[_ Old Earth _] Member thoughts requested: POLL included.

[Sparkey]

I've recently closed a thread because of what could be seen as "Trolling" within our Christianity and Science forum. This "Moratorium on Trolling" thread is now open to encourage discussion about what I see as a need to continue an effort started by Young Earth Creation group, when a petition for the creation of a Sanctuary forum (YEC) and group was made and honored.

See: Final Post #8, in the THE MINDLESSNESS OF EVOLUTION thread (recently closed).

It just seems to me that in order to best serve all of our Members it is good to draw the line a little deeper in the sand while taking a stronger position against what could appear to be "Trolling".

Here's a Link to various answers to the question, "What is an internet Troll?" from Reference.com

Comments are welcomed and encouraged (may I say, needed) so that we may proceed, hopefully in agreement, toward a solution to a well-known issue here at ChristianForums.net.

Recall that the Christianity and Science forum is a place where everyone who enters may see the Forum Header:

Christianity & Science(10 Viewing)
Discuss science topics such as creation and evolution and how they relate to Christianity. ​

ChristianForums.net Mission Statement:

ChristianForums.net aspires to provide a place where Christians can come together in fellowship for encouragement, inspiration, and strength to help build each other up and grow in our walk of faith through honest and open discussion, study, reflection, and prayer.

ChristianForums.net desires to serve non-Christians, seeking answers to questions about Christianity, by sharing the gospel of Jesus Christ so they too may acquire the hope, joy, and peace that come from fellowship with the saving grace of our Lord, Jesus Christ.​

 

[Stone-yarder]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Not sure how his article is trolling. Folks who beleive in evolution start numerous threads about evolution and they go on forever. In fact I see non-believers on here spewing non stop evolutionary propaganda to the point of I have seriously considered leaving. If you are going to issue a warning it should go both ways. I have noticed so much evolutionary trolling that it seems its some peoples sole pupose here.

Here is a quote on one of their profiles left by another member...

"Why are you even on this Website? Do you actually plan to become a christian?
Or are you here to go out of your way just to harass members and try to debunk Christianity every waking second you can?"

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Not sure how his article is trolling. Folks who beleive in evolution start numerous threads about evolution and they go on forever. In fact I see non-believers on here spewing non stop evolutionary propaganda to the point of I have seriously considered leaving. If you are going to issue a warning it should go both ways. I have noticed so much evolutionary trolling that it seems its some peoples sole pupose here.

Here is a quote on one of their profiles left by another member...

"Why are you even on this Website? Do you actually plan to become a christian?
Or are you here to go out of your way just to harass members and try to debunk Christianity every waking second you can?"

If you are going to issue a warning it should go both ways.

Although I agree with need for an even scale in the hands of moderators and would offer thanks for your insights, I would quickly also go on to say this thread is NOT a request for moderation advice. I have no plan on issuing warning(s), but am soliciting your thoughts about how we want to deal with a known issue.

Staying on topic is a very big concern of mine. I'm asking how the Members want to proceed. If after a week goes by, I'll (perhaps) consider adding a poll. In the meantime, let me know where we want to go from here and please do stay on topic in this thread.

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

We could consider the possibility of extending the use of the 1-on-1 forum to Members who insist on strong (out of the ordinary), lengthy (monotonous?) debate.

Trying to think about other possibilities.


:help

Here's a possibility: Tell me that it's fine just the way it is. I'll want to consider that opinion (even though I disagree) too.

 

[Stone-yarder]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

I'm confused. Perhaps I am not understanding what exactly it is that you are looking for input on in this thread. I wasn't attempting to provide "moderator" advice, I was addressing the issue of trolling from my perspective.

ChristianForums.net Mission Statement:

ChristianForums.net aspires to provide a place where Christians can come together in fellowship for encouragement, inspiration, and strength to help build each other up and grow in our walk of faith through honest and open discussion, study, reflection, and prayer.

ChristianForums.net desires to serve non-Christians, seeking answers to questions about Christianity, by sharing the gospel of Jesus Christ so they too may acquire the hope, joy, and peace that come from fellowship with the saving grace of our Lord, Jesus Christ.

The second line of the mission statement clearly provides the answer to the question at hand. To the best of my ability I felt like I was adressing trolling in accordance with the terms of service stated above. I truly feel that this forum is actually a "church" because the church is a body of believers and not a building per se. If someone walked into your church launching an attack against Christianity, how long should it be tolerated? It's one thing to entertain questions from someone who believes differently and is seeking to learn about Christ and an entirely different thing to engage in ongoing dialogue with someone who is attempting to destroy your faith. From my perspective, the OP was attempting to debunk evolution using scientific data and I don't understand why this wasn't given equal ground. I feel I am staying on topic here, but maybe you're talking about apples and I'm talking about oranges. I felt like I answered your original question, but now I feel like I've been rebuked for sharing my input.

 

[reba]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Often we see what looks like trolling ... A new guy starts posting so he gets a few interested in what he says for good or bad.... it is not trolling to SHORT term sorta follow a guy around the forums.... if the follower tends to agree with the new guy no complaints if he don't some one cries foul..

So many times I am embarrassed by some of the attitudes I read including my own....

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Rebuked? No. There is no mistaking my rebuke, just saying...

But what I would encourage you to do is to consider the purpose of our forum:
Recall that the Christianity and Science forum is a place where everyone who enters may see the Forum Header:

Christianity & Science (10 Viewing)
Discuss science topics such as creation and evolution and how they relate to Christianity. ​

This is a place where parties of both sides to the discussion (and the specific examples are "creation and evolution") may enter with the expectation that their thoughts and beliefs will be discussed. Now, I would certainly not want to limit our conversations to evolution and creation only. Just the other day I participated in a thread about Volcanoes. Members there were free to examine Geology and some concluded that it was evidence for an old earth. I don't think that this means, "C'mon guys! We have liberty to defend the faith!" and sound any alarm.

ed! :bicker

When somebody enters and tries to create further controversy, it doesn't take a rocket surgeon or a brain scientist to spot what's going on. I literally could cite hundreds of examples, but let's not go there. Instead, after acknowledging a possibility of this being seen as a problem or issue, let's instead focus on solution. I honestly believe that each member of our C&S forum can work together on this.

By the way, thank you, Stone-yarder, for your reply. I hope that my response helps to clarify what I'm asking about.

 

[cupid dave]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Hmmm..
Trolling...?
People Troll to catch fish.

With a daily attendence here of about 4 regulars on average, even the non-Trollers would appreciate less regulation, less moderation overseeing and deletions, in the hopes more people would come here and express themselves.

What often happens when a moderator becomes so empowered by claims that he/she has had a referrandum from the "regulars" is the censorship now has teeth.

Forevermore, that moderator can and does simply by saying, "'We' all agreed (may four people, ten years ago), so I suspend or remove your post."

What also seems an imortant guide for Christians in general is remember that Christ said, "Whenever two or more of you are gathered together in the name of Truth, there I am in the midst."

Even non-believers who are honestly expressing what to them seems true are part of that christian open forum discussion.... IMHO, of course.

 

[reba]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

CD we, mods, do a good job around here of keeping each other in check.

 

[cupid dave]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

CD we, mods, do a good job around here of keeping each other in check.

2X IMHO,... so far.

 

[reba]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

2X IMHO,... so far.

LOL you have a humble opinion ?

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Hmmm..
Trolling...?
People Troll to catch fish.

With a daily attendence here of about 4 regulars on average, even the non-Trollers would appreciate less regulation, less moderation overseeing and deletions, in the hopes more people would come here and express themselves.

What often happens when a moderator becomes so empowered by claims that he/she has had a referrandum from the "regulars" is the censorship now has teeth.

Forevermore, that moderator can and does simply by saying, "'We' all agreed (may four people, ten years ago), so I suspend or remove your post."

What also seems an imortant guide for Christians in general is remember that Christ said, "Whenever two or more of you are gathered together in the name of Truth, there I am in the midst."

Even non-believers who are honestly expressing what to them seems true are part of that christian open forum discussion.... IMHO, of course.

Moderators are not obliged (as some politicians) to follow the mandates of the populace. We will continue to serve. The Lord comes first. Others with the same scale as self.

Your view for ulterior motives speaks well, but not of the Moderators I've befriended here. I'll take your thought to mean that you want freedom to say and do as you please. Noted.

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

I actually don't expect much to come of this thread. It was started because of the effort that will continue to be pursued here, as seen in the Mission statement as well as the purpose of this forum.
After a week has passed, I may add a poll in an effort to stimulate replies.

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

Back before the 1975 release of NBC's "Saturday Night Live" I had the pleasure of attending several of the "Not Ready for Prime Time Players" performances at The Comedy Store in downtown Hollywood. They were a talented group even back then and often encouraged audience participation for their ad lib performances. But that wasn't the main appeal, well not for my sister and I, that is. The Comedy Store gave away free chicken wings and popcorn to their patrons and it was a pleasant way to spend a lunch break.

I don't recall the year that Jane Curtin and Dan Aykroyd started airing their version of "Point - Counterpoint", but I do recall the now famous beginning rebuttal line, "Jane, you ignorant..."

This is the type of thing that we will do well to avoid. If you're like me, you've been to several forums in the past, some of which have their version of "Creation / Science" types of discussions. I used to actively participate on one forum, hosted and supported by atheists and it was a struggle for me to remain respectful of the ideas and concerns there. To me, it felt like mockery and direct attempts at provocation. So today, I see these things from a different view. Here, on a Christian forum, it seems to me that we will all do well to resist the more base replies in favor of a well moderated discussion.

Hopefully the "well moderated" part of this will be derived by sound Biblical principle. Although a true Acts 11:17 Berean spirit may be difficult, where one actually attempts to prove what is being said by searching the Scripture daily, it would surely be acceptable to follow the advice to put a double lock upon our minds and tongues. Comments like, "Sparrow, you incredibly ignorant...." might be tolerated or shrugged off by the thickness of my skin, but should not have to dealt with at all. Trolling is specifically prohibited in the general Terms that we've all agreed to in exchange for the Service provided here. Respect for the opinions of others merits an entire sub-section in the ToS, and the Christianity and Science Forum Agreement extends the spirit of these admonitions even further.

So then, what I'm asking:

• Look to other forums or recall forums you've visited in the past.
• See what it is that you like and/or dislike.
• Ask yourselves, do the moderators and members found there, do a better job than here?

Report back here, if you would, please."


PS OOPS! I misquoted the reference and should have said Acts 17:11.

 

[Sparkey]

Re: Member thoughts requested: POLL included

I've added a public poll that allows multiple choices. I'm also first to participate.
The poll will close in a week, on March 19th.

 

[Knotical]

I like things the way they are. Of course I may be a little biased. ;)

 

[cupid dave]

Re: Member thoughts needed re: Sparrow's proposed "Moratorium on Trolling"

We could consider the possibility of extending the use of the 1-on-1 forum to Members who insist on strong (out of the ordinary), lengthy (monotonous?) debate.

.

yeah, yeah, yeah...

But then it comes down to the subjective and opinionated definition of just what was/is "monotonous," for instance, where the other side MUST by definition be equally monotonously holding strongly to its side of an issue.

Then, again, it comes down to the subjective and opinionated definition of just what "we" are.
There are once fair and open sites that became copmmandeered by athesists who now small talk awaiting for the arrival of christian who then attack with the relesh of a wolf pack.
They managed to grasp the authority by just this censorship you propose.
Theysystematically silenced and banned people who they could not crush otherwise.

What is your position on the Government rumors that the Fed Government is playing with the idea of censorship?
They start by producing a list of criticisms that they hope people will buy into, as an excuse for a mild over view, sure to become aggressive as such things always do.

What I see here is about six rather regular who cn simply ignore and posts they care to so do.
The traffic here is slow and few people attend.

Censorship is sure to get rid of some one or more who apparently you have in your sights now.
Why not name the "troll" you think should be told to go away, sinc there have be only a dozen people here for months and months?

 

[cupid dave]

I like things the way they are. Of course I may be a little biased. ;)

Yeah, me too, even the way they were last year, for that matter.
This is Science/Religion Forum already set aside for people talking the way we have been.

To even get here, you need plead your casewith the mods for permission to post.
Apparently, a half a dozen of us have been approved.
What is this all about, making it five?

 

[Sparkey]

yeah, yeah, yeah...

But...

Censorship is sure to get rid of some one or more who apparently you have in your sights now.
Why not name the "troll" you think should be told to go away, sinc there have be only a dozen people here for months and months?

Are you certain you are not misrepresenting me here? Clearly, you've posed your opinion in terms of a question, but your intent is as clear as the words that are chosen.

Don't make my case for me, please. I like things the way they are but do see a need to reduce direct provocation, don't you? Being a Moderator gives me access to information that you don't have, like the total number of Members who have signed the Christianity and Science agreement and are able to post in what you mistakenly call the "Science/Religion" forum.

 

[Asyncritus]

I'm not quite sure why this subject arose in connection with my articles.

I have never hidden my relentless opposition to evolution, and this last is a serious challenge to the pro-evolutionists to come up with anything that could possibly account for the origin of the human mind.

As said, there is no accounting possible, and it is noteworthy that Barbarian had nothing to say. That isn't a surprise, because there is no accounting.

That being so, the theory of evolution is finished, and he knows it. If our minds did come from the chimps etc, then the theory of evolution also came from the chimps - and is a s worthless as a banana skin!

So I'm just a little perplexed. OK, I expressed myself a bit forcibly, but that isn't trolling, merely my heavy-footed style of writing.