Worried I am condemned forever.

[FearAndTrembling]

I've recently been suffering a crisis of faith following my studies of the unforgivable sin. I'm now 26, but when I was 17 or 18, I was in a relationship with a girl, and she was holding to what I now understand to be biblical abstinence. I have counted myself a Christian for years and was baptized at this time. I immorally desired to be sexually intimate with her, and was under the influence of people on internet message boards like 4chans false teachings about the apostle Paul. I wrongly believed that much of the Bible's sexual prohibitions came from Paul. Both because I believed that Paul was not a rightful part of the Bible, and because I was filled with evil lust, I told my girlfriend that I thought Paul probably didn't belong in the Bible and was a later addition which didn't match with Jesus' teachings. I understand how ridiculous this sounds, since Jesus also condemned sexual immorality, but I digress. This did not end up leading to us doing anything, and she retained her virginity, but years later I heard she became an atheist. I worry that by saying I disbelieved Paul I have blasphemed the Holy Spirit and God has forsaken me. Eternal damnation is bad enough but I feel like I have betrayed the King I love with finality and that he doesn't want me back. It makes me tear up just thinking about it. I didn't even cry when I learned my dad committed suicide. It feels like all my worldly experiences and family relationships are for naught. I so desperately want to get back in God's good graces and to live as an organ of the Christian church body, but I feel like going back would make me a fraud. I'm not suicidal but life seems to have lost it's luster. Am I too late to be saved?

Edit: I've also struggled continuously with pornography and on occasion have even thought what I was doing was wrong before I did it, but used porn anyway. I think this is a serious sin which I also struggle with, but it does not seem as worrisome as what I've previously mentioned.

 

[Corn Pop]

1 Peter 3:18

For Christ also suffered once for sins, the just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive by the Spirit,


Romans 8:11


But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.

 

[Rockytopva]

Would Satan worry people not saved telling them they were not saved? If he did they would probably do the right thing and get saved!

Is the Holy Spirit convicting you over some sin? Then do the right thing in making matters right. Remembering...

8 The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. - Romans 10

Salvation is easy as confessing with your mouth the Lord Jesus Christ and believing in your heart that God has raised him from the dead. Which I am sure you have done.

 

[Tenchi]

This did not end up leading to us doing anything, and she retained her virginity, but years later I heard she became an atheist. I worry that by saying I disbelieved Paul I have blasphemed the Holy Spirit and God has forsaken me.

How does "disbelieving Paul" equate to blaspheming the Holy Spirit?

You understand, I hope, that the words "The power of the Holy Spirit is the power of the devil," are not in-and-of themselves blasphemous unless they express a genuine attitude and belief of the heart, as was the case for the Pharisees, whose hearts were far from God. (Matthew 15:7-8) I say this because I have often encountered obsessive-compulsive people who, in a fit of compulsiveness, blurted out something like the statement above, attributing the power of the Spirit to the devil. Immediately, they are horrified and frightened and then begin to obsess about being damned forever because of what they said. Here's the thing, though: When the Pharisees said the same thing, they weren't in the least disturbed after having done so. They hated Jesus and could not bring themselves to believe he was the Messiah. If Jesus was not from God, as the Pharisees desperately wanted to believe, then whence his power? Well, the only other option was the devil. And so, they said as much, expressing the desire of their hearts in the process and denying the only way they could ever be truly reconciled to God.

The obsessive-compulsive who blurts out "The power of the Holy Spirit is the power of the devil," is not expressing their true belief or a settled attitude of their heart and this shows in how they feel after they've done so. Just saying the words, then, does not damn a person because the real blasphemy of the Spirit, the really damning thing, is the attitude of one's heart toward God. The person who is so opposed to God that they believe what is of Him is actually of the devil, that Good is Evil, is profoundly blind to God's saving Truth and in their blindness cannot be reconciled to Him. This is why such "blasphemy" is unforgiveable. A person who is so darkened in their heart, so hardened toward God that they believe He is evil, has, by their own hardness (not a series of words blurted out in a certain order), cut themselves off from God and His forgiveness. By this means, they have become "unforgiveable."

Is this you? It doesn't seem like it. If you were like the truly blasphemous Pharisees, you'd not have written the post you did that started this thread.

Edit: I've also struggled continuously with pornography and on occasion have even thought what I was doing was wrong before I did it, but used porn anyway. I think this is a serious sin which I also struggle with, but it does not seem as worrisome as what I've previously mentioned.

Looking at porn is definitely sin.

Matthew 5:27-28 (NASB)
27 "You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY';
28 but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

And the more you look at porn, the harder it will be to stop. Eventually, you'll have to undo brain-wiring that is connected to powerful bio-chemistry, which will be no easy thing to do. So, stop now! God's not kidding when He warns that ALL sin results in death of some kind - death of our fellowship with Him, death of joy, of peace, of inner stability, of our conscience, and so on. (Romans 6:23; Galatians 6:7-8; James 1:15-16)

How do you stop? Well, there's the world's way: cold showers, keeping busy, exercise, getting others to watch you, sheer determination, etc. God's way is much better but requires His power, which you can only obtain as one of His children. The point of God getting you free of any sin is that you might know and enjoy Him more. He's not concerned merely with sin being out of your life but with your life being filled with Himself. Is this what you want? God's freedom from sin is freedom to live the way He created you to live, which is in joyful, life-changing communion with Himself.

Ephesians 2:10
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Revelation 4:11
11 You are worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for you have created all things, and for your pleasure they are and were created.

1 John 1:3
3 what we have seen and heard we proclaim to you also, so that you too may have fellowship with us; and indeed our fellowship is with the Father, and with His Son Jesus Christ.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

This is NOT Truth. The Holy Spirit did not raise Jesus, the Father did.

Romans 8:11.

 

[Hopeful]

1Jn_5:7 For there are THREE that bear record in heaven, the 1) Father, the 2) Word (Jesus), and the 3) Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

Mat_28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the 1) Father, and of the 2) Son, and of the 3) Holy Ghost:

All three are separate entities. This does not have to confusing to understand.

Mat_19:5-6 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be ONE flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but ONE flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

Husband + Wife = ONE Flesh.

The Father + Jesus + Holy Spirit = ONE.
The Father + Jesus + Holy Spirit + us Saints = ONE.

Joh_17:22-23 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be ONE, even as we are ONE: I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in ONE; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

The Holy Spirit is God.
The Father is God.
The Son, Jesus is God.
And those who are Born of God, are God.

Quite a stretch there.
It is written...
Matthew 10:25
It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more shall they call them of his household
Luke 6:40
The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master.

BTW, didn't Jesus say..."Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?" (John 10:34-36)

 

[gordon777]

To come to Christ sincerely and truly, is to believe Christ is faithful ( faithfully died for us) to forgive us of our sins, and to also cleanse us from all of the unrighteousness ( He had to die, to cleanse us from.)

Then if we see a brother sin, not unto death ( they need their life given to them, to not die in their sins from unbelief. John 8:21-24.) and all unrighteousness is sin ( Christ died to cleanse us from all unrighteousness, which is unbelief and dying in our sins.)

We know that whosoever is born of God does not commit sins, because they have believed in God rising from the dead to life for us, they are begotten of God ( believing on the only begotten of the dead Jesus Christ. Revelation 1:5.)

Now the wicked one no longer touches them ( causing them to sin, done before they believe in Christ risen from the dead to newness of life, as all is committed through unbelief. Romans 6:4.) and we then knowing we are of God, became aware that the whole world lies in wickedness.



1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

1 John 5:16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.



That wicked world speaks its vain words, to allure those in the flesh. ( not in the Spirit of Holiness to believe in Holiness.)

To not hear the servants of corruption promising liberty, because if we escaped those pollutions of the world through the knowledge of Christ ( of righteousness, and to sin not) and we become overcome, it ends up being better for us to never have known the way of righteousness, than to blaspheme by turning from the Holy commandment ( to love one another as Christ loved us, for belief in Him.) delivered to them.

It is the equivalent of returning to vomit.



2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

 

[WIP]

Please, this is the Questions and Answers forum. Direct your responses to the original poster (OP) and avoid engaging each others' differences.

 

[gordon777]

Condemnation:

John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

James 3:1 My brethren, BE NOT MANY MASTERS, knowing that we SHALL RECEIVE THE GREATER condemnation.

 

[DiscipleDave]

Do you not believe in One God?
You have three gods, God the Holy Spirit, God the Father, and God the Son.

Do you not believe in One Flesh
You have Two Fleshes, The husband, and the wife.

God the Father + Jesus the Son, + The Holy Spirit = ONE GOD.
Husband + Wife = ONE FLESH.

How is this generation is unable to understand these simple Truths? Because it is still on MILK and not Meat of the Word is why.

 

[DiscipleDave]

Please, this is the Questions and Answers forum. Direct your responses to the original poster (OP) and avoid engaging each others' differences.

i agree with this 100%. But tell me, if someone says something to me asking me about this or that, is it a Godly thing to answer them, or to ignore them?

 

[DiscipleDave]

DiscipleDave said:
This is NOT Truth. The Holy Spirit did not raise Jesus, the Father did.

Romans 8:11.

Rom 8:11 But if the Spirit of Him (The Father) that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, He (The FATHER) that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by His Spirit (Holy Ghost) that dwelleth in you.

Do you not believe Scriptures?

Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised Him (Jesus) from the dead;)

Act 2:32 This Jesus hath God (Father) raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Act 2:33 Therefore being by the right hand of God (the FATHER) exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.

Eph 1:20 Which He wrought in Christ, when He (the FATHER) raised Him from the dead, and set Him (Jesus) at His (Father) own right hand in the heavenly places,

Want more verses that plainly teaches His FATHER raised Him, that thing is not a secret.

1Co 6:14 And God (The Father) hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power.

2Co 4:14 Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus, and shall present us with you.

Act 2:24 Whom God (The Father) hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it.

Act 3:15 And killed the Prince of life (Jesus ), whom God (The Father) hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God (The Father) raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

And there are many many more verses i could put here as well.

Believe Scriptures, The Father in Heaven raised up Jesus His Son. This is what all of Scriptures plainly teaches.

Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised Him (Jesus) from the dead;)

This verse says the FATHER raised up Jesus. If the Father did this thing, like all of Scriptures teaches, then why are you saying the Holy Ghost did this?

 

[WIP]

i agree with this 100%. But tell me, if someone says something to me asking me about this or that, is it a Godly thing to answer them, or to ignore them?

I've posted this many times in various discussion threads in this forum plus it is spelled out in the "Forum Rules and Guidelines" found at the top of the forum. But, I'll say it again. If you feel you need to engage something that another member has posted, start a new discussion in the appropriate forum.

 

[gordon777]

Two entities, or two fleshes, joined together makes one.

That which is flesh is flesh and that which is Spirit, is Spirit. ( John 3:6.)



They are not alike, so cant be in comparison at all.


But he which is joined to the Lord ( in Spirit, ) is one Spirit. ( 1 Corinthians 6:17.)



If anyone can know and acknowledge the truth they are not condemned, they need to cast out debate, strife, and embrace charity. (2 Timothy 2:25. Titus 1:1. 1 Corinthians 3:3. 1 Corinthians 13:7.)

 

[FearAndTrembling]

I'm sad to say that I've become more convinced over the past several days that my ignorance at the time was not the kind of unwillful ignorance which could alleviate my moral responsibility, and that I probably knew deep down what I was saying was wrong even as I said it. I can always come up with more excuses and alleviating factors to argue in favor of myself, but I feel they still don't absolve my moral responsibility in the matter. As I committed this sin years ago, it's impossible for me to say with absolute certainty how I felt at the time, but I've prayed for forgiveness multiple separate times with each possible state of mind considered. Recently I prayed for forgiveness explicitly stating that I lied to my ex-girlfriend and that my primary reason for doing so was not ignorant unbelief but selfish gratification. Is it still possible that I am forgiven?
I've somewhat willfully bought into the idea that the best interpretation of the sin which harmonizes the Bible's message in John 3:16, 1 John 1:9, and more is that God forgives all sins which are repented, but blasphemey against the Holy Spirit hardens one's heart such that the offender can never repent or ask forgiveness. Does that interpretation seem viable?

Edit: It is, I suppose, worth mentioning that I never called Paul's teachings / any part of the Bible demonic. However, I am perturbed by my suggestion against the infallibility of the Bible, since it is the Word of God, and Paul's teachings were guided by God.

Second Edit: I also wanted to say thank you to everyone who has responded thus far. I read every comment multiple times. I just felt like I ought to clarify my feelings as I work through them.

 

[elena]

I've recently been suffering a crisis of faith following my studies of the unforgivable sin. I'm now 26, but when I was 17 or 18, I was in a relationship with a girl, and she was holding to what I now understand to be biblical abstinence. I have counted myself a Christian for years and was baptized at this time. I immorally desired to be sexually intimate with her, and was under the influence of people on internet message boards like 4chans false teachings about the apostle Paul. I wrongly believed that much of the Bible's sexual prohibitions came from Paul. Both because I believed that Paul was not a rightful part of the Bible, and because I was filled with evil lust, I told my girlfriend that I thought Paul probably didn't belong in the Bible and was a later addition which didn't match with Jesus' teachings. I understand how ridiculous this sounds, since Jesus also condemned sexual immorality, but I digress. This did not end up leading to us doing anything, and she retained her virginity, but years later I heard she became an atheist. I worry that by saying I disbelieved Paul I have blasphemed the Holy Spirit and God has forsaken me. Eternal damnation is bad enough but I feel like I have betrayed the King I love with finality and that he doesn't want me back. It makes me tear up just thinking about it. I didn't even cry when I learned my dad committed suicide. It feels like all my worldly experiences and family relationships are for naught. I so desperately want to get back in God's good graces and to live as an organ of the Christian church body, but I feel like going back would make me a fraud. I'm not suicidal but life seems to have lost it's luster. Am I too late to be saved?

Edit: I've also struggled continuously with pornography and on occasion have even thought what I was doing was wrong before I did it, but used porn anyway. I think this is a serious sin which I also struggle with, but it does not seem as worrisome as what I've previously mentioned.

It is never too late to be saved. God waits for your repentance. Repent the sooner the better and confess your sins. Ask God to cleanse you from your sins and decide to make a U-turn in your life away from sin, darkness and evil and towards light towards God.

You cannot make this U-turn on your own because none of us is strong enough. You need help from God, so ask Him. Pray to God Jesus Christ to give to give you everything you need to fight evil to fight your sins. Pray to God from your hear. Pour your heart out to God. Ask God to lead your life, to lead you on the right path towards Him. Pray God to strengthen your faith in Him. You can say the following prayer (Nicene creed) to strengthen your faith in God.

I believe in one God, Father Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.

And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all ages; Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten, not created, of one essence with the Father through Whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man. He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried; And He rose on the third day, according to the Scriptures. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father; And He will come again with glory to judge the living and dead. His kingdom shall have no end.

And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Creator of life, Who proceeds from the Father, Who together with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified, Who spoke through the prophets.

In one, holy, orthodox, and apostolic Church.

I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.

I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the age to come.

Amen.

 

[Highway54]

I've recently been suffering a crisis of faith following my studies of the unforgivable sin. I'm now 26, but when I was 17 or 18, I was in a relationship with a girl, and she was holding to what I now understand to be biblical abstinence. I have counted myself a Christian for years and was baptized at this time. I immorally desired to be sexually intimate with her, and was under the influence of people on internet message boards like 4chans false teachings about the apostle Paul. I wrongly believed that much of the Bible's sexual prohibitions came from Paul. Both because I believed that Paul was not a rightful part of the Bible, and because I was filled with evil lust, I told my girlfriend that I thought Paul probably didn't belong in the Bible and was a later addition which didn't match with Jesus' teachings. I understand how ridiculous this sounds, since Jesus also condemned sexual immorality, but I digress. This did not end up leading to us doing anything, and she retained her virginity, but years later I heard she became an atheist. I worry that by saying I disbelieved Paul I have blasphemed the Holy Spirit and God has forsaken me. Eternal damnation is bad enough but I feel like I have betrayed the King I love with finality and that he doesn't want me back. It makes me tear up just thinking about it. I didn't even cry when I learned my dad committed suicide. It feels like all my worldly experiences and family relationships are for naught. I so desperately want to get back in God's good graces and to live as an organ of the Christian church body, but I feel like going back would make me a fraud. I'm not suicidal but life seems to have lost it's luster. Am I too late to be saved?

Edit: I've also struggled continuously with pornography and on occasion have even thought what I was doing was wrong before I did it, but used porn anyway. I think this is a serious sin which I also struggle with, but it does not seem as worrisome as what I've previously mentioned.

Dont worry about it too much sir, let your seared conscience learn from it to prod you not to do it again. God is very forgiving, consider the account of David, which to me is almost unforgivable. Only those who have sinned against the holy spirit are damned eternally, and I seriously doubt you did that. In order to do that you have to know God well, and deliberately work against His will, actively opposing Him.

Not intending to be cruel here but I would bet if I asked you to show me God's name in the Bible right now, you couldn't do it. So likely it would be impossible for you to commit an unforgivable sin.

 

[Tenchi]

I'm sad to say that I've become more convinced over the past several days that my ignorance at the time was not the kind of unwillful ignorance which could alleviate my moral responsibility, and that I probably knew deep down what I was saying was wrong even as I said it.

Goodness, welcome to common human experience. Every human person says MANY things of this sort all throughout their lives. This is exactly why the Bible warns us so often to put a careful guard on our tongues, which is to say, a careful guard upon our hearts, the ultimate source of our speech. (Matthew 12:34; Luke 6:45; James 1:26; James 3:6; Colossians 4:6, etc.)

I can always come up with more excuses and alleviating factors to argue in favor of myself, but I feel they still don't absolve my moral responsibility in the matter. As I committed this sin years ago, it's impossible for me to say with absolute certainty how I felt at the time, but I've prayed for forgiveness multiple separate times with each possible state of mind considered.

Which a person truly guilty of the "unforgivable sin" would never do. It is this very hardness to the need to seek forgiveness for what's been said that is what is so unforgivable. This isn't you.

1 John 1:9
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Romans 5:20 (NASB)
20 ... where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,

but blasphemey against the Holy Spirit hardens one's heart such that the offender can never repent or ask forgiveness.

No, you've got this backward. It is because one's heart is already hard toward God that one blasphemes the Holy Spirit, calling his work and power demonic. Such a heart blasphemes without qualm, without concern, as was the case with the scribes in Pharisees when they called the power of the Holy Spirit, the power of the devil. Again, this isn't you. Were you of the heart of the Pharisees, hard and blind to sin and blasphemy, you would not be worrying over having blasphemed.