Bible Study A simple way to understand the Trinity

[BFSmith764]

The Spirit of God

The Spirit of God or the Holy Spirit is God in action; whenever the Holy Spirit is mentioned, it means that God is doing something….God would not be God if He could not act.

Genesis 1:1-2 (KJV)
1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Numbers 24:2 (ASV)
2 And Balaam lifted up his eyes, and he saw Israel dwelling according to their tribes; and the Spirit of God came upon him.1

Chronicles 12:18 (ASV)
18 Then the Spirit came upon Amasai, who was chief of the thirty, and he said, Thine are we, David, and on thy side, thou son of Jesse: peace, peace be unto thee, and peace be to thy helpers; for thy God helpeth thee. Then David received them, and made them captains of the band.

Matthew 3:16 (ASV)
16 And Jesus when he was baptized, went up straightway from the water: and lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove, and coming upon him;

Matthew 12:28 (ASV)
28 But if I by the Spirit of God cast out demons, then is the kingdom of God come upon you.

Luke 1:35 (ASV)
35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Spirit shall come upon thee, and the power of the Most High shall overshadow thee: wherefore also the holy thing which is begotten shall be called the Son of God.

The Word

The Word, who became Jesus, was and is the mind and utterance of God; this is why Jesus is God, because the mind of God is what God is…its God’s identity. God could not be God if He could not think and speak/utter.

John 1:1-4, 14 (ASV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made through him; and without him was not anything made that hath been made.
4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.

Word:
Greek Word: λÌγοÂ
Transliteration: logos
Phonetic Pronunciation: log'-os
Root: from <G3004>
Cross Reference: TDNT - 4:69,505
Part of Speech: n m
Vine's Words: Account, Cause, Communicate, Communication, Intent, Matter, Matters, Question, Questioning, Reason, Report, Saying, Show (Noun), Speech, Talk, Things, Treatise, Utterance, Word



from <G3004> (lego); something said (including the thought); by implication a topic (subject of discourse), also reasoning (the mental faculty or motive; by extension a computation; specially (with the art. in John) the Divine Expression (i.e. Christ) :- account, cause, communication, × concerning, doctrine, fame, × have to do, intent, matter, mouth, preaching, question, reason, + reckon, remove, say (-ing), shew, × speaker, speech, talk, thing, + none of these things move me, tidings, treatise, utterance, word, work.

Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

Jesus said that He issued from God; If Jesus is, or was a separate being from God He would not use this word. This was not simply a departing from the Father’s as one would if you were standing in the presence of another person, then departing…..when you do that it would not be said that you issue or issued from that person. Jesus issued from God, like water coming from a tap or pipe. Jesus issued from God because He is the mind and utterance of God….that’s why He is referred to as the word in John.

John 16:27-28 (KJV)
27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
28 I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father.

Came out/ came forth:
Greek Word: á¼ÂξέÃÂÇομαι
Transliteration: exerchomai
Phonetic Pronunciation: ex-er'-khom-ahee
Root: from <G1537> and <G2064>
Cross Reference: TDNT - 2:678,257
Part of Speech: v
Vine's Words: Come, Came, Depart, Get, Got, Gotten, Proceed



from <G1537> (ek) and <G2064> (erchomai); to issue (literal or figurative) :- come (forth, out), depart (out of), escape, get out, go (abroad, away, forth, out, thence), proceed (forth), spread abroad.

Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

God made mankind in His image

When God said let us make man in our image, it was God the Father who was doing the uttering, just as you or I would utter something. Our utterance, which is simply our thoughts being heard, is the person. With out your mind you will not be you….your mind is your identity. This is why we are in the image of God. When you understand truly what is meant when God said, “let is make man in our imageâ€Â, then the Trinity will not seem like a mystery.

Genesis 1:26 (ASV)
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

We are in the image of God because we can think and speak; we can act or take action to do what we have in our thoughts. And we are like God because out thoughts are subjected to us the one doing the uttering and doing.

So in a sense, we are a trinity, mind, body and action.

 

[Pogo]

Deleted by Pogo

 

[BFSmith764]

Deleted by BFSmith764

 

[Pogo]

Deleted by Pogo

 

[BFSmith764]

Deleted by BFSmith764

 

[Pogo]

BFSmith -

I'm sorry, but I'm confused.

I've re-read all of my and your posts above.

I have repeatedly said that I agree with your position on the Trinty.

I don't understand how you can see me as disagreeing with you.

If possible, I'll just delete my posts above, in an attempt to eliminate this confusion.

In Christ,

Pogo

EDIT - Well, I was able to erase the originals of my posts, but you have the quotes on everrything I posted showing in your responses.

If you will edit those out of your posts, then all of my comments, and thus, all of the confusion regarding my position on this issue will be gone.

Pogo

 

[BFSmith764]

BFSmith -

I'm sorry, but I'm confused.

I've re-read all of my and your posts above.

I have repeatedly said that I agree with your position on the Trinty.

I don't understand how you can see me as disagreeing with you.

If possible, I'll just delete my posts above, in an attempt to eliminate this confusion.

In Christ,

Pogo

EDIT - Well, I was able to erase the originals of my posts, but you have the quotes on everrything I posted showing in your responses.

If you will edit those out of your posts, then all of my comments, and thus, all of the confusion regarding my position on this issue will be gone.

Pogo

Sorry the error is on my part...I was in a but of a hurry and I did not read your post correctly....sorry about that, my apology. And yes I agree with you, it makes sense.

 

[one_lost_coin]

The definition you have proposed for the Holy Spirit has already been condemned as a heresy known as modalism over 1600 years ago and is completely at odds with the understanding of the Trinity accepted by the vast majority of Christian church's today and throughout history.

You will seriously want to stop using it, I offer this lovingly because I also thought along those lines for a short time as I was trying to grasp so great a teaching as the Doctrine of the Trinity, then someone pointed the error of modality out to me.

 

[BFSmith764]

The definition you have proposed for the Holy Spirit has already been condemned as a heresy known as modalism over 1600 years ago and is completely at odds with the understanding of the Trinity accepted by the vast majority of Christian church's today and throughout history.

You will seriously want to stop using it, I offer this lovingly because I also thought along those lines for a short time as I was trying to grasp so great a teaching as the Doctrine of the Trinity, then someone pointed the error of modality out to me.

One would need to prove that it's heresy, from the Bible; I care not about the opinion of those if it cannot be supported from the scriptures. The truth has nothing to do with what is accepted by the majority; spiritual truth comes from God's word. So if someone wants to prove that what I or someone else is saying is false, it must be done from the Bible, and not from what most people believe. Besides, I never used that word "Modalism", I simply quoted a few scriptures, which explained what the tree natures of God (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) is, you either believe what it says or reject it.

My advice to anyone is this, if you find that what you have come to believe and accept contradicts what the scriptures tells us, then we should reject that belief for what God's word is telling us. Remember Jesus said that we cannot serve two masters.

 

[one_lost_coin]

The definition you have proposed for the Holy Spirit has already been condemned as a heresy known as modalism over 1600 years ago and is completely at odds with the understanding of the Trinity accepted by the vast majority of Christian church's today and throughout history.

You will seriously want to stop using it, I offer this lovingly because I also thought along those lines for a short time as I was trying to grasp so great a teaching as the Doctrine of the Trinity, then someone pointed the error of modality out to me.

One would need to prove that it's heresy, from the Bible; I care not about the opinion of those if it cannot be supported from the scriptures. The truth has nothing to do with what is accepted by the majority; spiritual truth comes from God's word. So if someone wants to prove that what I or someone else is saying is false, it must be done from the Bible, and not from what most people believe. Besides, I never used that word "Modalism", I simply quoted a few scriptures, which explained what the tree natures of God (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) is, you either believe what it says or reject it.

My advice to anyone is this, if you find that what you have come to believe and accept contradicts what the scriptures tells us, then we should reject that belief for what God's word is telling us. Remember Jesus said that we cannot serve two masters.

First He taught them to recognize in Himself the Eternal Son of God. When His ministry was drawing to a close, He promised that the Father would send another Divine Person, the Holy Spirit, in His place. Finally after His resurrection, He revealed the doctrine in explicit terms, bidding them "go and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost" (Matthew 28:18). The force of this passage is decisive. That "the Father" and "the Son" are distinct Persons follows from the terms themselves, which are mutually exclusive. The mention of the Holy Spirit in the same series, the names being connected one with the other by the conjunctions "and . . . and" is evidence that we have here a Third Person co-ordinate with the Father and the Son, and excludes altogether the supposition that the Apostles understood the Holy Spirit not as a distinct Person, but as God viewed in His action on creatures.

The phrase "in the name" (eis to onoma) affirms alike the Godhead of the Persons and their unity of nature. Among the Jews and in the Apostolic Church the Divine name was representative of God. He who had a right to use it was invested with vast authority: for he wielded the supernatural powers of Him whose name he employed. It is incredible that the phrase "in the name" should be here employed, were not all the Persons mentioned equally Divine. Moreover, the use of the singular, "name," and not the plural, shows that these Three Persons are that One Omnipotent God in whom the Apostles believed. Indeed the unity of God is so fundamental a tenet alike of the Hebrew and of the Christian religion, and is affirmed in such countless passages of the Old and New Testaments, that any explanation inconsistent with this doctrine would be altogether inadmissible.

 

[Imagican]

sorry

 

[one_lost_coin]

Imagician asks "What does TRINITY offer that is BETTER than a relationship WITHOUT IT?"

The truth of God.

modalism is proclaime as a heresy so that we may be brought into the truth of who God is and not waste our time with false beliefs.
the Apostles never taught the heresy of modalism.

From your post Its pretty clear you don't know what the doctrine of the Trinity is. Our anything about the Apostolic Church.

Athanasian Creed

(and spare me I dont believe any in a creed. it is from the Latin credo, "I believe" so unless you believe nothing, than you believe something therefor you have a creed.)

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith. Which Faith except everyone do keep whole and undefiled, without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the Catholic Faith is this, that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity. Neither confounding the Persons, nor dividing the Substance. For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son, and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son and of the Holy Ghost is all One, the Glory Equal, the Majesty Co-Eternal. Such as the Father is, such is the Son, and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father Uncreate, the Son Uncreate, and the Holy Ghost Uncreate. The Father Incomprehensible, the Son Incomprehensible, and the Holy Ghost Incomprehensible. The Father Eternal, the Son Eternal, and the Holy Ghost Etneral and yet they are not Three Eternals but One Eternal. As also there are not Three Uncreated, nor Three Incomprehensibles, but One Uncreated, and One Uncomprehensible. So likewise the Father is Almighty, the Son Almighty, and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet they are not Three Almighties but One Almighty.
So the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet they are not Three Gods, but One God. So likewise the Father is Lord, the Son Lord, and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not Three Lords but One Lord. For, like as we are compelled by the Christian verity to acknowledge every Person by Himself to be God and Lord, so are we forbidden by the Catholic Religion to say, there be Three Gods or Three Lords. The Father is made of none, neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created, but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father, and of the Son neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding.

So there is One Father, not Three Fathers; one Son, not Three Sons; One Holy Ghost, not Three Holy Ghosts. And in this Trinity none is afore or after Other, None is greater or less than Another, but the whole Three Persons are Co-eternal together, and Co-equal. So that in all things, as is aforesaid, the Unity is Trinity, and the Trinity is Unity is to be worshipped. He therefore that will be saved, must thus think of the Trinity.

Furthermore, it is necessary to everlasting Salvation, that he also believe rightly the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right Faith is, that we believe and confess, that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man.

God, of the substance of the Father, begotten before the worlds; and Man, of the substance of His mother, born into the world. Perfect God and Perfect Man, of a reasonable Soul and human Flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father as touching His Godhead, and inferior to the Father as touching His Manhood. Who, although He be God and Man, yet He is not two, but One Christ. One, not by conversion of the Godhead into Flesh, but by taking of the Manhood into God. One altogether, not by confusion of substance, but by Unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one Man, so God and Man is one Christ. Who suffered for our salvation, descended into Hell, rose again the third day from the dead. He ascended into Heaven, He sitteth on the right hand of the Father, God Almighty, from whence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead. At whose coming all men shall rise again with their bodies, and shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting, and they that have done evil into everlasting fire. This is the Catholic Faith, which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved.

The Trinity is a mystery of faith in the strict sense, one of the "mysteries that are hidden in God, which can never be known unless they are revealed by God". To be sure, God has left traces of his Trinitarian being in his work of creation and in his Revelation throughout the Old Testament. But his inmost Being as Holy Trinity is a mystery that is inaccessible to reason alone or even to Israel's faith before the Incarnation of God's Son and the sending of the Holy Spirit.

I don't suppose the Apostles taught you anything different.

 

[one_lost_coin]

This discussion was had over 1600 years ago why don't you just go and read it instead of going over the same territory. You have no new information and all the alternatives were considered and found to be in error including the modalistic one offered at the beginning of this thread.

 

[stovebolts]

MEC,
Let's not turn this into a debate against the Trinity. Debates belong in the AP or Debate forum.

Thank you,

 

[BFSmith764]

[quote="one_lost_coin":69312]The definition you have proposed for the Holy Spirit has already been condemned as a heresy known as modalism over 1600 years ago and is completely at odds with the understanding of the Trinity accepted by the vast majority of Christian church's today and throughout history.

You will seriously want to stop using it, I offer this lovingly because I also thought along those lines for a short time as I was trying to grasp so great a teaching as the Doctrine of the Trinity, then someone pointed the error of modality out to me.

One would need to prove that it's heresy, from the Bible; I care not about the opinion of those if it cannot be supported from the scriptures. The truth has nothing to do with what is accepted by the majority; spiritual truth comes from God's word. So if someone wants to prove that what I or someone else is saying is false, it must be done from the Bible, and not from what most people believe. Besides, I never used that word "Modalism", I simply quoted a few scriptures, which explained what the tree natures of God (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) is, you either believe what it says or reject it.

My advice to anyone is this, if you find that what you have come to believe and accept contradicts what the scriptures tells us, then we should reject that belief for what God's word is telling us. Remember Jesus said that we cannot serve two masters.

First He taught them to recognize in Himself the Eternal Son of God. When His ministry was drawing to a close, He promised that the Father would send another Divine Person, the Holy Spirit, in His place. Finally after His resurrection, He revealed the doctrine in explicit terms, bidding them "go and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost" (Matthew 28:18). The force of this passage is decisive. That "the Father" and "the Son" are distinct Persons follows from the terms themselves, which are mutually exclusive. The mention of the Holy Spirit in the same series, the names being connected one with the other by the conjunctions "and . . . and" is evidence that we have here a Third Person co-ordinate with the Father and the Son, and excludes altogether the supposition that the Apostles understood the Holy Spirit not as a distinct Person, but as God viewed in His action on creatures.

The phrase "in the name" (eis to onoma) affirms alike the Godhead of the Persons and their unity of nature. Among the Jews and in the Apostolic Church the Divine name was representative of God. He who had a right to use it was invested with vast authority: for he wielded the supernatural powers of Him whose name he employed. It is incredible that the phrase "in the name" should be here employed, were not all the Persons mentioned equally Divine. Moreover, the use of the singular, "name," and not the plural, shows that these Three Persons are that One Omnipotent God in whom the Apostles believed. Indeed the unity of God is so fundamental a tenet alike of the Hebrew and of the Christian religion, and is affirmed in such countless passages of the Old and New Testaments, that any explanation inconsistent with this doctrine would be altogether inadmissible.[/quote:69312]

Not withstanding, nothing that you have said disprove my point, because I never said that the Father, Son and Holy Spirit were not distinct, in fact the scriptures that I posted only proved that they are. Also, while the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are distinct, they are also one.

Jesus and the Father are one

John 10:30 (BBE)
30 I and my Father are one.

Greek Strong's Number: 1520
One:
Greek Word: εἷÂ
Transliteration: heis
Phonetic Pronunciation:hice
Root: (including the neuter [etc.] hen)
Cross Reference: TDNT - 2:434,214
Part of Speech: numeral
Vine's Words: One, Other



(including the neuter [etc.] hen); a primary numeral; one :- a (-n, -ny, certain), + abundantly, man, one (another), only, other, some. See also <G1527> (heis kath' heis), <G3367> (medeis), <G3391> (mia), <G3762> (oudeis).
Strong's Talking Greek & Hebrew Dictionary.

Jesus and the Father lives in each other

John 10:38 (ASV)
38 But if I do them, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.

The Holy Spirit is of God or God

Matthew 10:20 (ASV)
20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you.

Jesus had the Spirit of God

Matthew 12:28 (ASV)
28 But if I by the Spirit of God cast out demons, then is the kingdom of God come upon you.

So the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit are one as the above scriptures shows, but at the same time it also shows that they are distinct.

So the scriptures do support my argument because I use the scriptures to prove that the Holy Spirit is God in action, and Jesus is God's mind and utterance (Greek: Logos- Word), and the Father is the one uttering. Without this understanding the oneness of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit will be a mystery.

 

[BFSmith764]

Imagician asks "What does TRINITY offer that is BETTER than a relationship WITHOUT IT?"

The truth of God.

modalism is proclaime as a heresy so that we may be brought into the truth of who God is and not waste our time with false beliefs.
the Apostles never taught the heresy of modalism.

From your post Its pretty clear you don't know what the doctrine of the Trinity is. Our anything about the Apostolic Church.

Athanasian Creed

(and spare me I dont believe any in a creed. it is from the Latin credo, "I believe" so unless you believe nothing, than you believe something therefor you have a creed.)

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith. Which Faith except everyone do keep whole and undefiled, without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the Catholic Faith is this, that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity. Neither confounding the Persons, nor dividing the Substance. For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son, and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son and of the Holy Ghost is all One, the Glory Equal, the Majesty Co-Eternal. Such as the Father is, such is the Son, and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father Uncreate, the Son Uncreate, and the Holy Ghost Uncreate. The Father Incomprehensible, the Son Incomprehensible, and the Holy Ghost Incomprehensible. The Father Eternal, the Son Eternal, and the Holy Ghost Etneral and yet they are not Three Eternals but One Eternal. As also there are not Three Uncreated, nor Three Incomprehensibles, but One Uncreated, and One Uncomprehensible. So likewise the Father is Almighty, the Son Almighty, and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet they are not Three Almighties but One Almighty.
So the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet they are not Three Gods, but One God. So likewise the Father is Lord, the Son Lord, and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not Three Lords but One Lord. For, like as we are compelled by the Christian verity to acknowledge every Person by Himself to be God and Lord, so are we forbidden by the Catholic Religion to say, there be Three Gods or Three Lords. The Father is made of none, neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created, but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father, and of the Son neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding.

So there is One Father, not Three Fathers; one Son, not Three Sons; One Holy Ghost, not Three Holy Ghosts. And in this Trinity none is afore or after Other, None is greater or less than Another, but the whole Three Persons are Co-eternal together, and Co-equal. So that in all things, as is aforesaid, the Unity is Trinity, and the Trinity is Unity is to be worshipped. He therefore that will be saved, must thus think of the Trinity.

Furthermore, it is necessary to everlasting Salvation, that he also believe rightly the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right Faith is, that we believe and confess, that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man.

God, of the substance of the Father, begotten before the worlds; and Man, of the substance of His mother, born into the world. Perfect God and Perfect Man, of a reasonable Soul and human Flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father as touching His Godhead, and inferior to the Father as touching His Manhood. Who, although He be God and Man, yet He is not two, but One Christ. One, not by conversion of the Godhead into Flesh, but by taking of the Manhood into God. One altogether, not by confusion of substance, but by Unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one Man, so God and Man is one Christ. Who suffered for our salvation, descended into Hell, rose again the third day from the dead. He ascended into Heaven, He sitteth on the right hand of the Father, God Almighty, from whence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead. At whose coming all men shall rise again with their bodies, and shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting, and they that have done evil into everlasting fire. This is the Catholic Faith, which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved.

The Trinity is a mystery of faith in the strict sense, one of the "mysteries that are hidden in God, which can never be known unless they are revealed by God". To be sure, God has left traces of his Trinitarian being in his work of creation and in his Revelation throughout the Old Testament. But his inmost Being as Holy Trinity is a mystery that is inaccessible to reason alone or even to Israel's faith before the Incarnation of God's Son and the sending of the Holy Spirit.

I don't suppose the Apostles taught you anything different.

And you will never find any of the apostles using the word Trinity in their letters to the Church either.

One tries to argue against the very scriptures that I post showing the Holy Spirit in action, and the Son, who was called the Word/utterance and the Father, whom Jesus said He proceeded from. How very interesting that that these scriptures are so hard for some of us to accept.

 

[one_lost_coin]

It is becoming obvious you are not Christian and you are probably a JW and that you are quoting from page 406 of the book you are given that tells you what to believe. Oh yes I have what you are allowed to think right in front of me.

Every sentence in what I sent you is true and supported by the bible.

If I thought you were looking for the truth I would go through it line by line but you seem to be a minister of propaganda. I know you are not allowed to listen to anything but what the watchtower tells you and no dialog can occur without an mind and heart open to listening to what another is actually saying and listening to God through prayer.

Now that I am beginning to see your agenda I will be checking in periodically to the threads you start and I will be posting on them that you are a JW and do not represent Christian beliefs so others will be discouraged to not waste anytime with you.

 

[BFSmith764]

It is becoming obvious you are not Christian and you are probably a JW and that you are quoting from page 406 of the book you are given that tells you what to believe. Oh yes I have what you are allowed to think right in front of me.

Every sentence in what I sent you is true and supported by the bible.

If I thought you were looking for the truth I would go through it line by line but you seem to be a minister of propaganda. I know you are not allowed to listen to anything but what the watchtower tells you and no dialog can occur without an mind and heart open to listening to what another is actually saying and listening to God through prayer.

Now that I am beginning to see your agenda I will be checking in periodically to the threads you start and I will be posting on them that you are a JW and do not represent Christian beliefs so others will be discouraged to not waste anytime with you.

Oh really...I still find it interesting that those who have a problem with the scriptures that I post respond with something that they were taught form someone else; they have no scriptures appart from their own doctrine. Now I'm also being judged as a Jew and not a Christian; in fact I am being judged a Jew who is reader of the watchtower and not a Christian.

 

[Imagican]

BF,

Actually you are being accused of being a Jehovah's Witness, (JW). Anyone that refutes 'trinity' as defined by the CC is deemed by those that accept it as JW's.

The funny part is that from what I have read on this thread, you DO believe in 'trinity'. So an accusation against you of being a JW couldn't be further from the TRUTH.

MEC

 

[BFSmith764]

BF,

Actually you are being accused of being a Jehovah's Witness, (JW). Anyone that refutes 'trinity' as defined by the CC is deemed by those that accept it as JW's.

The funny part is that from what I have read on this thread, you DO believe in 'trinity'. So an accusation against you of being a JW couldn't be further from the TRUTH.

MEC

It's a shame when those who claim to believe that they are a Christian, but are so quick to judge (not that all judgement is wrong) and put false label on others, yet Jesus whom they claim to believe and seek to obey tells us not to judge others, the way that some of us do.

How is it that you are able to know that I believe in the Trinity, yet those who would make false accusation against me don't know this?

All I was trying to do is to get people to look at what the Bible has to say about the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit, and not just regurgitate what they have been taught in Church....the truth is the truth even if no one believes it, and even false believe can be accepted by mainstream Christianity…in fact there are many false teaching among mainstream Christianity, because like so many tradition is more important than truth.

We could all learn a lesion from the people of Berea.

Acts 17:10-11 (NKJV)
10 Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews.
11 These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.

It’s the scriptures that we should be searching to prove what we or someone is saying to see if it is Biblically sound and not some creed or doctrine that was not part of God’s word.