[_ Old Earth _] Christ is Truth, and Urim and Thummim is the ocular device that reveals it

[cupid dave]

Throwing a gish gallop of even more unsupported claims does not prove your original claim.

Unless you can demonstrate with evidence that the Urim and Thummim are cubed, you have nothing.

Hmmm...

"demonstrate?"

That is what I am doing, demonstrating the hypothesis of a geometric shape for the Urim and Thummim.

What I am doing is presenting supporting scriptural and ritual evidence that this geometry is used as an intercessor between men and God when they intercourse with him.

The High Priest wears a box (mitre) on his head when he enters a cube shaped Most Holy Room to ask for the remission of sin for a congregation of Jews outside wearing cube shaped tefillin boxed on their foreheads.

Inside the Holy of Holies which contains seven (7) burning candles across the room are 12 loaves of bread, each with the name of one of the twelve tribes written on them.

Inside the vailed cube shaped Most Holy Room Aaron speaks to the god of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, hidden from view as is the underside of the tetrahedron.

The incense from a four horned altar hints about the missing fifth horn lying beyond the vail which only the High Priest can see:

 

[Adam]

You aren't demonstrating evidence that the Urim and Thummim are cube shaped. You are, without any good reason, assigning them with a cube shape because, as you say, "rooms are 'cube shaped'."

Transfering the attributes of one object to another is not a demonstration.


I could just as easily make the claim that they are shaped like trees because of the "tree of knowledge" or shaped like a pitcher because of the golden utiensils.

Saying that a holy room is cube-shaped, therefore these strange and mysteerious objects must be cube shaped is not a demonstration.


A demonstration is the action or process of showing the existence or truth of something by giving proof or evidence.

That is the opposite of making poor guesses by inferring through the shape of other objects that are NOT the object identified or under discussion..

 

[cupid dave]

You aren't demonstrating evidence that the Urim and Thummim are cube shaped. You are, without any good reason, assigning them with a cube shape because, as you say, "rooms are 'cube shaped'."

..

I am saying that God always interacts with men with this symbolic cube interceding between Himself and them.

We see this when Aaron speaks with God in the cube shaped room of the Most Holy Place.
We see this when Jews strap cubes to their forehead while praying to Him.
Again, under the New Jeruslem, when the whole universal singular one church of Christianity existed over all the Roman World for 1000 years.

Hence the hypothesis that the Urim and Thummim is a set of five "stones" that form a cube which is the device by which the high Priest could determine the will of God.

My demonstration in this post is directed at pointing to other evidence which supports this hypothesis.


The priest seemed to learned to order the holidays and adjust the calendar by using the Urim and Thummim to keep things straight.
The seven holidays are ordered inside the cube,...

... and the twelve months of 30 or 31 days, around the outside rotate annually until there is a need for adding the 13th month, AdarII in order to make a year of 360 days adjust to the reality of 365 day cycles:

Every 7+12 = 19 years, the Jews had to add a 13th month, which would be ordered on the hidden face that the central tetrahedron sits on normally.

This face always implies a trinity of some sort, as shown here were the months are termed common, masculine, or feminine.

Even when the Jews did not consciously use this model, their thinking and all their rituals symbolized this pattern to their thoughts.

 

[Adam]

I am saying that God always interacts with men with this symbolic cube interceding between Himself and them.

Yes, I am aware of the claim you are making. You are not aware that you have to do much more than simply make claims in order for it to be accepted

We see this when Aaron speaks with God in the cube shaped room of the Most Holy Place.
We see this when Jews strap cubes to their forehead while praying to Him.
Again, under the New Jeruslem, when the whole universal singular one church of Christianity existed over all the Roman World for 1000 years.

The bible does not state that a cube shaped room is necessary to speak with God. God speaks with a number of people in different setting in the bible. And making up a universal christianity in the Roman world for 1000 years does not help your claim.

Hence the hypothesis that the Urim and Thummim is a set of five "stones" that form a cube which is the device by which the high Priest could determine the will of God.

This is a non sequitor.

My demonstration in this post is directed at pointing to other evidence which supports this hypothesis.

Again, you keep claiming you have support but you haven't provided any.

The priest seemed to learned to order the holidays and adjust the calendar by using the Urim and Thummim to keep things straight.
The seven holidays are ordered inside the cube,...

Here you are relying on making things up to try to substantiate other things that you have made up. Like the cube claim, there is not even a hint that the Urim and Thummim were .used to keep track of time. There is no grounding in reality for such an insane claim

... and the twelve months of 30 or 31 days, around the outside rotate annually until there is a need for adding the 13th month, AdarII in order to make a year of 360 days adjust to the reality of 365 day cycles:

More nonsense. The Jewish calendar is a variation on the Persian calendar. It is pagan in origin. Months are determined by observing changes in the moon, not by rolling 4 sided die.

Every 7+12 = 19 years, the Jews had to add a 13th month, which would be ordered on the hidden face that the central tetrahedron sits on normally.

This face always implies a trinity of some sort, as shown here were the months are termed common, masculine, or feminine.

Even when the Jews did not consciously use this model, their thinking and all their rituals symbolized this pattern to their thoughts.

Again, you are making things up.

And still, absolutely nothing to determine what shape the Urim and Thummim are.

Every post you make gets deeper and deeper into things born in your imagination that do not reflect reality, whatsoever.

 

[cupid dave]

Yes, I am aware of the claim you are making.
You are not aware that you have to do much more than simply make claims in order for it to be accepted

The bible does not state that a cube shaped room is necessary to speak with God. God speaks with a number of people in different setting in the bible. .

True that people speak to God without the necessity of physically holding ageometric cube.
The Urim and Thummim is merely a model for the cubic organization inside the mind of sane thinkers who use the pattern of mental organization to fully examine the information they receive from their senses.

The Urim and Thummim is a constraint on rational thinking which must always fill in the blanks as these triangular faces mark as places where sensory information ought be expected for any "picture" of Reality to be meaningful:

In other words, when man researches and disovers things such as the organization of the atoms into a graphic called the Periodic Chart of the Elements, we see this pattern expressed concretely:

When we graphically represent the what we see in Nature, the format of the Urim and Thummim appears as a reflection of the mental processes.

The FIVE parts to the Cube might be frepresented on the five fingers, while the TWELVE chemical families could be noted on the 12 digits of the four fingers. The grasp of the hands presents the eight spaces we would need to parallel this same pattern as modelled on the Cube.

in other words, the actual pattern is usedas Software for the organization of cintent entering the brain.
The Geometry of the cube is just a model to teach people what is taking place.

 

[cupid dave]

Here is another very important Jewish Ritual which contains elements or rites that are irrational if not indicative of revealing or supporting the concept of this cube shaped Urim and Thummim.

Consider that the twelve (12) steps of the Seder ritual command an order to the service which is like clock work.
The very meaning of the word "seder" is "Order."
Order to our thinking is what this Urim and Thummim is about.

The idea is that if we Order the sensory information into our mind properly, we will get order out of it.

These twelve steps hint that they can be arranged in clock-like fashion around the open cube:

Then we notice that the seder service always sets out five cups!

This is very suggestive of what I have been explaining here in this thread;

Then look at the Seder Plate and the six other food portions on it...

..... to see the forced appearance of a ritualized reference to seven faces of the cube:

Then, the hidden eighth face under the central tetrahedron displays the three matza pieces called the "Afikoman" which was hidden and the guest must search for before the end of the service.

This search is for the stone the builders forgot, the chief building stone of the Urim and Thummim.

 

[Adam]

100% nonsense.

 

[cupid dave]

100% nonsense.

Rituals themselves seem fill of nonsense but they symbolize some important elements which defy explanation until that meaning is recognized.
That they are chosen as some set of acts that living people perform from generation to generation is an insurance policy on recognizing the meaning in the distant future.

What I have posted about strange geometries in four square breast plates which can only be formed in the same ordering of the 12 tribes around the square land of the Levite priests is supported by these rituals which lend themselves so clearly to the faces on the cube of this Urim and Thummim.

The Ritual of all 12 tribes praying to God with a Cube strapped to one's head, while sitting inside a cube shaped Booth as the High Priest enters the Cube shaped room of the Most Holy Place, and all eating a Passover Seder which requires a 12 step order to eating in seven steps of ritual from a Plate and its six ingredients, while toasting from five cups of wine, that ends with the hunt for three crackers hidden is carried out according to a Jew calendar which recognizes seven holidays during 12 months that require an eighth face on the Urim and Thummim to accommodate AdarII, analogous to the 13th tribe of Levites, and fill every space on the Cube.


... and the five (5) cups of wine,...

....properly shaped they could form that cube geometry:

Rituals seem nonsense but they are fill of something important.


That run-on sentence above seems an intended way of helping me propose this rational insight to what it is all about.

 

[Adam]

wow, you just throught many different practices into a single ritual.


Do you think this reflects any truth whatsoever?


It certainly doesn't allow you to say the Urim and Thummim are cube shaped.

 

[cupid dave]

The Urim and Thummim was a model and the cube 3-D shape was convenient to the geometry of the Tabernacle, allowing God to set down in the Bible all the hints to its shape which I have laid out.

Those hints were effective enough that I have been able to support the reasoning of this shape with things like the horns onthe altar, the Outer Court, inner court, and cube shaped room of the Most Holy Place where man is able to talk to God.

A Two-dimensional layout of the U&T pattern is more convenuient for us to examine the use of this cube shaped 3-D geometry needed when men pray to God, ith Tefillin cubes tied to their forehead, and cube shaped Booths they live in during Tabernacles, also supported by the Cube Shaped City that comes down over all the Roman World, the New Jerusalem.
And for Christianity, we remember that Christ was the "forgotten stone" used after 32AD.

When early Christians prayed, they were well aware that they mentally symbolized Christ as the U&T which mediated between them and God.

The 2-D representation of the cube pattern is better here or on paper when discussing the U&T, which is just as model for the actual pattern that one uses when thinking straight and truthfully .
So, to see how that 2-D format looks when we replace the 3-D of the cube here is the way it would look:

This shows the same format as was used to set the 12 stones of the Foursquare breastplate:

But the readers here need always remember this is just a concrete model of what is really going on inside the mind, its just depicting the pattern to thought when a person thinks comprehensively and thoroughly:

 

[Adam]

You have already said all that.


You have still failed to show that the Urim and Thummim are any particular shape, no matter how many times you repeat yourself.

 

[cupid dave]

You have already said all that.


You have still failed to show that the Urim and Thummim are any particular shape, no matter how many times you repeat yourself.

ost of what I said above was introductory to displaying the content of the Urim and Thummim in a 2-D format, where the Graphic Organization contains a number of sets or groups with correspondences to the spaces on the cube model.

By transforming the 3-D model into a 2-D format we can discuss and view the whole content of the cube rather than refer separate parts of the cube.

For instanace, the ig foresquare twelve lines of ascent through Seth can be compared with the seven lines through Cain inside the little square in the center, (like that whole in the Breastplate), as we see the Urim and Thummim was a tool used by the priest exactly for that reason of recording the genealogy as stated in Nehemiah 7.

Nehemiah 7:64 These sought their register among those that were reckoned by genealogy, but it was not found: therefore were they, as polluted, put from the priesthood.


65 And the Tirshatha said unto them, that they should not eat of the most holy things, till there stood up a priest with Urim and Thummim.

 

[Adam]

I suppose the mods should probably lock this thread, seeing that you are just using it as a personal diary at this point.

 

[cupid dave]

I suppose the mods should probably lock this thread, seeing that you are just using it as a personal diary at this point.

?

How is this thread diffwrent from the others?
This is the MOST view thread with the biggest following on this site,if you check the lurking readers afte you and I confront one another.

Check the others, and see that for the most part, all the threads, they only have you naysaying and pretending to be authoriatative and me, with real statements, sources, and facts that readers never knew about until now.

Once in a while, a lurking reader will join us.
But the times the threads are visited in pretty good.

 

[Adam]

Keep telling yourself that.

 

[cupid dave]

Atomism is another completely different source and reference for the idea that man thinks in a pattern of thought which is fixed, one he "throws" over the facts he collects from the external world by means of his seven sensory inputs.

Democritus in 460BC sugested that atoms moving at random in a void was all that existed in the world external to our mind.
He further reasoned that if this was the case, EVERYTHING would necessarily be Atomic in its natures, to include even the way man thinks.

As I illustrated before in this thread, the seven prime quantum orbits which are found in the nature of the Atom dictate the chemical properties which allow the Elements to be organized into a pattern,... mind you, of twelve Chemical Families.

It is circular to argue whether this Physical Fact actually is the case in regard to the external Reality we think about, or whether it is the pattern inside our own head that utilizes this scheme to understand the chemistry.

All that can be noted is that man "images" reality, (the almighty external absolute power of Nature), in this way, at the most basic level of human understanding of the material world, i.e., Chemistry.



Gen.1:26 And God, (The Universal Force, the Macrocosmos), said, "Letus, (the Natural Laws), make man, (a conscious mind, to model us,the unfolding Universe, as a Microcosmos of his mind), in (order that)our image (might be modeled after our own orderly organization): andlet him (that conscious mind,) have dominion over the fish of the sea,and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, andover every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."





Gen.1:27 So God (The Universal Force) created man (an abstract mindin his own image, enabled to image The Universal Force, abstractly andmathematically), so created God (The Universal Force) him; male andfemale created he them.

 

[Adam]

Atomism is another completely different source and reference for the idea that man thinks in a pattern of thought which is fixed, one he "throws" over the facts he collects from the external world by means of his seven sensory inputs.

You are already off to a bad start.

1) Atonism is not a philosophy on the way man thinks

2) There are not 7 sensory inputs

Democritus in 460BC sugested that atoms moving at random in a void was all that existed in the world external to our mind.
He further reasoned that if this was the case, EVERYTHING would necessarily be Atomic in its natures, to include even the way man thinks.

You are compounding your very bad start with an even worse follow up.
Atomists believe the universe can be explained without reasoning to purpose, prime mover, or final cause.

You are appealing to a philosophy that excludes God and that would argue against any sort of purposeful pattern.

As I illustrated before in this thread, the seven prime quantum orbits which are found in the nature of the Atom dictate the chemical properties which allow the Elements to be organized into a pattern,... mind you, of twelve Chemical Families.

*facepalm

You illustrated no such thing.

And, of course, there are 18 chemical families, not 12.

It is circular to argue whether this Physical Fact actually is the case in regard to the external Reality we think about, or whether it is the pattern inside our own head that utilizes this scheme to understand the chemistry.

All that can be noted is that man "images" reality, (the almighty external absolute power of Nature), in this way, at the most basic level of human understanding of the material world, i.e., Chemistry.

It isn't a fact. And if you are a pagan (one who observes "Nature" as the prime mover) why bother with the framework of Christianity which bears no resemblance?

Why don't you just go off and explore your occultic tendencies and leave scripture alone?