Bible Study God at the first did visit the Gentiles

[jasoncran]

another using chabad. btw vic is the one whom pointed me in that direction.

and a jewess wrote that. makes it all the more interesting. only a mother could see it that way.

 

[jasoncran]

I believe you to be speaking of Psalm 69, but is the history as pertaining to David's mother incorrect in the Talmud?

idk, I read that fully interesting to get StoveBolts opinion on this. surely he would see it and since he wanted this I will post it here.

http://www.chabad.org/multimedia/me...The-Personal-Parshah-Mikeitz-and-Chanukah.htm

 

[Eugene]

and a jewess wrote that. makes it all the more interesting. only a mother could see it that way.

I really don't mean to derail this thread, but you mention Jewess; is that opposed to using the word Hebrew? My thinking is that a proselyte can revert to becoming Jewish, but not Hebrew. As such a convert could never become a priest.

 

[jasoncran]

I really don't mean to derail this thread, but you mention Jewess; is that opposed to using the word Hebrew? My thinking is that a proselyte can revert to becoming Jewish, but not Hebrew. As such a convert could never become a priest.

theres not word for female Hebrew in English and well chana weisenberg is an ashkenazic name. she does write. women cant address issues to women. look her up and see that she writes a lot. theres two jewess I now know. the other is mayim balik who does similar things. the later teaches and preaches sexual purity. I have read her article on that years ago.
then in the days of moses it was the tribe that was mentioned. daughter of so and so or of the tribe. implied to be all Hebrew.

 

[Eugene]

theres not word for female Hebrew in English and well chana weisenberg is an ashkenazic name. she does write. women cant address issues to women. look her up and see that she writes a lot. theres two jewess I now know. the other is mayim balik who does similar things. the later teaches and preaches sexual purity. I have read her article on that years ago.
then in the days of moses it was the tribe that was mentioned. daughter of so and so or of the tribe. implied to be all Hebrew.

In that case, do you consider Obed to have been Hebrew? Somewhere in this I believe hhh is leaning in that direction. Again from Chabad: Eventually, the entire lineage of Yishai (Jesse) was questioned,
http://www.chabad.org/theJewishWoman/article_cdo/aid/280331/jewish/Nitzevet-Mother-of-David.htm

 

[jasoncran]

I do, why? because that article said obed was one. read it. remember what was done. a deception. afterwards

 

[jasoncran]

interesting that also explains why david also knew the torah and taught the torah and knew a lot about being a priest.

and you missed this Eugene

Boaz died the night after his marriage with Ruth. Ruth had conceived and subsequently gave birth to their son Oved, the father of Yishai. Some rabble-rousers at the time claimed that Boaz’s death verified that his marriage to Ruth the Moabite had indeed been forbidden.

Time would prove differently. Once Oved (so called because he was a true oved, servant of G‑d), and later Yishai and his offspring, were born, their righteous conduct and prestigious positions proved the legitimacy of their ancestry. It was impossible that men of such caliber could have descended from a forbidden union.

god blessed that union. remember people get jealous. besides rachab is in that line as well and was before that man boaz.

 

[Eugene]

interesting that also explains why david also knew the torah and taught the torah and knew a lot about being a priest.

and you missed this Eugene god blessed that union. remember people get jealous. besides rachab is in that line as well and was before that man boaz.

I read all that, and still have the question; in all aspects is a Jew a Hebrew? Did Ruth in fact become Hebrew when she converted?

 

[jasoncran]

I read all that, and still have the question; in all aspects is a Jew a Hebrew? Did Ruth in fact become Hebrew when she converted?

yes that is in the torah , moses said that if a man wants to become a Hebrew he must be circumcised. im some subliminal way I can relate to david even more now. im of a gentile mother and my grandparents despised my mom being married to my dad. my birth changed all that. they never said I wasn't a jew.nor my siblings. upon my grandparents death my mother receives a separate trust check. I did only recently learn of that hatred . I asked my mom the day of the funeral did grandma and grandma not like you for being a gentile? she said yes they wouldn't talk to her on the phone nor want her to visit with dad. so I know the Hebrew do to that.i will add that race had NOTHING to do with that. it was over the fact that mom was a Christian and not a JEW.i will add that did for years have an issue for me in the way I saw isreal.

 

[jasoncran]

ruth said I will serve your god and he shall be my god. see what is said in ruth.

14 And they lifted up their voice, and wept again: and Orpah kissed her mother in law; but Ruth clave unto her.

15 And she said, Behold, thy sister in law is gone back unto her people, and unto her gods: return thou after thy sister in law.

16 And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, I will go; and where thou lodgest, I will lodge: thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God

sounds like a conversion to me and no rabbi there just the love for her husband, his mother in law. someone had to tell her whom this god was.

 

[Deborah13]

interesting that also explains why david also knew the torah and taught the torah and knew a lot about being a priest.

and you missed this Eugene god blessed that union. remember people get jealous. besides rachab is in that line as well and was before that man boaz.

Rachab was Boaz's mother. If it's the same woman who helped Joshua than she was a proselyte, too. But she may be a different one.

 

[Deborah13]

I read all that, and still have the question; in all aspects is a Jew a Hebrew? Did Ruth in fact become Hebrew when she converted?

Another question I think would be, when a child was adopted did they receive a full inheritance just like if they were a Hebrew. I think I read they did.

 

[hhh]

What does it matter that Obed married a Hebrew or not; he was not but the half Hebrew son of Boaz and Ruth a proselytized Moabite. I had not previously looked at any of this.

Hi Eugene, Actually, Obed would have been 1/2 Gentile, if his grandma wasn't Rahab. And, Obed would have been 3/4 Gentile, if he wasn't related to Tamar.

 

[hhh]

so you say that jesus was a gentile? by that extension you said that.

Well, we have established that Obed was over 75% Gentile; nobody has proven that David was any more Jewish than Obed: from there, the geneaology goes on to Solomon, etc.

 

[Eugene]

Well, we have established that Obed was over 75% Gentile; not that David was any more Jewish than Obed; from there, the genealogy goes on to Solomon, etc.

Solomon is the lineage of Christ in name only. Actually the genealogy went to Solomon's brother Nathan and through Mary. We read in 1 Kings 11:10-11 . .

1 Kings 11:10 And had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods: but he kept not that which the LORD commanded.
1 Kings 11:11 Wherefore the LORD said unto Solomon, Forasmuch as this is done of thee, and thou hast not kept my covenant and my statutes, which I have commanded thee, I will surely rend the kingdom from thee, and will give it to thy servant.

Notice one of the covenants I made bold. Things change with broken covenants. And then jasoncran is right on track I believe in the idea of proselytes as per the Talmud; lest Jesus would not be a Jew.

 

[hhh]

Good one Eugene! I never noticed Nathan before. Thank you.
I think that the definition of who the people of God are, should conform to the scriptures. Like Deborah pointed out, Jews are goy too.

And, even a master of Israel must be born again. John 3:1-12

Ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvelous light:
1 Pe. 2:9

For ye are all children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
For as many of you have put on Christ.
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male or female: for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Ga. 3:26-29

 

[agua.]

Solomon is the lineage of Christ in name only. Actually the genealogy went to Solomon's brother Nathan and through Mary. We read in 1 Kings 11:10-11 . .

1 Kings 11:10 And had commanded him concerning this thing, that he should not go after other gods: but he kept not that which the LORD commanded.
1 Kings 11:11 Wherefore the LORD said unto Solomon, Forasmuch as this is done of thee, and thou hast not kept my covenant and my statutes, which I have commanded thee, I will surely rend the kingdom from thee, and will give it to thy servant.

Notice one of the covenants I made bold. Things change with broken covenants. And then jasoncran is right on track I believe in the idea of proselytes as per the Talmud; lest Jesus would not be a Jew.

Eugene what do you mean by "Solomon is the lineage of Christ in name only."

 

[Eugene]

Good morning @ague, and good question. Without finding all scripture pointing that lineage went through the man, and the example is in Matthew Chapter One as it's traced back to David through Solomon on down to Joseph, but Jesus was not born of Joseph but of God through Nathan to Mary, I hope I'm making this clearer than it sounds. My explanation appears to be taking on the genesis of the song "I'm my own grandpa."

1Ch 3:1 Now these were the sons of David . .
1Ch 3:5 And these were born unto him in Jerusalem; Shimea, and Shobab, and Nathan, and Solomon . .

Blessings in Christ Jesus.

 

[eddif]

Abraham was a Gentile

I agree

Romans 4:11 And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumsized; that righteousness might be imparted unto them also:

Other surrounding text makes it clearer that Abraham is the father of Jew and Gentile alike.

eddif

 

[hhh]

Eugene what do you mean by "Solomon is the lineage of Christ in name only."

Eugene brought out some really nice verses.
Another one that suppourts his position is... And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,
Lk. 3:23
Now Eugene has me searching, why did God choose a very much Gentile, to be Jesus' "father?"
Who are the real people of God?
The scriptures are full of godly Gentiles, and ungodly Jews, and vice versa.
Thanks to Eugene, I have more to study.