"Christ is our Life"

[Mungo]

It appears to me that you want to save yourself by doing something, this is why you don't like faith alone. The reason that salvation is by faith alone is because God does not recognize or accept the works or the obedience of sinners, which we are all one of. If God accepted the works and obedience of sinners that would make him a sinner.

In the trinity. The Father stays in heaven. The Son comes into the world as the savior. The Holy Spirit glorifies the work of the Son and works in the life of the believer.

No I don't want to save myself.
It is only God that saves us.
Nowhere does scripture say we are saved by faith alone.

 

[Robert Pate]

No I don't want to save myself.
It is only God that saves us.
Nowhere does scripture say we are saved by faith alone.

Jesus Christ is the savior, not God the Father.

The Catholic church teaches that you must do certain things to be saved. Those certain things are works.

You cannot participate in your salvation, because God does not accept the works or the obedience of sinners. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him.

This means that salvation is by faith alone.

 

[Mungo]

Jesus Christ is the savior, not God the Father.

I didn't say that God the Father was our saviour. You keep implying I've said something that I haven't
It's called lying.

The Catholic church teaches that you must do certain things to be saved. Those certain things are works.

Jesus tells us we must believe to be saved. (Mk 16:16).
That is something We have to do.

You cannot participate in your salvation, because God does not accept the works or the obedience of sinners. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him.

This means that salvation is by faith alone.

Jesus tells us that "He who believes and is baptized will be saved" (MK 16:16)
So there is something we have to do before Jesus saves us.
Believe
and
be baptised.

But they do not save us in themselves.
In the thread "Jesus: Our Substitute and Representative" you said:

Salvation has been provided for everyone by the doing and the dying of Jesus, Hebrews 2:9. But nothing is ours until it is received by faith, John 1:12.

Yes, Salvation has been provided for everyone.
But as you actually say, we have to receive that saving work of Christ.
It is in baptism that we receive it.

 

[Robert Pate]

I didn't say that God the Father was our saviour. You keep implying I've said something that I haven't
It's called lying.


Jesus tells us we must believe to be saved. (Mk 16:16).
That is something We have to do.



Jesus tells us that "He who believes and is baptized will be saved" (MK 16:16)
So there is something we have to do before Jesus saves us.
Believe
and
be baptised.

But they do not save us in themselves.
In the thread "Jesus: Our Substitute and Representative" you said:

Yes, Salvation has been provided for everyone.
But as you actually say, we have to receive that saving work of Christ.
It is in baptism that we receive it.

Baptism is a work and will not save you. You cannot stop being and doing religious things that you believe will save you. We are saved by faith alone, because we are saved by Christ alone.

 

[Mungo]

Baptism is a work and will not save you. You cannot stop being and doing religious things that you believe will save you. We are saved by faith alone, because we are saved by Christ alone.

Once again you try to falsify what I said.
I didn't say that baptism in itself saves us. Baptism is when Jesus saves us, just as he promised: "He who believes and is baptized will be saved" (Mk 16:16)
Jesus is very clear. Why don't you believe Jesus?

 

[Mungo]

We are saved by faith alone, because we are saved by Christ alone.

As I have already pointed out:

3. Even if it were Christ alone it does not follow that we are saved by faith alone as you claim. Nowhere does scripture say we are saved by faith alone.

You keep ignoring that point.

 

[Robert Pate]

As I have already pointed out:


You keep ignoring that point.

Jesus saves and he saves to the uttermost, Hebrews 7:25.

You need to scrap your Catholic religion and trust in Christ alone.

 

[Mungo]

Jesus saves and he saves to the uttermost, Hebrews 7:25.

You need to scrap your Catholic religion and trust in Christ alone.

And again I agree that Jesus saves us. Again you try to claim I have said something I have not.

And yet again you are ignoring my point.

3. Even if it were Christ alone it does not follow that we are saved by faith alone as you claim. Nowhere does scripture say we are saved by faith alone.

 

[Robert Pate]

And again I agree that Jesus saves us. Again you try to claim I have said something I have not.

And yet again you are ignoring my point.

You believe that Jesus saves you by doing something in you. Making you holy.

You will never, never, never, be righteous enough to stand before God in the judgment in your own righteousness. If you try you will perish. The righteousness of Christ is totally and completely outside of us and is to our account, reserved for us in heaven, 1 Peter 1:4.

 

[Mungo]

You believe that Jesus saves you by doing something in you. Making you holy.

You will never, never, never, be righteous enough to stand before God in the judgment in your own righteousness. If you try you will perish. The righteousness of Christ is totally and completely outside of us and is to our account, reserved for us in heaven, 1 Peter 1:4.

I believe we are saved when we believe and come to Jesus in baptism as he commanded.

I never suggested I make myself holy

I never suggested I could stand before God in the judgment in my own righteousness. Why do you keep insinuating I says things I don't? Is it to avoid answering the points I make?

 

[Robert Pate]

I believe we are saved when we believe and come to Jesus in baptism as he commanded.

I never suggested I make myself holy

I never suggested I could stand before God in the judgment in my own righteousness. Why do you keep insinuating I says things I don't? Is it to avoid answering the points I make?

We are saved and justified by faith and by faith alone, Romans 3:26.

God does not and will not accept the works and the obedience of sinners. If he did it would make him a sinner. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him, Romans 5:17-21.

 

[Mungo]

We are saved and justified by faith and by faith alone, Romans 3:26.

That doesn't say we are justified by faith alone.
Nowhere does scripture say we are justified by faith alone.
In his book How Can I Get To Heaven? Robert Sungenis says that Paul used the word faith over 200 times but not once did he couple it with alone or only. He also pointed out that Paul used the word alone more frequently than any other NT writer. "Many of these instances appear right alongside the very contexts that contain teaching on faith and justification. Thus it is obvious that even while Paul was teaching about the nature of justification he was keenly aware of the word alone and it's qualifying properties. This would lead us to expect that if Paul wanted to teach clearly that man was justified by faith alone, he would have utilized that phrase, since it would have made his point undisputable."

The Holy Spirit inspired Paul not to connect faith to alone.

God does not and will not accept the works and the obedience of sinners. If he did it would make him a sinner. God only accepts the works and the obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted only in him and because of him, Romans 5:17-21.

That is nothing but your personal opinion.
Rom 5:17-21 does not substantiate what you claim.

 

[netchaplain]

Amen, it is the Life of Christ and not the Life of the Spirit in us! Yet is must be by the Power of the Spirit using the Life of Christ; and the Spirit isn't ours but the Father and the Son's. The Father and the Son are ours but not the Spirit, by Whose power we are eternally united with God; and the Spirit is our Creator in the new birth, without which one cannot enter heaven.

We belong to Christ: "that ye may know what is the hope of His calling, and what the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints" (Eph 1:18).

 

[Robert Pate]

That doesn't say we are justified by faith alone.
Nowhere does scripture say we are justified by faith alone.
In his book How Can I Get To Heaven? Robert Sungenis says that Paul used the word faith over 200 times but not once did he couple it with alone or only. He also pointed out that Paul used the word alone more frequently than any other NT writer. "Many of these instances appear right alongside the very contexts that contain teaching on faith and justification. Thus it is obvious that even while Paul was teaching about the nature of justification he was keenly aware of the word alone and it's qualifying properties. This would lead us to expect that if Paul wanted to teach clearly that man was justified by faith alone, he would have utilized that phrase, since it would have made his point undisputable."

The Holy Spirit inspired Paul not to connect faith to alone.

That is nothing but your personal opinion.
Rom 5:17-21 does not substantiate what you claim.

Paul didn't want to insult anyone's intelligence by having to say that salvation is by faith alone. It is so obvious that salvation is by faith alone. Just exactly what is it that you think that you can do or possess that will contribute to your salvation? Paul makes it clear that, "There is none righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10. All are born after Adam and are sinners. You need to come to Christ as a sinner and call upon him to save you, Romans 10:13.

 

[Robert Pate]

Amen, it is the Life of Christ and not the Life of the Spirit in us! Yet is must be by the Power of the Spirit using the Life of Christ; and the Spirit isn't ours but the Father and the Son's. The Father and the Son are ours but not the Spirit, by Whose power we are eternally united with God; and the Spirit is our Creator in the new birth, without which one cannot enter heaven.

We belong to Christ: "that ye may know what is the hope of His calling, and what the riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints" (Eph 1:18).

In your sub statement. You said that "Christ lives his life through us". Why would Jesus who is pure and without sin, want to live another life through a sinner?

 

[Mungo]

Paul didn't want to insult anyone's intelligence by having to say that salvation is by faith alone. It is so obvious that salvation is by faith alone. Just exactly what is it that you think that you can do or possess that will contribute to your salvation? Paul makes it clear that, "There is none righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10. All are born after Adam and are sinners. You need to come to Christ as a sinner and call upon him to save you, Romans 10:13.

Don't be silly. Paul; could be very forthright in preaching the gospel and correcting people. He wouldn't omit such an important doctrine if it were true.
Nowhere does scripture say we are saved by faith alone.
I have made it very clear what we must do.
We must believe
We must be baptised.
Just as Jesus said
"He who believes and is baptized will be saved" (Mk 16:16)

 

[Robert Pate]

Don't be silly. Paul; could be very forthright in preaching the gospel and correcting people. He wouldn't omit such an important doctrine if it were true.
Nowhere does scripture say we are saved by faith alone.
I have made it very clear what we must do.
We must believe
We must be baptised.
Just as Jesus said
"He who believes and is baptized will be saved" (Mk 16:16)

If Jesus has done it all, and he did, then that means that there is nothing for us to do but to believe.

You can't seem to understand the significance of the New Covenant. Believing and baptism is a response to the Gospel. What we do is not what saves us. We are saved by what Jesus did, he is the one that reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:17-18.

 

[netchaplain]

In your sub statement. You said that "Christ lives his life through us". Why would Jesus who is pure and without sin, want to live another life through a sinner?

Covered by His Blood the Lord Jesus doesn't consider the believer a sinner, though we still sin; and there is no Scripture relating a saint as a sinner.

 

[Mungo]

If Jesus has done it all, and he did, then that means that there is nothing for us to do but to believe.

As you yourself said - and I agree:

Salvation has been provided for everyone by the doing and the dying of Jesus,

But then, as you pointed out, it has to be received.
We receive the fruits of Jesus's saving work when we believe and are baptised.

You say there is nothing for us to do but believe.
Believing is something WE have to do

You can't seem to understand the significance of the New Covenant. Believing and baptism is a response to the Gospel. What we do is not what saves us. We are saved by what Jesus did, he is the one that reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:17-18.

Baptism bring us into the New Covenant.
As I keep saying it is not baptism in itself that save us. Jesus saves us when we believe and are baptised.

I didn't say that baptism in itself saves us. Baptism is when Jesus saves us, just as he promised: "He who believes and is baptized will be saved" (Mk 16:16)

 

[Robert Pate]

Covered by His Blood the Lord Jesus doesn't consider the believer a sinner, though we still sin; and there is no Scripture relating a saint as a sinner.

I agree with that, however, we are still sinners in our unredeemed, Adamic bodies, Romans 8:23. Spiritually, we are perfect and complete in Christ, Colossians 2:10. Physically, we are still sinners. Jesus is not interested in living another life through a sinner. Your doctrine is Roman Catholicism, See Hebrews 7:26.