[_ Old Earth _] the sun orbits the earth?

[Strangelove]

That video proves absolutely nothing. It's all about perspective. If that satellite was in a geostationary, or geosynchronous, orbit, then the reference point on earth is always the same--that is, you always see the exact same view of earth.

Yeah...your absolutley right Free. No proof. Just wanted to see what peoples general view of it was. I'm just tackling basic observation at the moment here.

To me it looks like whatever the camera is mounted on is totally still. Just my observation. I mean....the framing of the shot doesnt change a millimeter throughout the whole 24 hours. Remember this geostationary satellite is supposed to be flying around the Earth at 70,000mph.

Add to that, the Earth hurtling around the Sun (aledgedly) at the same speed. So we've got all those things going on and yet....the perfect, eerie stillness?

Just sayin'

Anyone else? Thoughts?

The earth could very well be rotating and orbiting the sun (and science proves this to be the case) but the perspective from the satellite somewhat hides this.

Can you bring forth your proofs one at a time please Free.

I'm off to bed now but I'll catch up with you guys tomorrow....

.......when the Sun rises ((Lolz))

 

[coffeeelover]

That video proves absolutely nothing. It's all about perspective. If that satellite was in a geostationary, or geosynchronous, orbit, then the reference point on earth is always the same--that is, you always see the exact same view of earth. The earth could very well be rotating and orbiting the sun (and science proves this to be the case) but the perspective from the satellite somewhat hides this.

That goes to prove my point. That there is no proof. Proof is is a theoretical mathematical concept, it does not exist in reality. Science provides evidence for us to examine and make conclusions, and predictions.

I think it is silly that some would believe, and point to, science for some things. Such as the earth revolves around the sun, while not believing that the earth is billions of years old, and that a world wide flood 4000 years ago is a myth.

Strangelove and I may be on opposite side of a coin so to speak, but I like him because he isn't trying to straddle a fence. He seems to actually know what science says, but rejects it. I can respect that on its face.

 

[jasoncran]

sl there is one way. simple launch a probe to the sun, its function to stay in geosycrhonus orbit around the sun and send a signal with the time is gst and we recieve and calaborate for dialation and also if science is right it will show varying distances, ie via the doppler effect.
gps works this way.

the earth if it rotates will be at a different rate of movement then that satellite and we can see that.

 

[coffeeelover]

sl there is one way. simple launch a probe to the sun, its function to stay in geosycrhonus orbit around the sun and send a signal with the time is gst and we recieve and calaborate for dialation and also if science is right it will show varying distances, ie via the doppler effect.
gps works this way.

the earth if it rotates will be at a different rate of movement then that satellite and we can see that.

That is maybe a possible experiment, but that has never been done. So we have to rely only on the info we have. Copernicus did it with out even a calculator.

 

[jasoncran]

actually we could do both as we have sent a few probes to the sun already.
the mariner 10 and the ranger 1 and 2 in the 60's and 70's.
we sent probes to the outer planets and mars to learn , surely we need to look more at the sun.


not to negate what capernicus did.

it could also be used to study the radioactive areas of the sun's corona and also the sun spots, of course one solar flare it would be done.

 

[Vic C.]

I'm not sure what districtions are, CL... But I agree otherwise with you. I cannot see the Word for the truth it holds, than you obviously are looking at the rest of the Bible differently also.

SL... What the heck was that video of? I thought it was a drug trip for a while.

It's called smoke and mirrors, Ian. A satellite in a fixed orbit has produced that video.

 

[coffeeelover]

It's called smoke and mirrors, Ian. A satellite in a fixed orbit has produced that video.

I am certainly not going to make his point for him, but I can say for sure you missed it.

 

[jasoncran]

I am certainly not going to make his point for him, but I can say for sure you missed it.

on that note:

how can we prove his hypothesis? the multiverse and that we each universe has its own set of rules?

Stephen Hawking on God, Science and the Origins of the Universe - WSJ.com

 

[Vic C.]

I am certainly not going to make his point for him, but I can say for sure you missed it.

I didn't miss it, but I also refuse to get trapped into a debate over circular reasoning. Philosophy and reality usually don't mix well.

 

[Vic C.]

Jason, I attempted to correct the link, but I couldn't. :bigfrown

 

[jasoncran]

no biggie read my link its out there and he is serious!

 

[coffeeelover]

I didn't miss it, but I also refuse to get trapped into a debate over circular reasoning. Philosophy and reality usually don't mix well.

I don't know what you consider circular reasoning, but to the original point. Absolute proof does not exist.

 

[jasoncran]

I don't know what you consider circular reasoning, but to the original point. Absolute proof does not exist.

you could have used the plan of the magellan launch and how it was sling shot around mars then onto jupiter, and it oribited the earth several time as was sling shot.
sl couldnt deny that probe reaching jupiter, as we have videos and other pics as evidence.

if we were lying about the location of the planets surely that would cause some problems.

 

[Burke]

I think that "literal" can be taken too literally.

 

[jasoncran]

I think that "literal" can be taken too literally.

thats is why we must understand the the ot hebrew mind and the means they used to communicate thoughts and ideas. this is needed for proper understanding of thier symbolism and hebrew poetry.

 

[Pard]

I imagine if we look at the Hebrew text and the logic behind these texts about the world standing still we will see that it is in fact not a literally meant passage, but a poetic or some such passage.

Genesis and Exodus are some of the most literally written books in the Hebrew texts, out done ONLY by the genealogies. Anything from Psalms needs to be questioned for literalness and that requires going into the Hebrew text and the logic used to write it. Chronicles has some very poetic parts to it. Those are two of the four passages that are used to support a still earth.

 

[coffeeelover]

I imagine if we look at the Hebrew text and the logic behind these texts about the world standing still we will see that it is in fact not a literally meant passage, but a poetic or some such passage.

Genesis and Exodus are some of the most literally written books in the Hebrew texts, out done ONLY by the genealogies. Anything from Psalms needs to be questioned for literalness and that requires going into the Hebrew text and the logic used to write it. Chronicles has some very poetic parts to it. Those are two of the four passages that are used to support a still earth.

How one could think that one man who lived hundreds of years built a boat out of wood big enough to fit all living species into it so a loving God could kill everything and everyone on earth by drowing them is literal I just don't know what to say to that. That's literal, but Earth standing still is obviously poetic? Good Grief as Charlie Brown would say.

 

[Mike]

How one could think that one man who lived hundreds of years built a boat out of wood big enough to fit all living species into it so a loving God could kill everything and everyone on earth by drowing them is literal I just don't know what to say to that. That's literal, but Earth standing still is obviously poetic? Good Grief as Charlie Brown would say.

I haven't been able keep up with this entire thread, but I caught most of it when I could. I might have missed some things that were said. The account of Noah is so deliberately and methodically documented in genesis, it's not nearly the same as a verse or two saying that the earth is immovable and taking that to mean it doesn't revolve around the sun! I can't understand this concept with what we know now.

We can see the solar system in action and the planets revolving around the sun. We can witness that. We cannot witness or see the ark being built, the origin of man, the beginning of the universe. One cannot find anything that specifically says the earth is stationary, and the rest of creation revolves around it. As was mentioned, we are His beloved and the center of His creation - "we" are.

You scoff at someone who believes in an ark being built as told. Why is that such a stretch for you. Amidst all of creation, Jesus resurrection and victory over death, you are dumbfounded that a Christian could take the account of Noah literally?

CL, if you'd care to respond, what is the greatest work of God in your opinion? How does the ark compare to that. You might say "That was one man; Noah." Maybe he believed that he could do all things through He that strengthened him.

So the LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, from the face of the earth—men and animals, and creatures that move along the ground, and birds of the air—for I am grieved that I have made them." 8 27Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God."

Nothing is impossible whether God speaks it into action or touches His followers to do His Will.

27Jesus looked at them and said, "With man this is impossible, but not with God; all things are possible with God."

But the Bible never says the earth is stationary, and it certainly does not contradict anything in scripture by understanding to be true, that which we can observe.

 

[Strangelove]

We can see the solar system in action and the planets revolving around the sun. We can witness that.

No-ones denying the planets revolve around the Sun. Earth is not a planet though. We dont witness the Earth in orbit do we? Only the planets. We can see that in the sky.

The planets have their primary orbits around the Sun and the whole shebang revolves around the stationary, unmoving Earth. The whole thing fits in nice and tidy into the Geocentric universe.

I still havn't seen anyone bring forth any scintific proofs of a moving Earth. Either spinning or moving.

So I'm still going with my observation both stood on the Earth and from space....that the Earth doesn't move.

And I'm also going on the INDICATION of the Bible that the Earth doesnt move.

Question:

If you get in a helicopter on the equator and fly 100 meters directly up and hover there for an hour. If the Earth is spinning at 1000mph. Why, when you land, are you not 1000 meters from where you started?

 

[jasoncran]

that is something called gravity , there strangelove, that is how it works why do we not fall a 1000 miles away when we jump. tje helciopter doesnt overcome gravity all that much. It takes more energy to break orbit then the space shuttle produces.

like i said earlier we launch a probe to the sun and observe from its position where the earth is via signals and we can calcualate distance, and it will change, and we can literally graph the changes.