Can you be saved without a priest?

[donadams]

So what is the point of having priests? Only Jesus can forgive. Saying man can forgive is blasphemy.

Jesus the only savior is eternal high priest, the answer is no, you cannot be saved without a priest

But men in the true church, kingdom, and new covenant of Grace have always had the gift of offering the eternal sacrifice of Christ and administering the seven sacraments including the forgiveness of sin! Thanks

Sacramental life of the Christian church: I come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. Jn 10:10 Jn 1:16-17

Baptism: (initiation into the covenant)
Mk 16:16 Jn 3:5 acts 2:38-39 8:36
1 Corinthians 12:13 2 pet 1:11
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

The Eucharist: (holy communion)
Mt 26:26-39 Jn 6:51-58 1 Cor 11:23-25

Confession of sins:
Jn 20:23 / 1 Jn 1:9 / 2 cor 5:18

Confirmation
Lk 22:32 acts 8:14-17
acts 14:22

Marriage:
Matt 19:4-6

Holy orders: (priesthood)
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru His priesthood in Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 10:1-8 Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13
Jn 20:21-22 acts 1:17 acts 6:4 acts 8:26
2 Cor 5:18 1 Tim 4:14 Eph 2:20

Extreme unction: (anointing with oil)
1 Tim 4:14 James 5:14

The ark of salvation: one, holy, catholic, (universal) and apostolic church founded by Jesus Christ on Peter and the apostles!

 

[donadams]

Any questions feel free to ask

 

[Ignatius]

Can you be saved without a priest?

Yes.
Priests however are essential to the spiritual life as they act "in persona Christi". This is no different than the apostles being sent out to heal and loose and bind sin.

 

[GodsGrace]

Jesus the only savior is eternal high priest, the answer is no, you cannot be saved without a priest

But men in the true church, kingdom, and new covenant of Grace have always had the gift of offering the eternal sacrifice of Christ and administering the seven sacraments including the forgiveness of sin! Thanks

Sacramental life of the Christian church: I come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly. Jn 10:10 Jn 1:16-17

Baptism: (initiation into the covenant)
Mk 16:16 Jn 3:5 acts 2:38-39 8:36
1 Corinthians 12:13 2 pet 1:11
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

The Eucharist: (holy communion)
Mt 26:26-39 Jn 6:51-58 1 Cor 11:23-25

Confession of sins:
Jn 20:23 / 1 Jn 1:9 / 2 cor 5:18

Confirmation
Lk 22:32 acts 8:14-17
acts 14:22

Marriage:
Matt 19:4-6

Holy orders: (priesthood)
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru His priesthood in Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 10:1-8 Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13
Jn 20:21-22 acts 1:17 acts 6:4 acts 8:26
2 Cor 5:18 1 Tim 4:14 Eph 2:20

Extreme unction: (anointing with oil)
1 Tim 4:14 James 5:14

The ark of salvation: one, holy, catholic, (universal) and apostolic church founded by Jesus Christ on Peter and the apostles!

It's not called Extreme Unction anymore.
It's called Annointing (or Healing) of the Sick.

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes.
Priests however are essential to the spiritual life as they act "in persona Christi". This is no different than the apostles being sent out to heal and loose and bind sin.

Would you care to explain what IN PERSONA CRISTI means?
(for those reading along).

 

[donadams]

It's not called Extreme Unction anymore.
It's called Annointing (or Healing) of the Sick.

Sorry but according to the apostolic council of Trent we are forbidden from believing that the sacraments may be changed!


CANON XIII.-If any one saith, that the received and approved rites of the Catholic Church, wont to be used in the solemn administration of the sacraments, may be contemned, or without sin be omitted at pleasure by the ministers, or be changed, by every pastor of the churches, into other new ones; let him be anathema.

Thanks

 

[GodsGrace]

Sorry but according to the apostolic council of Trent we are forbidden from believing that the sacraments may be changed!


CANON XIII.-If any one saith, that the received and approved rites of the Catholic Church, wont to be used in the solemn administration of the sacraments, may be contemned, or without sin be omitted at pleasure by the ministers, or be changed, by every pastor of the churches, into other new ones; let him be anathema.

Thanks

Don, you sure do get excited.

The church did not change the sacrament.
THE NAME has been changed.
It's not longer called LAST RITES or EXTREME UNCTION.

Changing the name of a Sacrament does not change the Sacrament.

Also, I think we need to update and not use the Council of Trent all the time.
Also, if this bothers you - hold on to your hat.

 

[Mr. G Lee]

Sorry but according to the apostolic council of Trent we are forbidden from believing that the sacraments may be changed!

No such thing as a apostolic council of dying mankind. That is simply the use of oral tradition of dying mankind

Apostles they are sent ones. . not highly venerable ones that lord it over the faith as a understanding of the non venerable show watchers

Christians venerate the living word of God, sola scriptura . . . .not the laws of the dying fathers.

Ceremonial laws every piece of furniture having a unseen value as that which the Catholic call sacraments.They are shadow of the unseen eternal. . . they pointed ahead of the suffering of Christ beforehand and the glory that did follow the three day and night demonstration.

I would offer. . . . . . . . . 1 Timothy 1:7-1 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ: Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

The empty shadows disappeared . Worshiping shadows vanity, vanity, vanity.

we look back by the glorious Spirit of prophecy. they looked ahead by the same spirt of faith (Chrisdt's)

Ceremonial laws were necessary as a sign to al the ubeliving nations of the world . believers have prophecy .They did nothing to the user. . not self edifying I did it, it proves it

When Aaron's two sons had a desire to join the priesthood they were baptized with the water of the word to show the work of the unseen Holy Spirit .

They taking it upon themselves added thier personal touch in a hope of 15 minutes of name it claim worldly fame.

They using strange unauthorized fire. It consumed them not a hint of smoke on the ceremonial clothing. sacraments have no value in removing sin

 

[donadams]

No such thing as a apostolic council of dying mankind. That is simply the use of oral tradition of dying mankind

Apostles they are sent ones. . not highly venerable ones that lord it over the faith as a understanding of the non venerable show watchers

Christians venerate the living word of God, sola scriptura . . . .not the laws of the dying fathers.

Ceremonial laws every piece of furniture having a unseen value as that which the Catholic call sacraments.They are shadow of the unseen eternal. . . they pointed ahead of the suffering of Christ beforehand and the glory that did follow the three day and night demonstration.

I would offer. . . . . . . . . 1 Timothy 1:7-1 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ: Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

The empty shadows disappeared . Worshiping shadows vanity, vanity, vanity.

we look back by the glorious Spirit of prophecy. they looked ahead by the same spirt of faith (Chrisdt's)

Ceremonial laws were necessary as a sign to al the ubeliving nations of the world . believers have prophecy .They did nothing to the user. . not self edifying I did it, it proves it

When Aaron's two sons had a desire to join the priesthood they were baptized with the water of the word to show the work of the unseen Holy Spirit .

They taking it upon themselves added thier personal touch in a hope of 15 minutes of name it claim worldly fame.

They using strange unauthorized fire. It consumed them not a hint of smoke on the ceremonial clothing. sacraments have no value in removing sin

The saints of our God are not dead!

God of the living!

Matthew 22:32
I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

Jn 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

 

[Mr. G Lee]

The saints of our God are not dead!

God of the living!

Matthew 22:32
I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

Jn 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

Yes they are dead asleep waiting for the last bugle the wake up call.

God's living abiding word defines the word saints .The"us" in Christ not the "us" of the church dying mankind . God defines the us . not a traditions of men called patron saints .

He revealed his saints while he was still adding to his book of prophecy sealed with 7 seals til the end of time under the Sun . Satan is still active as the king of lying signs to wonder after will be with all power to deceive until the last day.

Jesus prophesied it's a evil generation (non converted mankind) that seeks after a sign before they will believe.

Christians must be careful especially in this day of Zoom . As technology increase so does the possibility of sin. . it never says enough .Christian look forward to the new incorruptible bodies no desire to sin .

2 Thessalonian 2 :7-11 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

And yes (John 11:25) whosoever believes in the living word of the Holy Father in heaven. . . even though we have no power living in bodies of death, His living word will lift us up to both hear and empower us to do to will of the Holy Father . It (sola scriptura) has the power of life and death

 

[GodsGrace]

Yes they are dead asleep waiting for the last bugle the wake up call.

God's living abiding word defines the word saints .The"us" in Christ not the "us" of the church dying mankind . God defines the us . not a traditions of men called patron saints .

He revealed his saints while he was still adding to his book of prophecy sealed with 7 seals til the end of time under the Sun . Satan is still active as the king of lying signs to wonder after will be with all power to deceive until the last day.

Jesus prophesied it's a evil generation (non converted mankind) that seeks after a sign before they will believe.

Christians must be careful especially in this day of Zoom . As technology increase so does the possibility of sin. . it never says enough .Christian look forward to the new incorruptible bodies no desire to sin .

2 Thessalonian 2 :7-11 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

And yes (John 11:25) whosoever believes in the living word of the Holy Father in heaven. . . even though we have no power living in bodies of death, His living word will lift us up to both hear and empower us to do to will of the Holy Father . It (sola scriptura) has the power of life and death

You believe in soul sleep like the Jehovah Witnesses?

 

[Mr. G Lee]

You believe in soul sleep like the Jehovah Witnesses?

I am not sure how they look at death?

I do know it one of the most misunderstood doctrines especially because some have added the idea of life after we take our last breath called limbo and purgatory.

Our daily sufferings living in the bodies of death do end when we take our last breath.

Yoked with Christ the Christian sufferings of the pangs of hell is made lighter

Because it was so misunderstood Jesus the Son man wept at the believers unbelief. No faith coming from Christ.

John 11:35 Jesus wept.

He begins by saying it is the sickness . (not death) never to rise to new born again life .

John 11:4 When Jesus heard that, he said, This sickness is not unto death, but for the glory of God, that the Son of God might be glorified thereby.

Sickness living healable.

John 11:11-14 These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well. Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: (Dead asleep) but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead.
John 11:23-24-26 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again. Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, (Not that he is ) yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

The proof he was not dead whenn he heard the wake up (Lazarus rise) call he moved .

The wake up call Lazarus rise work needs to be done God does not speak to the dead departed saints that sme call patron saints Those who have ben born again they are sleeping waiting for the wake up call on the last day.

John 11:43 And when he thus had spoken, he cried with a loud voice, Lazarus, come forth.
I would question Catholicism the ones that added to our daily sufferings of hell. . a unknown time to wonder and suffer after.

They will not receive the wake up call on the last day. Having done despite to the fullness of grace the cost of redemption they need to create the illusion of saints still active on earth as patron saints, a legion of gods in the likeness of men

The unbeliever will not be awaken on the last day

Job 14:12 So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.

Psalm 3:5 I laid me down and slept; I awaked; for the Lord sustained me.

Jesus slept three days and nights before the father awoke him .By those stripes we are healed.

Isaiah 26:19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.

 

[GodsGrace]

I am not sure how they look at death?

JWs believe that when we die we just stay dead "sleep" until the resurrection.
They do not believe that our soul and spirit go to heaven (or hell).

I do know it one of the most misunderstood doctrines especially because some have added the idea of life after we take our last breath called limbo and purgatory.

Our daily sufferings living in the bodies of death do end when we take our last breath.

Yoked with Christ the Christian sufferings of the pangs of hell is made lighter

This sounds like you believe that we all go to hell.

Because it was so misunderstood Jesus the Son man wept at the believers unbelief. No faith coming from Christ.

John 11:35 Jesus wept.

He begins by saying it is the sickness . (not death) never to rise to new born again life .

John 11:4 When Jesus heard that, he said, This sickness is not unto death, but for the glory of God, that the Son of God might be glorified thereby.

Sickness living healable.

In John 11:4 Jesus meant that the girl would not die but would come back to life in order to glorify God to those that were attending the miracle He wrought.

John 11:11-14 These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well. Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: (Dead asleep) but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead.
John 11:23-24-26 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again. Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, (Not that he is ) yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

What does it mean to you that a person WILL NEVER DIE.
Jesus said that those that believe in Him will never die.

The proof he was not dead whenn he heard the wake up (Lazarus rise) call he moved .

The wake up call Lazarus rise work needs to be done God does not speak to the dead departed saints that sme call patron saints Those who have ben born again they are sleeping waiting for the wake up call on the last day.

So you do believe in soul sleep?
Sometimes it sounds like you do,
and sometimes it sounds like you don't.

John 11:43 And when he thus had spoken, he cried with a loud voice, Lazarus, come forth.
I would question Catholicism the ones that added to our daily sufferings of hell. . a unknown time to wonder and suffer after.

You worry too much about Catholics.

They will not receive the wake up call on the last day. Having done despite to the fullness of grace the cost of redemption they need to create the illusion of saints still active on earth as patron saints, a legion of gods in the likeness of men

The unbeliever will not be awaken on the last day

Everyone will be awakened on the last day in order to face judgement.
John 5:28

 

[Mr. G Lee]

JWs believe that when we die we just stay dead "sleep" until the resurrection.
They do not believe that our soul and spirit go to heaven (or hell).

Our spirit abides in the bosom of God it would refer to heaven. It is a place not seen today

This sounds like you believe that we all go to hell.

A suffering body that is as good as dead the Bible informs lives for 70 or 80 years. Christ daily strengthens those yoked with him.

Hebrews 11:12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable

Above. . .Even of one the Son of man, Jesus as good as dead

Our daily suffering is the work of hell . . . death as in dying. We pray give us the daily bread deliver us from the father of lies .What dead mankind needs is a new spirit by which they could be born of God . Those who are not born from above their sufferings is increased they have no strength coming from the gospel They perish never rise to new born again life

Not the imaginary hell created to make room for the suffering limbo and purgatory . . . no death just a body the will be resurrected the same as today .

There is no spirit life after one takes their last breath sufferings stops . no difference to what they call it sufferings is suffering.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Peter was found as a liar for trusting that John would not die he ran to town and began to display his false prophecy not sent by Christ as a true apostles but again deceived by the devil making him a false apostle . he was forgiven given of the blasphemy against the Son of man again Jesus did not say John would not die .

Jesus said of his own dying flesh it profits for nothing .What does profit is a born again spirit coming from the Holy Father of all spirt life

John21:21-25 Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do?Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

If every time Christ did the work of dispeling the lies of the father of lies and they were written down we would need a bigger planet to store the volumes upon volumes

Peter should've minded his business rather than doing the business of the father of lies Christ never gave up teaching Peter just like any. If he began that good work in us he promises he will finish til we take of last breath of oxygen

Everyone will be awakened on the last day in order to face judgement.
John 5:28

What judgment? double jeopardy retrial??? Death as in dying was the result of the first. Its appointed for all men to really die once . Why would some strike the rock twice

 

[Hopeful 2]

So what is the point of having priests? Only Jesus can forgive. Saying man can forgive is blasphemy.

You can forgive any sin committed against you.

 

[GodsGrace]

Our spirit abides in the bosom of God it would refer to heaven. It is a place not seen today

A suffering body that is as good as dead the Bible informs lives for 70 or 80 years. Christ daily strengthens those yoked with him.

Hebrews 11:12 Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable

Above. . .Even of one the Son of man, Jesus as good as dead

??
Hebrews 11:12 is stating that from one man, Abraham, there are now millions [because God kept His promise to Sarah and Abraham].

Our daily suffering is the work of hell . . . death as in dying. We pray give us the daily bread deliver us from the father of lies .What dead mankind needs is a new spirit by which they could be born of God . Those who are not born from above their sufferings is increased they have no strength coming from the gospel

Agreed.

They perish never rise to new born again life

Who perishes?
What does it mean to perish?

Not the imaginary hell created to make room for the suffering limbo and purgatory . . . no death just a body the will be resurrected the same as today .

You think hell is imaginary?
So you don't believe in hell?

There is no spirit life after one takes their last breath sufferings stops . no difference to what they call it sufferings is suffering.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

I'm not going to respond to the above because your position is not clear to me.

Peter was found as a liar for trusting that John would not die he ran to town and began to display his false prophecy not sent by Christ as a true apostles but again deceived by the devil making him a false apostle . he was forgiven given of the blasphemy against the Son of man again Jesus did not say John would not die .

I'm sorry, I just can't understand what you're speaking of.
Could you post scripture please.
When was Peter found to be a liar??

Jesus said of his own dying flesh it profits for nothing .What does profit is a born again spirit coming from the Holy Father of all spirt life

John21:21-25 Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do?Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

If every time Christ did the work of dispeling the lies of the father of lies and they were written down we would need a bigger planet to store the volumes upon volumes

Peter should've minded his business rather than doing the business of the father of lies Christ never gave up teaching Peter just like any. If he began that good work in us he promises he will finish til we take of last breath of oxygen

My goodness.
Jesus left Peter in charge of the new church.
Jesus gave Peter the keys to the Kingdom.
Keys represent authority.

What judgment? double jeopardy retrial??? Death as in dying was the result of the first. Its appointed for all men to really die once . Why would some strike the rock twice

What does John 5:28 mean to you?
Man dies one time and then comes the judgement.
Hebrews 9:27
"And just as it is appointed for mortals to die once, and after that the judgment,

 

[Mr. G Lee]

Jesus the only savior is eternal high priest, the answer is no, you cannot be saved without a priest

Can a person be saved by hearing the living word of God that works in us both to hear and to do the good will of the father. . . believing to His glory? Or do we glory in our own dying flesh working out ones own salvation?

Philipians 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings:

Who is it that works in you?