[_ Old Earth _] Dodwell's Curve

[dad]

You look no further than 19 years ago, or however old you are.

Demonstrably untrue. Light travels at a specific speed, and the farther away it began, the farther into the past you can see.

Of course present light has a present speed, and the universe has a nature, with it's laws. Of course we observed this for 19 years, or as long as present based science existed.
That does NOT mean that it was the same in the past or will be, get over it! Not until, and unless you prove that the past or future were this same state. That will be never. get used to being exposed as a two bit myth. Really. No way round it.

 

[DavidLee]

Your assuming light speed is a constant.

So far, it's been a constant.

People smarter than me say that the speed of light is variable.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_speed_of_light

It seems to me that measuring anything as fast as light is tricky at best.
I can't wrap my head around seeing part of something that's a thousand light years across. I suppose it would look something like a partially fogged lake but obscured by dark (freaky).

 

[John]

I don't think I am smarter than you but I have been pitching the "speed of light is not a constant" for awhile now.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Photons move at a speed less than c, unless they are travelling in vacuum. This leads to several important effects, such as dispersion (see also refractive index). The slow-down in condensed matter, such as gases, liquids and solids, can be considerable. The group velocity of light can be lowered to arbitrary speeds, though only for an arbitrarily slow (low bandwidth) signal (see Slow light).

In certain highly unusual circumstances, it is also possible to prepare experiments in which the group or phase velocity of light exceeds c. Since these velocities are mathematical constructs, these faster than light observations do not indicate any contradiction with causality or special relativity, as no information or energy travels faster than c.

Read that section of the article (the wiki) with understanding. the c limit is not being violated. This is not some "this is the solution!" for YEC in any way whatsoever.

No one proposes that there can be a violation of causality or relativity.

Please, correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Barbarian]

Light is of course variable in speed in a medium. The constant "c" refers to the speed of light in a vacuum. But that gives no comfort to creationists, since it can only slow down, not speed up.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Light is of course variable in speed in a medium. The constant "c" refers to the speed of light in a vacuum. But that gives no comfort to creationists, since it can only slow down, not speed up.

He was refering to so called "virtual photons" which, I really don't understand, but I know that any thing I have read on them emphatically state that they cannot be observed, therefore can not transmit info.

Nothing is being violated.

I do know that http://www.answersingenesis.com had an article up for a while on this made it seem that this could account for the reason we see stars more than 6k lightyears away.

Of course they quickly removed it once it was pointed out that whoever wrote it had completely misunderstood everything.

That article had a ton of things that were shown to be way off base, though I can't remember what they were. Junk science.

 

[dad]

Light is of course variable in speed in a medium. The constant "c" refers to the speed of light in a vacuum. But that gives no comfort to creationists, since it can only slow down, not speed up.

He was refering to so called "virtual photons" which, I really don't understand, but I know that any thing I have read on them emphatically state that they cannot be observed, therefore can not transmit info.

Nothing is being violated.

I do know that http://www.answersingenesis.com had an article up for a while on this made it seem that this could account for the reason we see stars more than 6k lightyears away.

Of course they quickly removed it once it was pointed out that whoever wrote it had completely misunderstood everything.

That article had a ton of things that were shown to be way off base, though I can't remember what they were. Junk science.

I do not expect anything to be violated within this universe state we live in, and that has existed for a long time now. Claiming that somehow that should happen is junk. So??

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Much like saying you weren't there so you can't make the assumption that the laws of physics hasn't drastically changed in the last 6k years.

Though ultimately true, you do have to make some assumption to make your life easier.

My stomach's growling. I am assuming that I am hungry. But, since I can't say it for sure, I better run to the ER!

My friend wants me to go to dinner tonite. Seems innocent, but I can't be sure! Better carry a side arm in case its a set up to be murdered.

I guessing that your a human on the other end of the computer, but I can't be sure! You may be an alien. Imagine that, I could be talking to another life form!

enough?

 

[dad]

Much like saying you weren't there so you can't make the assumption that the laws of physics hasn't drastically changed in the last 6k years.

Though ultimately true, you do have to make some assumption to make your life easier.

Right, and I do not assume that they changed. Why, do you? What I have deduced is not a change in present laws, but a different state universe. Our laws, and state are the change.

I guessing that your a human on the other end of the computer, but I can't be sure! You may be an alien. Imagine that, I could be talking to another life form!

enough?

Enough what? Guessing dumb stuff? I suppose, now try and grow some science.

 

[VaultZero4Me]

Much like saying you weren't there so you can't make the assumption that the laws of physics hasn't drastically changed in the last 6k years.

Though ultimately true, you do have to make some assumption to make your life easier.

Right, and I do not assume that they changed. Why, do you? What I have deduced is not a change in present laws, but a different state universe. Our laws, and state are the change.

I guessing that your a human on the other end of the computer, but I can't be sure! You may be an alien. Imagine that, I could be talking to another life form!

enough?

Enough what? Guessing dumb stuff? I suppose, now try and grow some science.

Without any evidence outside of theology right?

 

[dad]

Without any evidence outside of theology right?

No evidence from science or theology for your dream universe state, no.

That means that the rug has been pulled from all so called science claims that oppose the bible, by the way. Unless you can prove the fundamental premise upon which they ALL rest, which is that the laws and universe was as it is now.