[_ Old Earth _] Does Atheism Make People Smarter?

[Brokendoll]

wealth = education = less religious

I'm seeing tantalizing glimpses this is true but as you point out nothing much has been done on this correlation.

I honestly believe materialism could very well be a factor.

Could very well be a connection there. I'm not terribly focused on money and things, but then again I live in one of the richest countries in the world so even if I was poor (in relation to the national levels) I would still be richer than most people on this planet, so I suppose never really wanting for anything makes it easier to avoid chasing money and wealth.

I would, however, be interested in hearing your thoughts as to -why- increased wealth leads to less religiousity (if we for the sake of argument assumes that notion to be true).

 

[Rick W]

Materialism focuses on worldly things.
I have found some correlations between materialism and religiosity as to what's called "SWB" Subjective Well-Being though. But that's not the topic.
Goes on the line of "money can't buy happiness"
For everything else there's Visa.
:D

 

[jasoncran]

Brokendoll does have the heart for those less fortunate.

 

[freeway]

Mark 8:36
For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

Romans 1:22
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

The opening question. Does being an atheist make you smarter or are atheist smarter? No I don’t believe that one bit. Smarter does not in any way make you wiser.. I was an atheist at one time in my life and I thank God that I did not die in my wisdom..

 

[Brokendoll]

The opening question. Does being an atheist make you smarter or are atheist smarter? No I don’t believe that one bit. Smarter does not in any way make you wiser.. I was an atheist at one time in my life and I thank God that I did not die in my wisdom..

While I agree that there might be a conceptual difference between being "smart" and being "wise", for the sake of the discussion I would be very interested in hearing what you think the difference is.

 

[freeway]

A smart man can tell you all about growing crops, A wise man can show you. You can be paper smart book smart whatever you want to call it. But you are wise if you can apply that knowledge to your life. You can know the bible inside and out and be very smart in quoting scriptures etc. But A wise man will try to live his life according to what he has read.

 

[azlan88]

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge.

 

[ChattyMute]

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge.

That's entirely subjective. I hold that the beginning of knowledge is when you start asking questions.

 

[Brokendoll]

A smart man can tell you all about growing crops, A wise man can show you. You can be paper smart book smart whatever you want to call it. But you are wise if you can apply that knowledge to your life.

Fair enough. But that would imply that you must first be smart before then you can be wise. Which would mean that if a group has more smart people than another, they would statistically be able to bring forth more wise people than the competing groups.

As for being smart (at least a particular kind of smart), it appears that atheists perform better than theists. But as I said, it can be hard to draw a common consensus from these results. ;)

 

[Brokendoll]

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge.

I dunno about that mate... From my years of study and experience in teaching-psychology I find that pupils who feel safe and who have teachers that really care about them are better learners.

In my book, fear has never been the most efficient or practical way to understanding.

 

[AAA]

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge.

How do you support this statement?

I mean, if a 12 year old asked you, "why do you say that", or "how do you know that", what would you say azlan88?

 

[jasoncran]

aaa, that word fear is best translated as respect and you acknowledge that he is the creator and judge, but that you want to please him beacuse you love him.

 

[freeway]

To quote the person above me......

aaa, that word fear is best translated as respect and you acknowledge that he is the creator and judge, but that you want to please him beacuse you love him.

couldn't say it better..

 

[ChattyMute]

aaa, that word fear is best translated as respect and you acknowledge that he is the creator and judge, but that you want to please him beacuse you love him.

Fear and respect are two completely different things. Take it up with the dictionary. If he meant respect, he should have said respect.

That being said, how does respect lead to knowledge? Explain please.

 

[jasoncran]

aaa, that word fear is best translated as respect and you acknowledge that he is the creator and judge, but that you want to please him beacuse you love him.

Fear and respect are two completely different things. Take it up with the dictionary. If he meant respect, he should have said respect.

That being said, how does respect lead to knowledge? Explain please.

cross the road when a car is coming is that fear then,yes, but then if you know not to do that and wait till clear that is respect. Sometimes english being a very limited language doesnt have the best word for the original hebrew/greek.araimaic. Think about we use love for everything yet the greek language defines it specifally by types

we get knowledge of the lord as in things that are spiritual and those are gained through belief that the bible's writer is real and has the answers. The knowledge isnot always carnal,ie things that are around us, but more in the realm of faith.

The bible is meant to be science book but a guide to know about the Lord that is what the verse means. One can know all that there is in the acedemia and still a fool.


This means that person may make alot of money but cant keep a wife, has drug problems and or kids that dont know him or her and disown him or her. To avoid the pitfalls of sin and to seek the Lord is wisdom that is well spoken of in the bible.

 

[ChattyMute]

cross the road when a car is coming is that fear then,yes, but then if you know not to do that and wait till clear that is respect. Sometimes english being a very limited language doesnt have the best word for the original hebrew/greek.araimaic. Think about we use love for everything yet the greek language defines it specifally by types

Crossing a road when a car is coming is either stupidity or foolish bravery. If it is the first, then you can attribute fear once the person realizes the car is coming.

Waiting until the car passes is just common sense. I don't respect a car or the driver by waiting for the car to pass. I do it so I don't get my butt knocked down.

we get knowledge of the lord as in things that are spiritual and those are gained through belief that the bible's writer is real and has the answers. The knowledge isnot always carnal,ie things that are around us, but more in the realm of faith.

So know your claiming that knowledge comes from belief?
Either way, by just believing, respecting, or fearing along does not bring knowledge. Knowledge starts with questions. For instance, if you're Christian, "How did we get here? What is the story of Jesus' life?" Answer: read the bible. Without asking questions you don't find the facts, truths, and/or principles of life and in general. And facts, truths, and/or principles is what defines knowledge.

The bible is meant to be science book but a guide to know about the Lord that is what the verse means. One can know all that there is in the acedemia and still a fool.

I never said the bible was a science book or that someone who knows all the facts to academia can't still be a fool. Knowledge encompasses truths, facts, and or principals about all the universe, what is in it, and how it works. It isn't restricted to just academia.

This means that person may make alot of money but cant keep a wife, has drug problems and or kids that dont know him or her and disown him or her. To avoid the pitfalls of sin and to seek the Lord is wisdom that is well spoken of in the bible.

Then he has knowledge on how to make money and doesn't have relationship knowledge. So what? Anyone can have either of those two knowledge, and it isn't restricted to Christians. Some people may be able to gain knowledge of relationship through the bible. Others gain it by experience; others through reading scientific books on the subject. But in all cases, the person most likely asked the question "How can if fix/better my relationships?" before said person went to find facts/truth whether in the bible or though experience.

Point being, there are multiple ways to gain knowledge on most subjects. But they all start with asking a who, what, when, where, or why. How are you going to find the answer (facts, truths, principles) to something if you don't know the question?

 

[jasoncran]

one can ask the lord, that is called seeking. seek and you ask,but you must belief or want to believe that lord is who he is of the bible.

you are confusing man's wisdom with godly wisdom. two very different things, those that believe will know what i mean.

One can educate themself in to imbecility. I have seen that. Theres more life than the college book and ot acedemia.

My alma mater (college) professor who believes Stalin was a good man, imagine that.

 

[azlan88]

A smart man can tell you all about growing crops, A wise man can show you. You can be paper smart book smart whatever you want to call it. But you are wise if you can apply that knowledge to your life.

Fair enough. But that would imply that you must first be smart before then you can be wise. Which would mean that if a group has more smart people than another, they would statistically be able to bring forth more wise people than the competing groups.

As for being smart (at least a particular kind of smart), it appears that atheists perform better than theists. But as I said, it can be hard to draw a common consensus from these results. ;)

I mean no offense, but what you just said is a golden example of why you atheists fail at grasping true knowledge. All you do is perform! You foolishly think that if you do enough good works, that makes you a good person. Jesus already has a robe of righteousness with which to clothe you, which is His righteousness. By rejecting it, you are spitting in the face of God, which is something that you do often and with sadistic pleasure. So we "theists" (Christians, specifically) are way ahead of you in "performing" as you call it, because we don't perform. We have faith, confessing our pride and admiting that we need a savior to redeem us.

 

[jasoncran]

cross the road when a car is coming is that fear then,yes, but then if you know not to do that and wait till clear that is respect. Sometimes english being a very limited language doesnt have the best word for the original hebrew/greek.araimaic. Think about we use love for everything yet the greek language defines it specifally by types

Crossing a road when a car is coming is either stupidity or foolish bravery. If it is the first, then you can attribute fear once the person realizes the car is coming.

Waiting until the car passes is just common sense. I don't respect a car or the driver by waiting for the car to pass. I do it so I don't get my butt knocked down.

I know some bjj fighters that are better then me at other gyms , i dont like them yet i respect their fighting skills , in that case it is acknowlging that that person has something or does something better then you. respect can simply to acknowlede. On can seek and read the bible and not understand it, the bible does point the way to author of it, he will then ask you to repent of your sins then you will be able to ask what you need to know and then it will be given.

I have literally been through that. I read the bible for no reason, didnt believe it all, actually gave up on it all to put it a better way. Months later went to church, got saved. I did ask others about it on they way.Little did i know that the Lord was drawing me.

 

[ChattyMute]

one can ask the lord, that is called seeking. seek and you ask,but you must belief or want to believe that lord is who he is of the bible.

you are confusing man's wisdom with godly wisdom. two very different things, those that believe will know what i mean.

One can educate themself in to imbecility. I have seen that. Theres more life than the college book and ot acedemia.

My alma mater (college) professor who believes Stalin was a good man, imagine that.

Wisdom and knowledge are not exactly the same thing. Wisdom is much deeper and more subjective than knowledge. I spoke of knowledge, not wisdom. And most of the wisdom, if any, I see in the bible is common sense.
As to the academic part, I answered that. Knowledge is not restricted to academics, though much of it is academics. I never said that was all there is to life anyways.