and the moon into blood

[Hitch]

17And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: 18And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.







What kind of an ignorant fool would say this prophecy has come to pass?


14But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:
15For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;



Oh never mind.

 

[Stormcrow]

17And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: 18And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.







What kind of an ignorant fool would say this prophecy has come to pass?


14But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:
15For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;



Oh never mind.

You're not one to tiptoe around sleeping dogs, are you?

 

[Hitch]

I actually had a Baptist friend explain this by claiming that Pete was mistaken.:o

 

[reba]

:toofunny

 

[Stormcrow]

I actually had a Baptist friend explain this by claiming that Pete was mistaken.:o

I wonder how closely your Baptist friend walked with Christ when He was teaching His disciples in Judea to know that.

(Still waiting for someone to take your bait! )

 

[warhorse]

17And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: 18And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.








What kind of an ignorant fool would say this prophecy has come to pass?


14But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:
15For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;



Oh never mind.

Keep it in perspective hitch, this was at pentacost, the holy spirit was poured out and the gifts were manifested with vibrance right away. Peter was simply pointing to the prophacies of Joel 2 to show were these events were amongst the prophacies.

 

[Hitch]

Keep it in perspective hitch, this was at pentacost, the holy spirit was poured out and the gifts were manifested with vibrance right away. Peter was simply pointing to the prophacies of Joel 2 to show were these events were amongst the prophacies.

16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

That is as definitive as it gets, but hey its not like we should listen to the apostles when we have you right?

Please share your insight and tell us which part of Joel's word is concerned with the speaking in tongues. You do know dont you?

But you're right ,,Who was Pete anyway and its not as though Acts is inspired, probably it was a lucky guess.

 

[Vic C.]

I actually had a Baptist friend explain this by claiming that Pete was mistaken.:o

I've had people suggest there is a separation between Acts 2:18 and 19.

 

[AslanApostle]

I heard that the moon can appear reddish/pink due to dust clouds

 

[warhorse]

qs

16But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;

That is as definitive as it gets, but hey its not like we should listen to the apostles when we have you right?

Please share your insight and tell us which part of Joel's word is concerned with the speaking in tongues. You do know dont you?

But you're right ,,Who was Pete anyway and its not as though Acts is inspired, probably it was a lucky guess.

Look you open the book with the inclination to believe that the bible is old and complete, and when you read a verse like that you read it all as complete. I look at the bible as alive and vibrant, so when i read it, i see events in process. Others look to it with hopefull expectations, and read it all, as if it where to come. It is the pouring out of the holy spirit that peter is showing fullfilled, looking toward to the events of the heavens to come.

 

[Hitch]

Re: qs

Look you open the book with the inclination to believe that the bible is old and complete, and when you read a verse like that you read it all as complete. I look at the bible as alive and vibrant, so when i read it, i see events in process. Others look to it with hopefull expectations, and read it all, as if it where to come. It is the pouring out of the holy spirit that peter is showing fullfilled, looking toward to the events of the heavens to come.

It must be tough for you guys when every time frame and apostolic interpretation puts you beyond orthodoxy. Too bad :biglol

 

[Hitch]

I've had people suggest there is a separation between Acts 2:18 and 19.

I heard there is a gap between Gen 1 and 2.

 

[warhorse]

Re: qs

It must be tough for you guys when every time frame and apostolic interpretation puts you beyond orthodoxy. Too bad :biglol

I dont have any problems with Gods timing or orthodoxy. 1000 years of events, Just dont fit into a 3 1/2 year event. You have assumed that all events of revelation were completed shortly, Instead of the more reasonable position that those events started shortly. I dont ascribe to the gap theory, Daniels 70 weeks are indeed complete. And there is no gap between Gen 1 and 2, evolution is bunk. The concept of interpreting scripture according to the then current audeance is incorrect. It should be interpreted in context according to Gods perspective!!!

 

[Hitch]

Re: qs

I dont have any problems with Gods timing or orthodoxy. 1000 years of events, Just dont fit into a 3 1/2 year event. You have assumed that all events of revelation were completed shortly, Instead of the more reasonable position that those events started shortly. I dont ascribe to the gap theory, Daniels 70 weeks are indeed complete. And there is no gap between Gen 1 and 2, evolution is bunk. The concept of interpreting scripture according to the then current audeance is incorrect. It should be interpreted in context according to Gods perspective!!!

So how do you know what God's perspective of a year is?

 

[ivanm]

Hi All,
This maybe of interest to some.
God bless...ivanm
More coming after Rare Midnight Solar Eclipse

 

[warhorse]

Re: qs

So how do you know what God's perspective of a year is?

Gen 1v14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.

 

[warhorse]

Hi All,
This maybe of interest to some.
God bless...ivanm
More coming after Rare Midnight Solar Eclipse

Wow, thats very interesting, perhaps that explains why the hairs on the back of my neck have been standing tall for 6 years now.

 

[Hitch]

Re: qs

Gen 1v14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.

Ahhh so when God says 'years' He is speaking in terms that we as humans understand as years. Just as we understand ,from our perspective when He says 'night' or 'day'. And when He says 'soon' is it equally as understandable.

 

[jasoncran]

the word day(yom) is only taken as a day when preceded by a number. otherwise its an indefinite period. as in age. or aeon.

 

[Drew]

I believe that Christians err when they read Biblical texts containing end of the world language – stars falling, the moon turning red, earthquakes, splitting mountains, etc. – and take such language literally. One common manifestation of this involves interpreting prophetic texts that use such language as having “end of the time†events as their referent - when it is believed that there will indeed be such cataclysmic events. Such readers rule out the possibility that these prophecies have already been fulfilled by basically arguing “That could not have happened in the past, since the stars did not full or the moon did not turn redâ€.

This entire positions rests on a radical misunderstanding of how these texts are used in the Biblical tradition. We know for a fact that such language is not intended to be taken literally – it is a literary device used by the prophet to emphasize the theological significance of events that do not involve the end of the world but rather changes in the socio-political order, the rise and fall of specific nations and empires. There are many examples of this. Consider this from Isaiah 13:

10For the stars of heaven and their constellations
Will not flash forth their light;
The sun will be dark when it rises
And the moon will not shed its light

What was going on? Babylon was being destroyed, never to be rebuilt – check the context and consider the historical record. The world was not coming to an end and we are not take this text literally.

Here is another example from Isaiah concerning the fate of the nation of the Edomites:

And all the host of heaven will wear away,
And the sky will be rolled up like a scroll;
All their hosts will also wither away
As a leaf withers from the vine,
Or as one withers from the fig tree.
5For (K)My sword is satiated in heaven,
Behold it shall descend for judgment upon Edom

Has this prophecy already been fulfilled? Was Edom defeated? The historical record indicates that it indeed has. Did the sky roll up? Did the stars (the “host of the skyâ€) stop shining (wither away)? No, in both cases. But it doesn’t matter anyway. The point is that judgement specific to a nation is described in these globally apocalyptic terms. If the end of the world languages is taken literally, then it is not only Edom that is being judged, but the entire world. And yet it is otherwise clear that this is material specific to Edom. Consequently, we must see the end of the world language as being metaphorical.

Here is another example from yet a different prophet – Ezekiel:

2"Son of man, take up a lamentation over Pharaoh king of Egypt and say to him,
'You compared yourself to a young lion of the nations,
Yet you are like the monster in the seas;
And you burst forth in your rivers
And muddied the waters with your feet
And fouled their rivers.'"
3Thus says the Lord GOD,
"Now I will spread My net over you
With a company of many peoples,
And they shall lift you up in My net.
4"I will leave you on the land;
I will cast you on the open field.
And I will cause all the birds of the heavens to dwell on you,
And I will satisfy the beasts of the whole earth with you.
5"I will lay your flesh on the mountains
And fill the valleys with your refuse.
6"I will also make the land drink the discharge of your (I)blood
As far as the mountains,
And the ravines will be full of you.
7"And when I extinguish you,
I will cover the heavens and darken their stars;
I will cover the sun with a cloud
And the moon will not give its light.
8"All the shining lights in the heavens
I will darken over you
And will set darkness on your land,"
Declares the Lord GOD.

Again, the material in verses 7 and 8, if not earlier verses, is not to be taken literally. If it were, judgement specific to Pharoah would be carried out against the entire world – you cannot cover the sun and darken the stars for Egypt only.

Jesus was born into this tradition, he was steeped in this tradition. No first century Jew (who knew his Old Testament) listening to the discourse of Mark 13 (or its parallels) would take such language literally as denoting literal end of the world events. He would have interpreted such language in accordance with Biblical precedent – as a literary device to ascribe theological significance to non end of the world events.

Isaiah uses end of the world language. What is his real intent? To describe judgement against Babylon and Edom, not worldwide “end of the world†judgement.

Ezekiel uses end of the world language. What is his real intent. To describe judgement against Egypt, not worldwide “end of the world†judgement.

So when Jesus uses such language in the New Testament, we need to remember the cultural convention of His day re how that language would be read. Such statements are not to be taken literally.