Firstly, this does away with the previous argument by another which is what I was initially addressing, namely, that there is no such thing as an interim body between death and resurrection. That was something you said was just an opinion, and it remains that way. Secondly, I am not convinced that this verse actually means that at the moment of death we leave the body and go be with Jesus. It could mean that but it does not necessarily mean that. The wording is such that Paul is not making an absolute statement of the way things actually are, but rather simply stating that while we live here on Earth, we're away from the Lord.
Not to mention that elsewhere in the NT, dead believers are referred to as sleeping. When one is sleeping, they do not notice the passage of time. The passage of ten thousand years would seem like a blink of an eye to someone who was asleep. This passage could simply be speaking of the future resurrection.
Pslam 9:17 doesn't say that only the wicked will go there, nor that there is rest. Consider Eccl 9:10, "10 Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might; for there is no activity or planning or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol where you are going. " (NASB) Psalm 9:17 could simply be speaking of the cutting off of wicked people. Most words have several meanings and nuances in the way they are used, so don't be too quick to stick to one meaning and think that you have understood what was said. That goes for all of us.
Again, the whole point is study thoroughly each and every position on this matter, including all verses and passages that are relevant. Do not base your beliefs on Internet discussions, particularly where not all of the relevant passages have been taken into account. Two verses do not a doctrine make.
Free,
What is meant by “sleep” at death?
The Bible sometimes describes the state of death as “sleep” or “falling asleep” in verses such as Matt. 9:24; 27:52; John 11:11; Acts 7:60; 13:36; 1 Cor. 15:6, 18, 20, 51; 1 Thess 4:13; 5:10. Let’s take 3 samples from these verses:
1. Matt. 9:24. The ruler’s daughter had died (see 9:18) and before Jesus raised her from the dead, Jesus said, “‘Go away, for the girl is not dead but sleeping.’ And they laughed at him.”
2. Acts 13:36. “For David, after he had served the purpose of God in his own generation, fell asleep and was laid with his fathers . . .”
3. First Corinthians 15:20. “But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep.”
This sounds like the soul sleep position is signed, sealed and delivered. If believers go to sleep at death, surely there is no need for further discussion! It would be a danger to jump to such a conclusion without examination of further biblical evidence.
There are many words in many languages (including English) that have a number of unrelated meanings. We see this with the language of ‘sleep’. Webster’s dictionary defines it three ways, one of which is: ‘a natural, regularly recurring condition of rest for the body and mind, during which there is little or no conscious thoughts, sensation, or movement’ (Webster 1978:1706). However there are many different meanings to ‘sleep’ when statements such as these are made:
(1) My foot went to sleep (meaning that sensation was lost in my foot;
(2) I’ll sleep on it, which means that I will think about the issue and try to come up with an answer later;
(3) My children’s friends are coming for a sleepover, i.e. the children’s friends will come to sleep at our place for the night and there is likely to be a long night of talking, playing games, and favourite party food;
(4) That couple is sleeping together, meaning they are having sex;
(5) There are sleeper cells in this country, which is an indication that there are terrorists awaiting their opportunities to strike;
(6) I had to put my dog to sleep, meaning that I took the dog to the vet and he euthanised (killed) him/her (many of these ideas suggested by Dr John Roller n d, ‘Soul sleep’; the article is no longer online).
New Testament scholar, Dr. N. T. Wright, wrote that “when ancient Jews, pagans and Christians used the word ‘sleep’ to denote death, they were using a metaphor to refer to a concrete state of affairs.We sometimes use the same language the other way round: a heavy sleeper is ‘dead to the world’” (Wright 2003, p. xix). This is in Wright's extensive study on
The Resurrection of the Son of God.
When my father died suddenly from a heart attack in 1973 and I saw him in his coffin, he looked as though he was asleep. This is how we are to understand the language of sleep associated with death in the Bible. “Sleep” of the body is a metaphor that refers to death.
Remember the story of Jesus and Lazarus in John 11:5-44? Of Lazarus, it was said that he “has fallen asleep” and Jesus was going “to awaken him” (v. 11). Jesus was very clear what he had meant by “sleep.” “Now Jesus had spoken of his death” (v. 13). “Then Jesus told them plainly, ‘Lazarus has died’” (v. 14). Jesus explains further: “Everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die” (v. 26).
So, in this situation we have this kind of language used: Lazarus died and he looked as though he was asleep but the truth was that, because Lazarus believed in Jesus, Lazarus would never die. That sounds paradoxical. He died but he would never die! This means that the believer who dies physically and appears to be asleep (a metaphor), does not die because his unseen soul goes immediately into the presence of the Lord, thus meaning that the believer never really dies. At death, the believer’s real being (his/her soul) goes into the presence of the Lord (see 2 Cor. 5:8 ESV).
Oz