The Land Promises to Israel were Completed Long, Long Ago.

[theWind]

As the title declares, the book of Joshua and Nehemiah reveal that the Land Promises made by God to Israel were completed Millennia ago. This is a major problem for those who believe that there must be a 1,000 year period after Christ returns in order for the land of Israel to be fully given to those whom God promised it to so very long ago.

Pre-Millennialists declare that this is pivotal to their doctrine of the Millennium time period - which is woefully misinterpreted from Revelation 20. All of this is easily disproven with Scripture and all of the major end times passages completely contradict this doctrine as they all coincide in their declaration of the earth being completely destroyed upon Christ's return on the "Last Day" of this world.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

As the title declares, the book of Joshua and Nehemiah reveal that the Land Promises made by God to Israel were completed Millennia ago. This is a major problem for those who believe that there must be a 1,000 year period after Christ returns in order for the land of Israel to be fully given to those whom God promised it to so very long ago.

Pre-Millennialists declare that this is pivotal to their doctrine of the Millennium time period - which is woefully misinterpreted from Revelation 20. All of this is easily disproven with Scripture and all of the major end times passages completely contradict this doctrine as they all coincide in their declaration of the earth being completely destroyed upon Christ's return on the "Last Day" of this world.

Jesus seems to believe that land belongs to him.

Mark 12:7
But the tenants said to one another, ‘This is the heir. Come, let’s kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.’


Paul seems to believe it belongs to Christ.

Gal 3:16
The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,” meaning one person, who is Christ.


Are you positive Jesus is not the heir of the promised land?After all,God said he would give it to Abraham and his seed for an everlasting possession.Everlasting is a long long time.

Mathew 8:11
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.


I hope you don't get upset if God keeps the promise he made to Abraham to give him that land so that Abraham can live there forever.

Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

As the title declares, the book of Joshua and Nehemiah reveal that the Land Promises made by God to Israel were completed Millennia ago. This is a major problem for those who believe that there must be a 1,000 year period after Christ returns in order for the land of Israel to be fully given to those whom God promised it to so very long ago.

Pre-Millennialists declare that this is pivotal to their doctrine of the Millennium time period - which is woefully misinterpreted from Revelation 20. All of this is easily disproven with Scripture and all of the major end times passages completely contradict this doctrine as they all coincide in their declaration of the earth being completely destroyed upon Christ's return on the "Last Day" of this world.

PS

When you think the world is destroyed is about the time I would move east.

Mathew 8:11
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

 

[theWind]

Jesus seems to believe that land belongs to him.

Mark 12:7
But the tenants said to one another, ‘This is the heir. Come, let’s kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.’

This is a parable and has nothing to do with the Land Promises to Israel given in the OT.

Paul seems to believe it belongs to Christ.

Gal 3:16
The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,” meaning one person, who is Christ.

This says nothing of the Land Promises given in the OT and because they were completely fulfilled in Joshua and Nehemiah, there is no case to be made that this NT verse is referencing them.

Are you positive Jesus is not the heir of the promised land?After all,God said he would give it to Abraham and his seed for an everlasting possession.Everlasting is a long long time.

That was a conditional promise and they LOST the land due to disobedience.

Mathew 8:11
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

The kingdom of heaven is now. It will be turned over in 1 Cor. 15:24 when Christ returns on the Last Day of the world.

I hope you don't get upset if God keeps the promise he made to Abraham to give him that land so that Abraham can live there forever.

Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Nothing to be upset about, God made good on all the Land Promises.

"And the Lord gave unto Israel all the land which He sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein. And the Lord gave them rest round about, according to all that He sware unto their fathers: and there stood no a man of all their enemies before them; the Lord delivered all their enemies into their hand. There failed (nothing) of any good thing which the Lord had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass."
Joshua 21:43-45

Case closed.

 

[theWind]

PS

When you think the world is destroyed is about the time I would move east.

Mathew 8:11
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

Again, ... the kingdom of heaven is now. Christ is ruling His kingdom through all True Believers who are indwelled with His Spirit upon all the earth. He doesn't have multiple kingdoms.

This kingdom will be turned over to the Father in 1 Cor. 15:14 on the Last Day of the world.

You consciously ignore all of the major end times passages that speak of the earth being completely destroyed by fire because it is a threat to your chosen doctrine of Pre-Mil.

Isaiah 13:9-11
Mal. 4:1
Nah. 1:5
Zech. 1:14-15, 18
Zech. 3:8
2 Thess. 1:7-9
2 Peter 3:10

These ALL coincide with the weight of Scripture as a whole. The doctrine of the Millennium reign after Christ's return, that is constructed from Rev. 20 alone, does not coincide and is not supported anywhere else in the Bible. That is what is called clear evidence that it is a misinterpreted, and thus unsound, doctrine.

These verses and perspectives, coupled with the verses from Joshua and Nehemiah, prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that the Land Promises were concluded long ago and that Pre-Mil is a 100% False Doctrine.

 

[Highway54]

As the title declares, the book of Joshua and Nehemiah reveal that the Land Promises made by God to Israel were completed Millennia ago. This is a major problem for those who believe that there must be a 1,000 year period after Christ returns in order for the land of Israel to be fully given to those whom God promised it to so very long ago.

Pre-Millennialists declare that this is pivotal to their doctrine of the Millennium time period - which is woefully misinterpreted from Revelation 20. All of this is easily disproven with Scripture and all of the major end times passages completely contradict this doctrine as they all coincide in their declaration of the earth being completely destroyed upon Christ's return on the "Last Day" of this world.

That land is the whole earth sir. After the release of satan, and the execution of he and they who follow him to the lake of fire, God's purpose for the earth will be complete.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

This is a parable and has nothing to do with the Land Promises to Israel given in the OT.

This says nothing of the Land Promises given in the OT and because they were completely fulfilled in Joshua and Nehemiah, there is no case to be made that this NT verse is referencing them.

That was a conditional promise and they LOST the land due to disobedience.

The kingdom of heaven is now. It will be turned over in 1 Cor. 15:24 when Christ returns on the Last Day of the world.

Nothing to be upset about, God made good on all the Land Promises.

"And the Lord gave unto Israel all the land which He sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein. And the Lord gave them rest round about, according to all that He sware unto their fathers: and there stood no a man of all their enemies before them; the Lord delivered all their enemies into their hand. There failed (nothing) of any good thing which the Lord had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass."
Joshua 21:43-45

Case closed.

So what are you accusing Abraham of going that God has taken away the promises made to him?
Can you elaborate on Abraham's disobedience ?

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Again, ... the kingdom of heaven is now. Christ is ruling His kingdom through all True Believers who are indwelled with His Spirit upon all the earth. He doesn't have multiple kingdoms.

This kingdom will be turned over to the Father in 1 Cor. 15:14 on the Last Day of the world.

You consciously ignore all of the major end times passages that speak of the earth being completely destroyed by fire because it is a threat to your chosen doctrine of Pre-Mil.

Isaiah 13:9-11
Mal. 4:1
Nah. 1:5
Zech. 1:14-15, 18
Zech. 3:8
2 Thess. 1:7-9
2 Peter 3:10

These ALL coincide with the weight of Scripture as a whole. The doctrine of the Millennium reign after Christ's return, that is constructed from Rev. 20 alone, does not coincide and is not supported anywhere else in the Bible. That is what is called clear evidence that it is a misinterpreted, and thus unsound, doctrine.

These verses and perspectives, coupled with the verses from Joshua and Nehemiah, prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that the Land Promises were concluded long ago and that Pre-Mil is a 100% False Doctrine.

So you believe everyone who is to travel east to the kingdom.of heaven has already traveled east and are now in it?

 

[theWind]

So what are you accusing Abraham of going that God has taken away the promises made to him?
Can you elaborate on Abraham's disobedience ?

Before you start moving the goal posts, I'd like you to stay on the topic of this thread, please.

Can you tell me if I've proven, to your satisfaction, that the Land Promises were completed to Israel with the passage that I presented?

 

[theWind]

So you believe everyone who is to travel east to the kingdom.of heaven has already traveled east and are now in it?

You'll need to post some Scripture if you want to discuss the Bible.

Jesus' kingdom, the kingdom of heaven, exists right now, as stated multiple times now, in posts #4 and #5.

He declares Himself that His kingdom is not of this world. John 18:36

John sees the spiritual city of New Jerusalem coming down from heaven twice in Revelation 20, if that is the kingdom you are referring to people going to at some future time.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Before you start moving the goal posts, I'd like you to stay on the topic of this thread, please.

Can you tell me if I've proven, to your satisfaction, that the Land Promises were completed to Israel with the passage that I presented?

I'm staying on the topic.The land was promised to Abraham for an everlasting possession.You said the land was taken away because of disobedience.

So I'm asking you,how did Abraham disobey God so that caused God to take abrahams everlasting possession away from him?

 

[Shilohsfoal]

You'll need to post some Scripture if you want to discuss the Bible.

Jesus' kingdom, the kingdom of heaven, exists right now, as stated multiple times now, in posts #4 and #5.

He declares Himself that His kingdom is not of this world. John 18:36

John sees the spiritual city of New Jerusalem coming down from heaven twice in Revelation 20, if that is the kingdom you are referring to people going to at some future time.

Ive already posted s rupture which you replied to.
But so that you might read it this time ,I will post it again.


Mathew 8:11
And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.


I've been planning on traveling east where Abraham,Isaac and Jacob are to sit down in the kingdom of heaven.
So are you saying that everyone has already traveled east to the kingdom of heaven and I've missed the opportunity?

 

[for_his_glory]

When you think the world is destroyed is about the time I would move east.

2Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Peter 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Peter 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Kind of speaks for itself that this present heaven and earth will pass away and a new heaven and earth will be brought forth.

 

[for_his_glory]

The land that God promised to Abraham and all his seed is perpetual unto the end of days. Genesis 17:1-19. God owns all the earth and has given it to His heirs for a possession.

When Christ returns the kingdoms of this world will become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ and He shall reign for ever and ever, Rev 11:15.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

2Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Peter 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Peter 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Peter 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Rev 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

Kind of speaks for itself that this present heaven and earth will pass away and a new heaven and earth will be brought forth.

Rev 21:1 shows it to take place 1000 years after Christ comes.In planning on taking a trip east when Christ comes.Not 1000 years later.Now if I die before then would be a different matter.

But as far as I've read,even after the world is destroyed and made new again Israel will still be living in the land promised to Abraham Isaac and Jacob.

God will keep his promise to Abraham and give him all the land of Canaan for an everlasting possession.
Not just for the time he dwelt there as a stranger.


This verse speaks for itself.There are many people who say Abraham will not receive the land of Canaan promised to him for an everlasting possession.
Are you one of those people,?


Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

The land that God promised to Abraham and all his seed is perpetual unto the end of days. Genesis 17:1-19. God owns all the earth and has given it to His heirs for a possession.

When Christ returns the kingdoms of this world will become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ and He shall reign for ever and ever, Rev 11:15.

Everlasting is not untill the end of days.
Unless your going to rewrite the verse for God,it says everlasting.It doesnt say temporarily.

Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.


You should also consider a new earth is not a different world.Its still earth and there is one earth.

 

[for_his_glory]

Everlasting is not untill the end of days.
Unless your going to rewrite the verse for God,it says everlasting.It doesnt say temporarily.

Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.


You should also consider a new earth is not a different world.Its still earth and there is one earth.

Poor choice of words on my part. The land that now is will be until the Lord returns and then makes new the heaven and earth as this present heaven and earth will pass away in preparation for the New Jerusalem that God will usher down from heaven. It will not only be renewed for the faithful of Israel, but all who are graphed into the branch of Israel with Jesus being the root that will live in the new Jerusalem.

It will be a different world from that which has been corrupted as God will make all things on earth new again as it was in the garden of Eden. All who are in Christ by faith are the heirs of Abraham and will inherit the land.

 

[for_his_glory]

Rev 21:1 shows it to take place 1000 years after Christ comes.In planning on taking a trip east when Christ comes.Not 1000 years later.Now if I die before then would be a different matter.

But as far as I've read,even after the world is destroyed and made new again Israel will still be living in the land promised to Abraham Isaac and Jacob.

God will keep his promise to Abraham and give him all the land of Canaan for an everlasting possession.
Not just for the time he dwelt there as a stranger.


This verse speaks for itself.There are many people who say Abraham will not receive the land of Canaan promised to him for an everlasting possession.
Are you one of those people,?


Genesis 17:8
And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.

Only if one takes the 1000 years as literal as I am one of many who only sees it as symbolic in its numbering, but this thread is not about the millennium so I will not derail this thread.

Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[for_his_glory]

There are many people who say Abraham will not receive the land of Canaan promised to him for an everlasting possession.
Are you one of those people,?

Why would Abraham not be raised from his grave like all of us when Christ returns and not receive his place in the new Jerusalem with the rest of us. If people are saying that then they know not the scriptures.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

Why would Abraham not be raised from his grave like all of us when Christ returns and not receive his place in the new Jerusalem with the rest of us. If people are saying that then they know not the scriptures.

New Jerusalem does not come down from heaven when Christ comes.
Christ comes 1000 years before and reigns with the resurrected saints in the promised land.As Ezekiel shows in Ezekiel 37,Israel is raised from their graves and lives peacefully without walls or bars.
After this long time of peace Gog comes in Ezekiel 38-39 which corresponds to Gogs invasion in revelation 20 at the end of the 1000 years.

Its best to not leave out or dismiss the things that are written in scripture.Especially the things written in revelation.As for the millinium,it does have to do with this topic.
These things written in revelation 20 pertains to the seed of Abraham to whom the land mentioned here was promised.
Revelation 20 shows that no one can take that kingdom from them,EVER.Its theirs as an everlasting possession.

Revelation 20
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.