaven and rest in peace. The story of the rich man and Lazarus tells us that the wicked get no peace after death.

We may not want to eat any of this spiritual food, but it is truth:
When a minister giving the service or a Christian who attends, does not speak the truth and say this man or woman, sad to say, did not receive the free gift of God to know the Lord His Son, and Has passed on UNSAVED, and we know what happens to them when unsaved, but chose for themselves to live a life of sin, loving their (wicked ways)life unto death, in addictions, alcoholism, unbelief, lies, dishonest ways, fornication, adultery etc…. We deceive!
For when we do that, we give all who are lost in that group False Hope that they are fine without Christ, for they make the erroneous mistake of looking at their own flesh and boasting, surely if this man made heaven in his wickedness…which was WAY worse then my sins,…... I certainly will make it as well.
Making them never see the need for Christ!
I know that this is a hard thing to hear, but we are about truth! Not the smooth things that only deceive.
Blessings
Click to expand...
For the above, What a good thread/Post
 
4afaithfulone said:
I think that my post was about us lying to others about a lost soul's destination at his death, claiming to all in the service that he is in heaven with Jesus and is in a better place and resting now. There seems to be a hang up on all the feelings that will be hurt, and no care about the lie nor the souls that believe it to their destruction!
Click to expand...
I would agree to the above statement. Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Everyone who confesses the name. 2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands. He who conceals his sins doesn't prosper, but whoever confesses and ... to expiate our transgression; but he that confesseth and forsaketh his sin Proverbs 28:13.
 
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4afaithfulone said:
Why do we speak beautiful things with lies and deception covering up the truth over our Lost loved ones at their passing, when we know the lifestyle they lived and their works they did, are not one in Christ, but one in the image(attributes) of the devil? They very well may have had good qualities, but the fact is they died unsaved and going to hell, just as we all are born good and evil and we all need to receive Jesus to rectify this.
Yet we deceive all who attend the glorified funeral by saying this was a good man or woman who is in heaven now and in the arms of Jesus and is resting in peace, Farrrr…. from the torments of this world? They are now in a better place!!

Is this what the Bible says will happen to those who reject to walk with Christ? Jesus said that We must be born again to enter into heaven and rest in peace. The story of the rich man and Lazarus tells us that the wicked get no peace after death.

We may not want to eat any of this spiritual food, but it is truth:
When a minister giving the service or a Christian who attends, does not speak the truth and say this man or woman, sad to say, did not receive the free gift of God to know the Lord His Son, and Has passed on UNSAVED, and we know what happens to them when unsaved, but chose for themselves to live a life of sin, loving their (wicked ways)life unto death, in addictions, alcoholism, unbelief, lies, dishonest ways, fornication, adultery etc…. We deceive!
For when we do that, we give all who are lost in that group False Hope that they are fine without Christ, for they make the erroneous mistake of looking at their own flesh and boasting, surely if this man made heaven in his wickedness…which was WAY worse then my sins,…... I certainly will make it as well.
Making them never see the need for Christ!
I know that this is a hard thing to hear, but we are about truth! Not the smooth things that only deceive.
Blessings
Click to expand...

First of all, we are not the judge. I use to pastor a church and don't even do funerals of folks I did not personally know.

I also am not the judge and we should not make any assumptions when doing a funeral.

There is nothing in scripture that says a Pastor should be doing funerals. The dead should bury the dead. Any Pastor that does funerals best have heard from God before doing one.

Funerals is not something those in ministery should be getting wrapped up in unless God says have a meeting to rejoice that a loved one is now in Heaven.
 
4afaithfulone said:
So, you are ok ?with the minister and other believer's saying that the person is in heaven with Jesus even when they are not Saved
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No I'am not ok: with the minister and other believer's saying that the person is in heaven with Jesus even when they are not saved?
 
Don't we all sin?
I have seen some ,so called born again, Christians act like a snake.
Fleshly things are of the flesh.
Spiritual things is His concern.

I leave that for God to judge.
He judges the heart.
Alcohol is an addiction, of the flesh.

I am not saying sinning is OK, but we all sin.
Nobody is/was perfect except Christ.
 
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