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Charismatic Bible Studies - 1 Peter 2:11-17

Hidden In Him

Charismatic
Staff member
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Winning Darkness Over To Light Through Love, Not Condemnation, Part 1

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Another Presidential election is almost here in the United States, and the ugliness and vitriol are at fever pitch once again. Demonic spirits are goading men into divisiveness and strife, and there seems to be no end to the bile spilling forth from both sides. Unfortunately, many Christians are getting seduced into this as well, and succumbing to the temptation to spread hatred, strife and contentiousness in the name of Christ rather than furthering the gospel by seeking to save the lost instead.

But alas, as the scripture says there is nothing new under the sun. Demons were goading zealous Jews to slander the Roman authorities back during New Testament times as well. They spoke out openly against Roman rule, and how heavy-handed they were in exercising rule over Judea. But the apostle Peter warned against giving in to such spirits, urging believers to honor their rulers instead:

11 Beloved, I beg you as sojourners and pilgrims, abstain from fleshly lusts which war against the soul, 12 having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. 13 Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme, 14 or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good. 15 For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men— 16 as free, yet not using liberty as a cloak for vice, but as bondservants of God. 17 Honor all people. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king. (1 Peter 2:11-17)

The apostle Paul taught the exact same thing, telling Timothy that this was to be the message he communicated to the churches:

1 I exhort, therefore, first of all that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men, 2 for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and reverence. 3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.... 8 I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and disputing. (1 Timothy 2:1-4, 8)

A quiet and peaceable life is what Christians were being taught to live, not one of protesting in the streets about how evil the governing authorities were. Roman solders were forcing Jews to stop their day and carry their armor for them for a mile, but Jesus did not teach to complain about how oppressive they were, He said, "If they tell you to walk with them a mile, walk with them two." Roman emperors were usually engaging in heavy taxation, and many Jews spoke out against it. But Jesus did not say to protest in the streets. The Pharisees even tried tricking Jesus into sinning like this to incriminate Him, asking if they should pay taxes to Caesar or not. But His response was, "Give unto Caesar what is Caesars, and give unto God what is God's." Maybe most shocking of all, both passages of scripture quoted above were written a few years after Nero began a campaign of persecution against Christians, where he was even burning some of them at the stake to light the fires to his dinner parties. But still they were being told to have their conduct honorable amongst the Gentiles, so that when others spoke out against them as evildoers who deserved such treatment, they might nevertheless observe their good conduct, and "glorify God in the day of visitation." Demons were lying to men, and inspiring them to commit great evils against Christians, but Peter and Paul urged to pray for all those in authority in all reverence, and silence these lies through their righteous and respectful conduct instead.


Today's Political Slander

Unfortunately these teachings have not transferred down well to the modern church, at least not in the United States anyway. Many on both the Right and the Left are succumbing to speaking evil of others continually, and making it appear as if they deserve whatever "evils" may come to them by how hatefully they speak against their political opponents and supporters. Instead of honoring leaders with their words, many Christians simply parrot the latest political rhetoric of the day, which is often so divisive there is little question where it is coming from.

The following hit piece from a month ago against Donald J. Trump, a former President of the United States, is a case in point. The continual insinuation throughout is that he will wage a war of terror against the Jews just like Hilter did in WWII if he loses the election.

Once upon a time, before he became Donald Trump’s running mate, JD Vance told his law school roommate he went “back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical ******* to that he’s America’s Hitler.” Obviously, the Ohio senator has since disavowed every negative thing he previously said about Trump. But he clearly shouldn’t have, particularly when it comes to the Hitler vibes, given all the wildly antisemitic remarks Trump has made on the campaign trail—including the comment he made last night re: whose fault it will be if he loses in November. Spoiler alert: It’s the Jews!

That’s right: At a campaign event on Thursday that was—wait for it—about denouncing antisemitism, the GOP nominee for president told the audience: “If I don’t win this election…the Jewish people would have a lot to do with a loss”... Blaming Jews for stuff was, of course, Adolf Hitler’s MO. The Nazi leader blamed German Jews for Germany’s defeat in World War I, claiming the tiny minority had “stabbed Germany in the back”—language that sounds not dissimilar to what Trump had to say yesterday, and not dissimilar to the things he’s said and done re: Jews for years now. (Donald Trump Gives Supporters The Green Light To Blame Jews If He Loses In November, Vanity Fair.com)


Hitler or course hated the Jews, and exterminated six million of them during WWII in the NAZI death camps. The insinuation then is that Trump is "green lighting" his followers to embrace the same sentiments. The problem with this argument is that the statements Trump made were in regard to imploring Jewish voters not to let him lose the election because he is the candidate who has always supported the nation of Israel, a claim which the facts bear out very clearly. But Vanity Fair doesn't want their readers knowing that. Instead Vanity Fair only wants their readers to hate and despise the former President, by depicting Trump as someone who advocates for practically rebuilding the NAZI death camps.

I have seen Christians on the Left parrot these things, without realizing they are receiving their thoughts from the enemy, but the same unfortunately goes for many on the Right. The following article written by a Christian woman, seeks to paint Vice President Kamala Harris in almost the same light:

Vice President Kamala Harris has barely announced her run for the presidency for 2024, but she’s already ticked off America’s number one ally, Israel. How so? By blaming Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu for killing “far too many” civilians in Gaza.

Jane, you ignorant slut. That’s called war — you blankedly blank blank Kamala... The problem is Democrats don’t recognize the existence of evil. They are either atheists and secularists, and therefore have zero belief in God and Satan and biblical concepts of good and evil; or they’re believers in God but not a devil and so think that with only the proper tools and education and economic opportunity, those with dark intents can be convinced to live the righteous life... Evil exists. It’s real, It comes as both a spiritual force and physical entity. And one such example of evil played out October 7 in Israel when a band of terrorists called Hamas swooped onto a field where a music festival was taking place and abducted, tortured, sexually assaulted and raped and brutally murdered scores of innocent Jewish men, women, girls, boys and babies, yes, babies. They did it because they were evil. They did it because they believe in an evil spirit and follow an evil faith that says their enemies must be killed, and their enemies’ nations eradicated, and that they will be rewarded in the afterlife for their murderous ways... That’s why Kamala Harris makes an anti-Semitic remark like accusing Israel of harming civilians during a war against Hamas that Hamas started — and fails to see either the antisemitism or the absurdity in her remark.



This is a blatantly Christian piece throughout, and yet openly refers the Vice President of the United States an "ignorant slut" by "comedic" reference, but there's nothing comical here. It goes on to claim she is spiritually aligned with the Devil because she thinks Netanyahu is going too far in his response. This is just spin from the Right designed to vilify the Vice President as evil, and it's just as false and misleading as the Vanity Fair hit piece on Trump is. No acknowledgment is given to her actual statements about the attack or her feelings about Israel.
 
I will never forget the horror of October 7, 2023. 1,200 innocent people, including 46 Americans, were massacred by Hamas terrorists. Women raped on the side of the road. 250 people kidnapped. It was the deadliest day for the Jewish people since the Holocaust. What Hamas did that day was pure evil – it was brutal and sickening. And it has rekindled a deep fear among the Jewish people not just in Israel, but in the United States and around the world.

The long, extraordinary arc of Jewish history is full of pogroms and prejudice, slaughter and separation. And now, in our own generation, there is another moment that the world must never forget. I am devastated by the loss and pain of the Israeli people as a result of the heinous October 7 attack. Doug and I pray for the families of the victims and hope they find solace in remembering the lives their loved ones lived. We also pray for the safety of Jewish people all around the world. We all must ensure nothing like the horrors of October 7 ever happen again. I will do everything in my power to ensure that the threat Hamas poses is eliminated, that it is never again able to govern Gaza, that it fails in its mission to annihilate Israel, and that the people of Gaza are free from the grip of Hamas. (Statement by Vice President Harris Marking One Year Since The October 7th Attack. Whitehouse.Gov)

Publicly acknowledging that Hamas wants to annihilate Israel and that they must therefore never govern Gaza again is not "aligning oneself with the Devil." It's quite the opposite, and yet many Christians on the Right parrot this kind of hate rhetoric rather than honor and reverence their political leaders instead.


How We Should Speak

Scripture teaches that Christians should "speak only that which is good to the use of edifying," hence the exhortation by Peter to "Honor all people. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king." Jesus taught to walk with Roman soldiers two miles instead of one, and why? To turn them from darkness to light, and from hating the people of God to loving them, and wanting to see them prosper and be protected.

This is God's heart rather than the Devil's. He sees the good in others, so like with Gentile rulers like King Cyrus and King Nebuchadnezzar, He sees what political leaders can become for Him instead of for the enemy. The following was a prophecy spoken over Kamala Harris entitled "A Star Will Rise," and it was spoken well before anyone knew she would become Vice President of the United States, let alone run for the Presidency:

I was praying and suddenly I found myself in the Spirit looking for what was to come. In my eyes I could see the state of California and a rising star. I heard the Lord say, “behold the woman that will rise from the West!” I look to see a light skinned black woman standing before me with authority poised to take political power. It was Kamala Harris, she will rise from California as a bright star in the coming days. The Lord said unto me, “She has been hand picked by some in power as a queen to trump President Trump in 2020. This is their hidden vision that has yet to unfold. They will use her to grab the hearts of people in the nation and attempt to create momentum and build a political bridge from the east to the west. They will set her on a course to make major waves in the country for a time. Her eyes will be opened and her heart will be changed when she sees that they have played her as a pawn in a political game only to put forth a rook in an attempt to upset a king, in the end this plan will fail. She will be broken as a result of this reality, through this I will show her my mercy and teach her about true justice. Her political future will be hung in the balance and I will present her with a choice to choose a difficult road. One that will build bridges across enemy lines and forge friendships from common political rivals, she is my bridge builder. I will use her to build new political alliances that help those in need in the nation. Where she was once hated by some she will be seen as a trusted ally and praised as she brings justice to the poor of the country. My destiny for her life is that she fulfill the promise that she made to her mother when she was young. If she chooses I will lead her down this difficult path to seal the legacy of her father and mother. In the end she will be remembered for the advancement of civil rights and economic justice among Americans. - Prophet Charlie Shamp - 2017

Trump was likewise prophesied over by the Spirit of God prior to the 2020 election, when Sadhu Seleveraj spoke the following at a church service, notifying everyone present and everyone by YouTube who would see it that Trump was the Lord's servant and He desired for him serve four more years. But the church would need to pray against the forces of darkness, because Satan was sending everything against him, and if they wanted to see the will of God fulfilled for the country, they would need to pray.

The Lord said to me... "Three powerful prince angels are stationed with President Trump. And they will strengthen him, and he will triumph." So what exactly that word "Triumph" means I don't know. It can mean he will be re-elected. It can also mean he will overcome all the big bats that were thrown at him, but he will triumph. So I don't want to add in my own opinion or commentary there. And the Lord Jesus said this, "I love him. He is My servant." And when the Lord Jesus spoke that, I saw tears coming down His eyes. He said, "I love him. He is My servant. He will fulfill My will for this nation, as well as for Israel." If the Christians in this country will gather together in groups, in churches, to pray sincerely, without prejudice or bias, then I will push back the enemy's plans to thwart Trump. Right now, all of Hell has been released against Mr. Trump. That is why even the good media who were supporting him suddenly turned violent... so what does this tell us? Prayers for the President has gone way down. Way down. See, when you see all this happening, have you raised up an army to stand in the gap? Do a 24/7 prayer watch. Surround the President with prayer. Make sure he is fully guarded. How many will sincerely do that? (Transcript from This Is An Urgent Time In War. Don't Ignore God's Message, Youtube)

These are God's words concerning the two people now running for office in 2024, and they express what HIS heart is towards them; not one of hatred but of love; not one of slander, but of hope and goodwill. Why? Because not all politicians are evil people, or the monsters the press makes them out to be just to get ratings. Even in New Testament times, some rulers were good men, such as Caesar Augustus who is pictured above. Though he ruled the entire known world at the time, he lived an inauspicious life, and rather than build his own palace purchased an existing home that wasn't even particularly grand; just two floors with short arches and no marble in sight. Why would Augustus do this? Because he put himself on the same level as the people, and they respected him for it, a far cry from how "evil" the emperors supposedly were and how they needed to be overthrown.

But Satan still tempts many today, and uses evil spirits to goad them into hatred. Would that we returned to obedience to the word of God, and the standards set forth in the pages of the Bible. We are supposed to shine forth the light of Christ to the world, and how Christians always seek to model citizens no matter who is in office. Peter taught that we were to show ourselves as bondservants of Christ, and display His heart towards our politicians, by honoring them for the positions of authority they hold over us, as is fitting of the servants of God.


Questions And Applications

1. If you saw a friend succumbing to political hatred, what would you say or do to dissuade them from giving into it?

2. In the public arena, what things could you do or say to instead "honor the king," or in other words honor your political leaders on both sides of the fence?

3. What could churches do to honor political leaders on both sides, whether before elections or after?
 
Questions And Applications

1. If you saw a friend succumbing to political hatred, what would you say or do to dissuade them from giving into it?
I appreciate your sharing the prophecies of Shamp and Selvaraj. I followed Selvaraj and Kim Clement from about a year before Trump won the White House in 2016.

My stepson, who was hardly a good Christian, temporarily became fascinated by Christian prophecies, and told my wife and me that Trump would win the White House. Kim Clement's prophecy of Trump's victory was amazing, and we accepted it as legitimate.

When Trump lost the White House in 2020 I naturally felt Trump had been cheated. We knew Clement had prophesied that Trump would win not just one, but two terms in office, and we couldn't see how he could lose?

We watched the election unfold late at night, and saw when Trump was at the apex of victory the elections suddenly came to a halt. The next morning Trump had lost in states where he had been winning the night before.

I gave up on prophecy, because it seems to have failed me. Rather, I thought I had failed to understand what was true and what was false. Trump had clearly lost.

On forums that I had been on--I think one of the forums you were on, I was told that perhaps Trump will win next time around? I thought that was pure rationalization. So I fell into quite a long slump, questioning my Charismatic roots, the gift of Prophecy, etc.

Anyway, this sudden resurgence has come about, and I now think Trump will win. I thought that Selvaraj had also missed the mark, and had given up on him. Some things he said I felt were clearly wrong, regardless--his statement that the Pope was the False Prophet.

However, Selvaraj had a point that I agree that Francis was a corrupt Pope that would lead the Catholics astray. And that has proven to be true. I still don't think he's the False Prophet, but I do think he is a kind of false prophet, even though I don't think he's completely lost.

I've long thought the same thing about Kamala--she has the potential for saving faith, regardless of the fact she's been raised in corrupt circumstances. So I think Shamp's prophecy really rings true. I think Trump will win, and Harris will recognize that she had been used.

Harris stood up to Biden in the Demcratic debates for Presidential Nominee. She stood up for Blacks and for Women, and she is a Rights Attorney. So the prophecy seems amazingly accurate, and I have no reason to doubt it's true.

Some of what threw me off about Prophecy were the copy artists like Kenneth Copeland who claimed that Trump would win in the 2020 election. But he may have seen Trump's ultimate victory and added in his own 2 cents? This only hurt people like me, who wants accuracy--not ego.
2. In the public arena, what things could you do or say to instead "honor the king," or in other words honor your political leaders on both sides of the fence?
I don't personally believe we should fear being outspoken or even negative about sinful political planks that will do serious harm to people. The Democrat Party, in its beliefs, support homosexuality, transgender surgery for minors--even behind their parents' backs, and the promotion of other religions--everything except Conservative Christian beliefs.

The Democrat Party has turned decidedly towards Socialism or even Communism, with an elite controlling leadership that devalues Constitutional rights for individuals. People become their "bricks in the wall," to be used and disposed of when finished.

So we need to call it for what it is, without shame. But I agree--we need to keep a strong spirituality to undergird our conviction. If we don't have love, we ain't nothing, as Larry Norman sang.

What came to mind is the story of Jehu, king of Israel. He was called of God to be forceful, even violent, and a weapon of God. He shamelessly put to death ungodly leaders under God's direction, and was rewarded for it.

But he also went too far at times, and was condemned for that, as well. So we need to stay balanced, without sacrificing our humanity, and even some of our emotionalism. We just need to know when to quit, when to avoid incitement.
3. What could churches do to honor political leaders on both sides, whether before elections or after?
I don't think we have to pretend equality between opposite political positions. But we do have to act Christian when dealing with either political party, or with anybody for that matter.

We can try to focus on the positives among the Democrats, which tend to favor human rights, compassion, and equality. And we can focus on the positives among the Republicans, which favor Conservative moral values in our society, as well as taking a stand against evil both abroad and within.

I'm quite political, and so I better quit while I'm possibly ahead. ;) We can never guarantee things will always be peaceful. Sometimes God gives us a period of tranquility. At other times, all Hell seems to break loose.

We just need to deal with it the best we can...in season and out of season. During times He seems to be absent we are being tested for our sincerity. Let's win!
 
When Trump lost the White House in 2020 I naturally felt Trump had been cheated. We knew Clement had prophesied that Trump would win not just one, but two terms in office, and we couldn't see how he could lose?

A lot of people couldn't. I actually interpreted a dream over at another forum about 3-4 months in advance of the election that said he was going to lose, not win, but I was certainly in the minority, and several people resented me for saying it. But it was admittedly confusing, because I remember Taylor's prophecies suggested he would win a second term as well, so nearly everybody was on that bandwagon.
We watched the election unfold late at night, and saw when Trump was at the apex of victory the elections suddenly came to a halt. The next morning Trump had lost in states where he had been winning the night before.

Yeah. And we also received dreams that said that election was indeed rigged. They just did it in a way where no one would ever be able to figure out how.

Wow, buddy. This is a good long post. Thanks for replying. I'm gonna step out and give the entire thing a response when I'm settled in, even if it takes till tomorrow. Good input as always, and I appreciate it. :thumbsup2
 
Just commenting as i go along the study :)
13 Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake

When the Covid restrictions were happening, no worship services and whatnot, it was a pretty big debate as to what Gods will was. There were pastors that were saying we needed to rebel, and we needed to not submit. And there were others that saw the restrictions as a judgement of God for the churches behavior. They were citing how Israel was repeatedly admonished throughout their history for falling away. I'm not too sure where i lean or even if its relevant anymore, but i would probably lean to the latter and say we were probably doing pretty bad as a whole and we needed to submit to the restrictions of the Govt at the time in keeping with these passages.
supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men, 2 for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and reverence. 3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth....

This is pretty sobering. That it is Gods desire. In light of things like repentance. We have such a hard time shaking that monkey off our back sometimes, but ultimately it will draw us closer to God and contribute to this desire of His to be fulfilled. And it seems like the apex if His will i would imagine.

I cant seem to quote the romans making the Jews carry their armor and Jesus' response here. But the historical context is superb.

I cant quote anything else from your study, so I'll wait to finish 🤙

Really great HIH :) praise the Lord for leading you 🕊
 
When the covid restrictions were happening, no worship services and whatnot, itbwas a pretty big debate as to what Gods will was. There were pastors that were saying we needed to rebel, and we needed to not submit. And there were others that saw the restrictions as a judgement of God for the churches behaviour. Theywere citing how Israel was repeatedly admonished throughout their history for falling away. Im not too sure where i lean or even if its relevant anymore, but i would probably lean to the latter and asay we were probably doing pretty bad as a whole and we needed to submit to the restrictions of the GOvT aat the ttime in keeping with these passages.

You know, I think I'd agree with you. Some churches disobeyed and the whole darn congregation got sick.
I cant seem to quote the romans making the jews carry their armour and Jesus' response here. But the historical context is superb.

That's my fault. I've gotten lazy lately, so I'm actually paraphrasing half the time without even looking it up. I just know it's there, Lol.
 
When the Covid restrictions were happening, no worship services and whatnot, it was a pretty big debate as to what Gods will was. There were pastors that were saying we needed to rebel, and we needed to not submit. And there were others that saw the restrictions as a judgement of God for the churches behavior. They were citing how Israel was repeatedly admonished throughout their history for falling away. I'm not too sure where i lean or even if its relevant anymore, but i would probably lean to the latter and say we were probably doing pretty bad as a whole and we needed to submit to the restrictions of the Govt at the time in keeping with these passages.
Yea, we went through the same. Wanted to rebel, to some extent, but felt we needed to submit.

Our church did everything we were asked to do. Didn't have church for some time, though we could access services online. My wife and I got two of the series of shots, and then called it quits.

One good friend died from COVID. He travelled down to Texas to see his daughters, and caught it there. So we knew it was serious.

I don't think it's so serious now. They've said in the past we need to keep up, that immunity fails as the virus evolves. But everybody I know has had the virus once or twice, and the 2nd time seems mild. I don't know of any more deaths nearby.

Besides, the drug companies may be behind the Fauci-like demand that we get vaccinated! I feel no compunction to support big drug companies! ;)
 
I gave up on prophecy, because it seems to have failed me. Rather, I thought I had failed to understand what was true and what was false. Trump had clearly lost.

This is possibly the saddest part of it all, Randy, and I spoke with several people who had similar sentiments. Most weren't disillusioned with the Faith, but they did become disillusioned with the prophetic.

My personal take here is that it HAD to take place. There were way too many people in the "prophetic" movement who were subscribing to the Faith Theology version of "prophecy," which is a false form. The belief is that you just speak with you are wanting from God into existence by "prophesying" it out of your mouth. That's not prophecy at all. Prophecy is when the Lord Jesus Christ gives you a dream or a vision or a direct word from the Lord, so that it is not you who is saying anything but the Lord Himself, and He will see to it that His words come to pass.

A lot of people fell on their faces, and it effected a lot of others negatively, but that business needed to be exposed. It's a fraud, and a false version of the true that bears no real resemblance to it.
 
On forums that I had been on--I think one of the forums you were on, I was told that perhaps Trump will win next time around? I thought that was pure rationalization. So I fell into quite a long slump, questioning my Charismatic roots, the gift of Prophecy, etc.

Man, this is such a good post. If it's Christianity Board, yes, I was there during that time. And that became the switch off. They decided to still hold to the prophecies and apply them for years down the road. I haven't received anything directly from the Lord yet, so I'm not really sure what happens this time, but at present I'm still not buying it. I think it's over. Based on a dream I also think they may finally put Trump in jail after he loses and all is said and done, which is even sadder. But I have no authoritative word on any of it, so maybe things don't turn out that way. I do think in the end that his life will have exposed just how wicked the powers that be truly are, and I think that was the real meaning behind, "He will triumph."
 
Anyway, this sudden resurgence has come about, and I now think Trump will win. I thought that Selvaraj had also missed the mark, and had given up on him. Some things he said I felt were clearly wrong, regardless--his statement that the Pope was the False Prophet.

I haven't searched out everything Sadhu has said, but I have great respect for him and I think he has a very good understanding of how things work, especially at the presidential level. Things are IN PLAY when you have that many people who could be potentially praying about an issue, and it all depends on whether they will or not, which is why he was VERY careful about simply assuming "He will triumph" meant "Trump will win." He is to be commended for that, IMO, because most of the people attempting to prophesy back then and even today were not nearly so careful, even some of the good ones. I remember Charlie Shamp posted another video where he told a vision and then interpreted it, and I was thinking, "That's not necessarily what it means..." And sure enough, he presumed things, and it came back to bite him. The vision was true, but he wasn't careful enough about what he was making of it.
 
I still don't think he's the False Prophet, but I do think he is a kind of false prophet, even though I don't think he's completely lost.

That may have actually been what he meant. There is a spirit of the Antichrist, and a spirit of the false prophet. They manifest through various people who are not THE Antichrist, but are nevertheless walking in that spirit, to where the expression "the Antichrist" means "the Antichrist spirit," though I couldn't tell you unless I had watched the thing myself.
I've long thought the same thing about Kamala--she has the potential for saving faith, regardless of the fact she's been raised in corrupt circumstances. So I think Shamp's prophecy really rings true. I think Trump will win, and Harris will recognize that she had been used.

Harris stood up to Biden in the Demcratic debates for Presidential Nominee. She stood up for Blacks and for Women, and she is a Rights Attorney. So the prophecy seems amazingly accurate, and I have no reason to doubt it's true.

Yes, and I looked it up, and she was indeed raised by some very good parents. They were social activists. but not the kind who are secretly being paid to "protest" against this or that when they're actually just on somebody's payroll. They were genuinely concerned about social justice and racial equality and making society better, so I personally don't think she's nearly the "puppet" some of the Right are making her out to be. I think she has her own mind just like her parents did, and the people who currently think they are using her to "trump Mr Trump" may live to find that out.
 
Some of what threw me off about Prophecy were the copy artists like Kenneth Copeland who claimed that Trump would win in the 2020 election. But he may have seen Trump's ultimate victory and added in his own 2 cents? This only hurt people like me, who wants accuracy--not ego.

Yes, people like Copeland are the epitome of the whole "Faith" version of prophecy, and he topped it off by "blowing away" Covid-19 by an "act of faith" during one service, and that went viral and stayed viral for almost two years while the Covid epidemic went virtually nowhere. Very bad look. I don't vilify him like maybe some others do because God sees the good in everyone, and there was I time back before the turn of the century where I actually watched him for awhile and thought he had a good sense of humor. But WAY too off base theologically, and I mean WAY out there, like in complete... (not wanting to disparage him here and yet still say it like it is, so let's just say it was really bad). Theologically he was just as off-base as his "prophecies" often were, whenever he dared to actually make them specific instead of just these rambling, vague "professions" that never actually said anything, like "2021 will be the Year of the Greater Blessing" and stuff like that...

I don't want to vilify, because again, we have all been in places where we didn't have things quite right. But it needed to happen. Blowing hot air in the name of Christ and making Him a laughing stock before the eyes of the world is NOT going to further the kingdom of God. It only hampers it.

Edit: Well, that covers your responses to Question #1! LoL. I'll try and get to your next one later on, and excellent input yet again. :thumbsup2
 
13 Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme, 14 or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.

When the Covid restrictions were happening, no worship services and whatnot, it was a pretty big debate as to what Gods will was. There were pastors that were saying we needed to rebel, and we needed to not submit.
I think it was up to the pastors at the church if they had services or not .

23Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)

24And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:

25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

Remember too it was "mandates" from unelected officials in most cases that the church's not have services . Some were allowed to have services in their parking lots and one mayor went as far as to forbid even that and use armed men , issuing tickets to those gather to worship God , to enforce his mandate !

You can't go in your church building and have services but you can go in the liquor store ! ? ! You could not shop in the local shoe store but you sure could buy beer ! ? ! This was a psyop , IMO . How much are you willing to submit to .

Six Foot SAFE ! Was just a made up slogan with no truth behind it .

I have strong opinions about what went on during the outbreak .
 
I think it was up to the pastors at the church if they had services or not .

23Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)

24And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:

25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

Remember too it was "mandates" from unelected officials in most cases that the church's not have services . Some were allowed to have services in their parking lots and one mayor went as far as to forbid even that and use armed men , issuing tickets to those gather to worship God , to enforce his mandate !

You can't go in your church building and have services but you can go in the liquor store ! ? ! You could not shop in the local shoe store but you sure could buy beer ! ? ! This was a psyop , IMO . How much are you willing to submit to .

Six Foot SAFE ! Was just a made up slogan with no truth behind it .

I have strong opinions about what went on during the outbreak .

I never actually came to a conclusion on it during the time. One of those rare occasions where I was a little conflicted and just left it alone. But then I wasn't attending a church I really liked at the time either, so I didn't really have a horse in the race or I may have protested a little more myself.

I think it was likely one of those "be led by the Spirit" things, only to make sure you didn't miss Him. Like ask the Lord before each service if you should still have one, just in case someone planned on attending who was about to make everyone sick. Pretty confusing times back then, to say the least.
 
Yes, people like Copeland are the epitome of the whole "Faith" version of prophecy, and he topped it off by "blowing away" Covid-19 by an "act of faith" during one service, and that went viral and stayed viral for almost two years while the Covid epidemic went virtually nowhere. Very bad look. I don't vilify him like maybe some others do because God sees the good in everyone, and there was I time back before the turn of the century where I actually watched him for awhile and thought he had a good sense of humor. But WAY too off base theologically, and I mean WAY out there, like in complete... (not wanting to disparage him here and yet still say it like it is, so let's just say it was really bad). Theologically he was just as off-base as his "prophecies" often were, whenever he dared to actually make them specific instead of just these rambling, vague "professions" that never actually said anything, like "2021 will be the Year of the Greater Blessing" and stuff like that...

I don't want to vilify, because again, we have all been in places where we didn't have things quite right. But it needed to happen. Blowing hot air in the name of Christ and making Him a laughing stock before the eyes of the world is NOT going to further the kingdom of God. It only hampers it.

Edit: Well, that covers your responses to Question #1! LoL. I'll try and get to your next one later on, and excellent input yet again. :thumbsup2
I appreciate the response, and feel the good spirit in it. Like you, I don't wish to disparage ministries that do promote Jesus. I wrote Copeland a long time ago, telling him that I disagreed with his Faith Doctrine, but nevertheless felt he has a Gift of Faith. So what he experiences and what others experience may be 2 different things.

At any rate, when someone is wrong in ministry, it needs to be addressed, or we will all get a bad name. We can, however, keep the criticism as controlled as possible.

Thanks again. You're a good brother, and I do value your input.
 
I haven't searched out everything Sadhu has said, but I have great respect for him and I think he has a very good understanding of how things work, especially at the presidential level. Things are IN PLAY when you have that many people who could be potentially praying about an issue, and it all depends on whether they will or not, which is why he was VERY careful about simply assuming "He will triumph" meant "Trump will win." He is to be commended for that, IMO, because most of the people attempting to prophesy back then and even today were not nearly so careful, even some of the good ones. I remember Charlie Shamp posted another video where he told a vision and then interpreted it, and I was thinking, "That's not necessarily what it means..." And sure enough, he presumed things, and it came back to bite him. The vision was true, but he wasn't careful enough about what he was making of it.
Yes, I think Prophets can misinterpret their own prophetic gifts.

1 Kings 13.18 The old prophet answered, “I too am a prophet, as you are. And an angel said to me by the word of the Lord: ‘Bring him back with you to your house so that he may eat bread and drink water.’” (But he was lying to him.) 19 So the man of God returned with him and ate and drank in his house.
20 While they were sitting at the table, the word of the Lord came to the old prophet who had brought him back. 21 He cried out to the man of God who had come from Judah, “This is what the Lord says: ‘You have defied the word of the Lord and have not kept the command the Lord your God gave you. 22 You came back and ate bread and drank water in the place where he told you not to eat or drink. Therefore your body will not be buried in the tomb of your ancestors.’”
 
Man, this is such a good post. If it's Christianity Board, yes, I was there during that time. And that became the switch off. They decided to still hold to the prophecies and apply them for years down the road. I haven't received anything directly from the Lord yet, so I'm not really sure what happens this time, but at present I'm still not buying it. I think it's over. Based on a dream I also think they may finally put Trump in jail after he loses and all is said and done, which is even sadder. But I have no authoritative word on any of it, so maybe things don't turn out that way. I do think in the end that his life will have exposed just how wicked the powers that be truly are, and I think that was the real meaning behind, "He will triumph."
I actually have returned to believe that Trump will "triumph." I watched Trump (livestream) this morning as he joined with Dan Bongino in an interview at the Trump Tower.

I think Trump is a rough character, but I actually like him--I think he was an inexperienced politician who was concerned about the direction our country was going in. And he ran smack into the Deep State--the intelligence services joined together with Democratic Party legislators, RINOs, and the Left-Wing Media.

Then sports and hollywood celebrities joined in because let's face it--the powers that be have elitist tendencies. Somebody bring back Honest Abe! ;)
 
This is possibly the saddest part of it all, Randy, and I spoke with several people who had similar sentiments. Most weren't disillusioned with the Faith, but they did become disillusioned with the prophetic.

My personal take here is that it HAD to take place. There were way too many people in the "prophetic" movement who were subscribing to the Faith Theology version of "prophecy," which is a false form. The belief is that you just speak with you are wanting from God into existence by "prophesying" it out of your mouth. That's not prophecy at all. Prophecy is when the Lord Jesus Christ gives you a dream or a vision or a direct word from the Lord, so that it is not you who is saying anything but the Lord Himself, and He will see to it that His words come to pass.

A lot of people fell on their faces, and it effected a lot of others negatively, but that business needed to be exposed. It's a fraud, and a false version of the true that bears no real resemblance to it.
I think that is wonderfully stated! Sometimes we have to die to ourselves before being raised up, not by our own power, but by the power of God.

That being said, I'm believing in "prophecy" once again. I think Kim Clement's prophecy of Trump's "2 terms" was accurate prophecy. It just seems delayed for the reasons you provided. I suppose we'll see???
 
1. If you saw a friend succumbing to political hatred, what would you say or do to dissuade them from giving into it?
If the friend was a Christian give them some verses to think on .

15Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

12Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.

In my own life I was not happy with ACA and Obama . I had a dream and in the dream I visited the Whitehouse and played a game of basketball one on one with Obama , we played a game of h-o-r-s-e . I am not a good player in real life and sadly no different in my dream , lol . Obama beat me handily but we still had a good time as we played . After the game we went inside an office there and Hillary Clinton was there and she looked so sad , I gave her a hug and told her God loved her . End of Dream .
I think the dream was letting me know even if they are in politics that I don't like I should still treat them as friends and not enemies . It goes back to who is your neighbor .
 
If the friend was a Christian give them some verses to think on .

15Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

12Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.

In my own life I was not happy with ACA and Obama . I had a dream and in the dream I visited the Whitehouse and played a game of basketball one on one with Obama , we played a game of h-o-r-s-e . I am not a good player in real life and sadly no different in my dream , lol . Obama beat me handily but we still had a good time as we played . After the game we went inside an office there and Hillary Clinton was there and she looked so sad , I gave her a hug and told her God loved her . End of Dream .
I think the dream was letting me know even if they are in politics that I don't like I should still treat them as friends and not enemies . It goes back to who is your neighbor .
I believe Hillary will be saved, as much as I currently despise her. But nobody will win her to Christ by showing contempt for her continuously. There has to be accountability, but there also has to be grace, respect, and mercy. Thank you! :)
 
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