Are you motivated by fear?

[Christ_empowered]

Its not just Hell...I rightly fear God's wrath in general. Increasingly, I'm becoming aware that my behavior either pleases the one, true Living God or it doesn't.

The Fear of The Lord is the beginning of all wisdom. That's in there somewhere, I promise. To ignore God's wrath is to ignore part of the reason Christ's sinless birth, life, ministry, unjust state-sanctioned murder on The Cross and then subsequent resurrection and ascension were necessary in the first place.

If some apparition appeared and told me that there's no heaven and hell, like that old John Lennon song, I'd ask him/her to leave me be. All human beings are born facing Hell. All of us need to be saved from sin, satan, self, death, and the world. Jesus saves us from God's wrath and works out inner transformation as we walk with Him.

When I first got saved, fear was a big motivator. So was the understanding that I'd messed up, royally, from day #1. Now....my understanding of Christ and Christianity is a good bit different. That's normal, I think; you call out to God and then you grow and see things more clearly. In 5-10 years, I'll see a bit more clearly and hopefully will bear fruit, have more Christ-like character, etc....

So...yeah. Healthy fear is a good thing. We're told to fear our gov't authorities, for instance. :We're also told that there will be rewards in Heaven for Christ-like behavior. That doesn't mean Christianity is behavioral modification, it just means that we'll answer to God and He'll judge as appropriately, and we should be ready for that.

 

[Willie T]

BTW boys, the little story doesn't read the way you are trying to squirm around and claim. Read the third, fourth, and fifth words.

To say this has to be an apparition, or to say you would quote scripture at Him, is to say that you do not believe that Jesus could appear to you. Now, admittedly, He probably WOULDN'T appear to you (who could blame Him?), but it has happened in the past to several people in the Bible.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here. We all already know he said it was "hypothetical", not real, nor even his belief...... but the question he asked WAS real. And you seem to have tried using a churchy-sounding statement to avoid looking at the pretty straight-forward and difficult question.

Even hypothetically, it is a misnomer.
You cannot imagine something happen that cannot happen.

 

[Gary]

Even hypothetically, it is a misnomer.
You cannot imagine something happen that cannot happen.

Sure you can. I can't turn the air we breath into water, but I can imagine what the world would be like if I could. We'd all be under water.
.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Sure you can. I can't turn the air we breath into water, but I can imagine what the world would be like if I could. We'd all be under water.
.

But I cannot imagine Jesus telling us that he lied to us.
Can you?

 

[Willie T]

Even hypothetically, it is a misnomer.
You cannot imagine something happen that cannot happen.

Humm..... like Lazarus walking out of the grave? We foolish humans make a habit of deciding what can and what can't happen in God's universe.

 

[Gary]

But I cannot imagine Jesus telling us that he lied to us.
Can you?

You are correct.
.

 

[Gary]

Well, some of us are shotgunning all over the place..................

It still remains to answer for ourselves that if there were no consequences, whatsoever, would we still live the way we try to now?

I, for one, have to honestly answer..... "Probably not."

I think I would. Regardless if there's consequences or not, we still have the less fortunate.
.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Humm..... like Lazarus walking out of the grave? We foolish humans make a habit of deciding what can and what can't happen in God's universe.

Titus 1:2;
"...in the hope of eternal life, which God, who does not lie, promised before the beginning of time".
It is not I, who is making a foolish reply.
It must be someone else.

 

[Gary]

BTW boys, the little story doesn't read the way you are trying to squirm around and claim. Read the third, fourth, and fifth words.

To say this has to be an apparition, or to say you would quote scripture at Him, is to say that you do not believe that Jesus could appear to you. Now, admittedly, He probably WOULDN'T appear to you (who could blame Him?), but it has happened in the past to several people in the Bible.

How many did He lie to?
.

 

[jasonc]

one can start with fear, then go to respect and then move unto love which will have respect in that you love daddy enough not to want to anger, betray , disappoint him and also want to please him.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I think my walk with The Lord is moving along about how jasonc describes. First I was (understandably) scared, now its more respect mixed with the beginnings of love...with more study, prayer, some fellowship and growth...I may move onto love (here's hoping).

Anyway, I just think its perfectly OK to be scared of God's wrath. Isn't that how The Great Awakening preachers in America first planted seeds? Yes, people; Hell is real. Repent now!

I think lingering in fear indicates a lack of growth. Could be due to lack of discipling, of course, which seems to be a real problem in today's churches (maybe it always has been, I dunno). Fear of The Lord is the *beginning* of wisdom. After you wise up to your fallen state, I guess its uneven progress towards a better relationship with The Father, The son, The Holy Spirit, others, and self.

 

[Edward]

This is a good question, though it may be being over-complicated with details. Ok, hypothetically...

No, I wouldn't go back to being who I was yesterday. I have to credit my earthly dad there. When I was young, he taught me such things as, when you stop being better, you stop being good. Which means to be a better man today than you were yesterday, or you're not trying and dropped the ball...honor. We have to walk in honor. You hardly ever hear that word from people anymore, but it's important...labels, he taught me that if you do certain things, you get labeled, and labels stick for a loooong time. There's been many time when I was thinking about doing something, and thought...do I want to be that guy? No. So I didn't. honesty... he also taught me that honesty is always the best for several reasons. You wont have to try to remember all the lies you told, the truth even if it hurts the other is still better because it lets them know what the real score is so one can deal with it effectively without wasting time, and it shows that no matter what, even if you don't like it, that you can count on what comes out of the others mouth. That old cliche about whats worse, a truth that brings a tear, or a lie that brings a smile...is a lie and a deception, tell the truth!

My wife hated that about me. I was always harping on being honest. She said I was like a human lie detector. She liked to lie. Even about inconsequential things, I never understood that. and all this when I was not walking with the Lord! Not patting myself on the back, just saying...it's good to be a good guy and one that walks in honor.

one can start with fear, then go to respect and then move unto love which will have respect in that you love daddy enough not to want to anger, betray , disappoint him and also want to please him.

This is how it went for me also.

 

[Edward]

Hmm....
There are many secular people who believe they should not do anything to hurt other people and should do everything they can to make this world a better place for all people to live in and they don't believe in heaven or hell.
Paul says this....
1Co 15:30 why also do we stand in peril every hour?
1Co 15:31 Every day do I die, by the glorying of you that I have in Christ Jesus our Lord:
1Co 15:32 if after the manner of a man with wild beasts I fought in Ephesus, what the advantage to me if the dead do not rise? let us eat and drink, for to-morrow we die!

Paul says that it would be pointless for him to put his life in danger on a daily bases if there is no resurrection. He says that if there is no resurrection then we are still in our sin anyway.
Well, how can that be. Christ rose and we follow in like fashion to Him. If we don't then He didn't either.
So even though I understand what you are saying it just doesn't make any sense to say that would we keep doing what we are doing if there was no resurrection because if there isn't then there is no Gospel message. It is destroyed.
For me the resurrection is not about rewards in heaven but it is about someday being with Him.
I never thought is was OK to hurt other people before I became a Christian. But I did think it was OK to not put up with people hurting me. That is the difference in me.
So if there is no resurrection there is no point in me putting up with people hurting me.

Agreed. me too. I was all into righteous revenge, semi-lawful, but go for the throat. If they done me wrong, watch out. Now...I'm (slowly) learning that, that isn't right. It's hard at times too because I was good at it, and the satisfaction that came from getting someone back was...satisfying.

 

[hallowbonnie]

Fear never drew me to God his love did I had no clue someone could love me like that and show up for me in a way no human ever had.Plenty of humans have used fear to try to control me though...plenty.I became a christian at 17 and deep inside I had a craving for something solid for something to lead me with consistency.

 

[Blake]

Fear of Hell was a primary motivator early on, but it was replaced with a fear of losing sight of God. (Isaiah 59:2) Ever since I matured in Christ and became fire baptized I've feared grieving the Spirit and removing myself from His Presence. I believe in God's great and abundant mercies, but grieving the Spirit is a lonely road, when your tears dry up and your prayers become weak, and your communion feels shallow and your life feels without purpose... I fear losing that.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

one can start with fear, then go to respect and then move unto love which will have respect in that you love daddy enough not to want to anger, betray , disappoint him and also want to please him.

Fear is the beginning of wisdom, as Christ_empowered pointed out. Love is the mature end of wisdom.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Fear of Hell was a primary motivator early on, but it was replaced with a fear of losing sight of God. (Isaiah 59:2) Ever since I matured in Christ and became fire baptized I've feared grieving the Spirit and removing myself from His Presence. I believe in God's great and abundant mercies, but grieving the Spirit is a lonely road, when your tears dry up and your prayers become weak, and your communion feels shallow and your life feels without purpose... I fear losing that.

This is what it's all about for me, too. I got saved because I did not want to be separated from God when I died. And I stay in God's grace because I do not want to be separated from his manifest love and presence. I fear being in the condition of not having God's love and comfort filling my soul.

 

[Deborah13]

Agreed. me too. I was all into righteous revenge, semi-lawful, but go for the throat. If they done me wrong, watch out. Now...I'm (slowly) learning that, that isn't right. It's hard at times too because I was good at it, and the satisfaction that came from getting someone back was...satisfying.

I wasn't a revengeful person I just would only take so much and then I was done with them. There are times when the Lord will rescue someone out of a situation but in most cases we are called to endure and just keep, keeping on. Either way we must forgive. I don't think that means just not wishing to do them harm but to actually care for them and pray that the Lord blesses them. The Lord showed me, in a very powerful way, that when we do this He blesses us.