Growth Discipleship

[Nintentacle]

The commands of Christ, and the doctrine of repentance, is a great foundation for a disciple of Christ. Study the New Testament for information on that.

 

[Nintentacle]

I absolutely LOVE that scripture! Why? Because the Pharisees were almost perfectly righteous. And that leaves me with but one conclusion.... that it is impossible for my own righteousness to surpass that of the Pharisees.

"Bummer" you might say. But I say, "Not at all."

All through the Bible it is told that I now make that grade by the righteousness of someone else... Jesus. And, His righteousness FAR exceeds that of ANYONE, including the Pharisees.

You are right about the work of Christ over our works, but the Pharisee's were not very righteous. Jesus talked about how the outside of them was clean, but the inside was bad.

 

[Willie T]

You are right about the work of Christ over our works, but the Pharisee's were not very righteous. Jesus talked about how the outside of them was clean, but the inside was bad.

Perhaps you misunderstood. I meant "righteous" as indicating that they kept the law to near-faultless perfection. Just because of the needs and requirements of everyday life, normal people would inadvertently break some laws, simply trying to make a living.

Bear in mind in this discussion, I am using the word “Pharisee” to mean the Pharisees who abused their positions. Some of the Pharisees were good guys. A Pharisee helped give Jesus a decent burial (John 3:1 and John 19:39-40). In fact, a Pharisee wrote a good chunk of the New Testament (Acts 23:6, Philippians 3:4-6). Also, in Luke 13:31 some Pharisees warned Jesus of danger.

 

[Edward]

It shouldn't scare you because, after all, it is not our righteousness but His.

I get your point though, I still have a difficult time with "I should do that" and "I shouldn't do that", although God did set up boundaries for us.

yeah, right. It used to, not any more for the reasons you stated.

It boggles my mind to hear people say sometimes, what is the will of God for us? It's all down there in print. Think on these things, don't think on those things, spread the word, love your neighbor as yourself. It's all there. People who question the will of God don't read their bible enough, lol.

 

[Jesse]

Perhaps you misunderstood. I meant "righteous" as indicating that they kept the law to near-faultless perfection. Just because of the needs and requirements of everyday life, normal people would inadvertently break some laws, simply trying to make a living.

Bear in mind in this discussion, I am using the word “Pharisee” to mean the Pharisees who abused their positions. Some of the Pharisees were good guys. A Pharisee helped give Jesus a decent burial (John 3:1 and John 19:39-40). In fact, a Pharisee wrote a good chunk of the New Testament (Acts 23:6, Philippians 3:4-6). Also, in Luke 13:31 some Pharisees warned Jesus of danger.

I learned one time that righteousness is doing what is right in the eye's of God and is more directed to those around us, this is the horizontal relationships.

Holiness is our vertical relationship with God.

Would this be something you or anyone else has learned also?

 

[Jesse]

yeah, right. It used to, not any more for the reasons you stated.

It boggles my mind to hear people say sometimes, what is the will of God for us? It's all down there in print. Think on these things, don't think on those things, spread the word, love your neighbor as yourself. It's all there. People who question the will of God don't read their bible enough, lol.

I have seen people, especially those my age, I'm 18, who will ask God to show them His will, close their eyes, open the Bible and point. haha They got some crazy direction that way.

 

[Edward]

Perhaps you misunderstood. I meant "righteous" as indicating that they kept the law to near-faultless perfection. Just because of the needs and requirements of everyday life, normal people would inadvertently break some laws, simply trying to make a living.

Bear in mind in this discussion, I am using the word “Pharisee” to mean the Pharisees who abused their positions. Some of the Pharisees were good guys. A Pharisee helped give Jesus a decent burial (John 3:1 and John 19:39-40). In fact, a Pharisee wrote a good chunk of the New Testament (Acts 23:6, Philippians 3:4-6). Also, in Luke 13:31 some Pharisees warned Jesus of danger.

Right. They were law keepers and did not know the Lord in Spirit. They didn't worship in spirit and in truth.

 

[Edward]

I have seen people, especially those my age, I'm 18, who will ask God to show them His will, close their eyes, open the Bible and point. haha They got some crazy direction that way.

That's right. I've done that more times than I can count.

 

[Jesse]

That's right. I've done that more times than I can count.

Did God ever reveal anything that way?

 

[Edward]

Did God ever reveal anything that way?

Sure He has! I remember praying once and asking God a question...He didn't answer me. I prayed again and again for a few days with no answer. Then one day I just decided to read and flipped open my bible not even thinking about the question that I had asked...and there it was, the answer right on the page I opened the bible too.

Most of what we need is right there in scripture, we just have to study it and continue to study it.

 

[Jesse]

Sure He has! I remember praying once and asking God a question...He didn't answer me. I prayed again and again for a few days with no answer. Then one day I just decided to read and flipped open my bible not even thinking about the question that I had asked...and there it was, the answer right on the page I opened the bible too.

Most of what we need is right there in scripture, we just have to study it and continue to study it.

I know people say we can get all our answers from the Bible, but there are some things God has to reveal to us that aren't in the Bible.

God has definitely refocused my prayers after reading the Bible, they became more God centered.

 

[Edward]

I know people say we can get all our answers from the Bible, but there are some things God has to reveal to us that aren't in the Bible.

God has definitely refocused my prayers after reading the Bible, they became more God centered.

What you say is indeed true. I almost posted that thought also, but didn't for some reason. God will indeed reveal things to us that are not in scripture. It wont disagree with any scriptural precept, but may not be in there. A lot of folks will shoot this down fast and say, if it's not in scripture then it's not true, but this just is not so. We do have to be careful when speaking of Gods words that were not put down in scripture. People can find it offensive, and most times it is probably something that we should keep to ourselves anyway.

 

[Jesse]

What you say is indeed true. I almost posted that thought also, but didn't for some reason. God will indeed reveal things to us that are not in scripture. It wont disagree with any scriptural precept, but may not be in there. A lot of folks will shoot this down fast and say, if it's not in scripture then it's not true, but this just is not so. We do have to be careful when speaking of Gods words that were not put down in scripture. People can find it offensive, and most times it is probably something that we should keep to ourselves anyway.

I'm only speaking of things such as where should I live, what college should a person attend, life questions like that - yes, God gives us definite wisdom through His Word and in other ways.

The Bible is God's Word and should be considered in all matters, that is for sure, but sometimes, God also gave us people who have wisdom, like teachers, etc.

 

[Willie T]

Sometimes people who refuse to do anything but read the Bible, interpreting it in a 2014 mindset, really do need to get away from their mistaken literal reading of the Bible. They often are not reading what was originally intended by the writers. For instance: Luke 14:26.... and there are hundreds of other verses the translators we trust pretty well messed things up.

 

[Jesse]

Sometimes people who refuse to do anything but read the Bible, interpreting it in a 2014 mindset, really do need to get away from their mistaken literal reading of the Bible. They often are not reading what was originally intended by the writers. For instance: Luke 14:26.... and there are hundreds of other verses the translators we trust pretty well messed things up.

IMO, and I am only young so it's just ponderings of mine, I think that people have done a tremendous amount of damage using God's Word. When I say that, I mean what you have said, but even more than that, we have used it against one another (and I have done it and still get caught up in doing it), we're supposed to use God's Word against the enemy not one another (again, I am guilty of this too).

Not to mention our interpretations of it, when really we should allow the Holy Spirit to interpret it for us, in our spirits, so that we are truly being lead into His Truth.

 

[Willie T]

IMO, and I am only young so it's just ponderings of mine, I think that people have done a tremendous amount of damage using God's Word. When I say that, I mean what you have said, but even more than that, we have used it against one another (and I have done it and still get caught up in doing it), we're supposed to use God's Word against the enemy not one another (again, I am guilty of this too).

Not to mention our interpretations of it, when really we should allow the Holy Spirit to interpret it for us, in our spirits, so that we are truly being lead into His Truth.

One of the points that keeps frustrating me, no end, is the way people claim many of the early writings are specifically for us in this tiny time period called "our century".

Seriously, you have to do some very distorted mind-bending to think that. Would you think anyone would write something to be read to you, today, that was really meant only for people who will be living in the year 4014?

 

[Jesse]

One of the points that keeps frustrating me, no end, is the way people claim all the early writings are for us in this tiny time period called "our century".

Seriously, you have to do some very distorted mind-bending to think that. Would you think anyone would write something to be read to you, today, that was really meant only for people who will be living in the year 4014?

Can you provide a few examples of what you mean? There are a few ways I could take your post and I want to comment appropriately.

Thanks.

 

[Willie T]

Can you provide a few examples of what you mean? There are a few ways I could take your post and I want to comment appropriately.

Thanks.

Just read almost anything on this (or most other) forums about "The End Times"....... or Daniel.... or The Book of Revelation. We truly have "End Times Fever".

 

[Jesse]

Just read almost anything on this (or most other) forums about "The End Times"....... or Daniel.... or The Book of Revelation. We truly have "End Times Fever".

Over the top so...

By the amount of books out there, I would say it's not only this time right now that people have been infatuated with it - or are more people discussing it today then years passed?

Do you not believe The Revelation was meant for the future?

 

[Willie T]

Over the top so...

By the amount of books out there, I would say it's not only this time right now that people have been infatuated with it - or are more people discussing it today then years passed?

Do you not believe The Revelation was meant for the future?

Part of it, but not most of it. Go look at who John said it was supposed to be read to.