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Early Church Doctrine

Do early Church writings hold any value in determining truth?

  • No. The Early Church failed doctrinally

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Authority of the Apostles!

What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?

Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!

The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!

Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!

The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!

Hebrews 3:1
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;

Christ is an apostle, and has authority to send other apostles, the apostles also have this authority, so the apostles continue down thru the centuries as Christ promised! Matt 28:19-20

Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22

Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.

Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.

Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments




Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20

Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...

John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

Only the church has authority from Christ to define the truth and teach!
Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Jn 20:21-23 Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13

Successors of Jesus Christ!

Jesus already prepares His apostles to continue His mission with His power (binding and loosing) and with His authority (keys) matt 16:18 matt 18:18

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

John 4:1 when therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John...
Jn 4:2 Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples

Here we see Jesus delegating to His successors, Peter and the apostles!

Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing

There can be no unity of the spirit without obedience to the faith! Rom 1:5 eph 4:3

Matt 28 I am with you (the apostles)

The papacy based on Matt 16:18 and Isa 22:21-22

Matt 16:18-19
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

Isa 22:21-22
21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.

22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.

Behold I am with you (the successors or the apostles until the end of the age, so the successors must remain until the end of the age) matt 28:19

(None of the so called reformers were apostles) (no man has authority to start a church)


Successors of Moses!

Matt 23 why does Jesus say to obey the successors of Moses?

The successors of Moses sit in the chair of Moses having the authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Matt 23 and Jesus commanded them to be obeyed! Then the kingdom was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter, Matt 16:18 the apostles, Matt 18:18 and their successors with the authority of the keys and the power to bind and lose!

Jesus said to obey the authority of the successors of Moses mt 23 authority of the keys and power to bind and loose and this power and authority was taken from them matt and given by Christ to Peter, the apostles and their successors, mt 16:18 18:18 this same authority and power must be obeyed!

mt 28:18-20 all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
So the apostles have to remain until the end! Revelation 5:10
And hast made us unto our God kings and Priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Reign with kingdom authority (keys) power (bind loose) matt 16:18
The successors of Peter and the apostles have a valid jurisdictional authority (keys) and power (bind and loose) by Jesus Christ!

Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...

John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.


apostolic succession!

explicit and implicit in scripture

Judas was an apostle
Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.

acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.

Matthias succeeded him as apostle

acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles

Matt 28:19-20
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom

Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:

Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:

Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:

Isa 22 21-22 prime minister called father!
Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
Matt 16:18
 

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Teaching authority of the Apostles and their successors founded in the one true church by Jesus Christ!

Jesus Christ is the head of the church, (eph 5:23) the body of Christ,
(col 1:18) the new and eternal covenant, (pre-figured Jer 31:31) (Heb 8:8) new covenant replaces the Mosaic covenant, (Heb 8:13) holy mother church replaced Israel Matthew 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
Christ replaces David as king, (Lk 1:32-33) Jesus Christ is the only mediator between God and men, (1 Tim 2:5 & Heb 12:24) but a mediator remains on earth mediating between God and His people, but Christ ascended to heaven, (acts 1) before He did He founded His church, on Peter, and the apostles, and their successors!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 2:42 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 16:13
Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
 

Hopeful

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Teaching authority of the Apostles and their successors founded in the one true church by Jesus Christ!

Jesus Christ is the head of the church, (eph 5:23) the body of Christ,
(col 1:18) the new and eternal covenant, (pre-figured Jer 31:31) (Heb 8:8) new covenant replaces the Mosaic covenant, (Heb 8:13) holy mother church replaced Israel Matthew 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
Christ replaces David as king, (Lk 1:32-33) Jesus Christ is the only mediator between God and men, (1 Tim 2:5 & Heb 12:24) but a mediator remains on earth mediating between God and His people, but Christ ascended to heaven, (acts 1) before He did He founded His church, on Peter, and the apostles, and their successors!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 2:42 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 16:13
Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
This is the "rock" upon which the church is founded..."And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." (Matt 16:16)
The church wasn't founded upon Jesus' disciples.
 

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This is the "rock" upon which the church is founded..."And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." (Matt 16:16)
The church wasn't founded upon Jesus' disciples.
Only Peter and his successors have the jurisdictional authority of the keys Matt 16:18
 

D-D-W

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Only Peter and his successors have the jurisdictional authority of the keys Matt 16:18
Eh - not so fast. Consider this:

Romans 3:1
Then what advantage has the Jew? Or what is the benefit of circumcision? 2 Great in every respect. First of all, that they were entrusted with the oracles of God.


Are all of Peter's successors Jewish???
 

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Eh - not so fast. Consider this:

Romans 3:1
Then what advantage has the Jew? Or what is the benefit of circumcision? 2 Great in every respect. First of all, that they were entrusted with the oracles of God.


Are all of Peter's successors Jewish???
Matt 21:43
 

jaybo

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This is the "rock" upon which the church is founded..."And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." (Matt 16:16)
The church wasn't founded upon Jesus' disciples.
Matthew 16:22-23, " So Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him: “God forbid, Lord! This must not happen to you!” But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me, because you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but on man’s.”

And don't forget that Peter denied knowing Jesus three times! Some "rock"!!!

Peter was a flawed human being, as shown several times in the NT. Nowhere does it say that he founded the church.

It seems that Peter, by being referred to as "Satan" by the Lord, clearly isn't "the rock" upon which the church is founded. The church -- the body of Christ -- was entrusted by Jesus' to His disciples: the apostles.
 

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Matthew 16:22-23, " So Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him: “God forbid, Lord! This must not happen to you!” But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me, because you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but on man’s.”

And don't forget that Peter denied knowing Jesus three times! Some "rock"!!!

Peter was a flawed human being, as shown several times in the NT. Nowhere does it say that he founded the church.

It seems that Peter, by being referred to as "Satan" by the Lord, clearly isn't "the rock" upon which the church is founded. The church -- the body of Christ -- was entrusted by Jesus' to His disciples: the apostles.
Only Christ founded the church
But on peter matt 16:18
The apostles are not impeccable
How can you administer the kingdom or govern the church with a confession
Much less bind and loose
God always establishes authority in the hierarchy of the fathers
 

D-D-W

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It seems that Peter, by being referred to as "Satan" by the Lord, clearly isn't "the rock" upon which the church is founded. The church -- the body of Christ -- was entrusted by Jesus' to His disciples: the apostles.
"satan" in this case is not the personal name for the devil. The Hebrew ha-satan means "the adversary." He was saying Peter was becoming an adversary to His plans.

The translators that capitalize it are wrong.
 

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"satan" in this case is not the personal name for the devil. The Hebrew ha-satan means "the adversary." He was saying Peter was becoming an adversary to His plans.

The translators that capitalize it are wrong.
Oh, and you're right? What are your credentials? Scripture clearly records the situation...

"But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me, because you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but on man’s.” Matthew 16:23

Satan has always been a personal name for the devil, not a title.
 
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Oh, and you're right? What are your credentials? Scripture clear records the situation...

"But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me, because you are not setting your mind on God’s interests, but on man’s.” Matthew 16:23

Satan has always been a personal name for the devil, not a title.
Mary is satans adversary gen 3:15 rev 12
 

D-D-W

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Satan has always been a personal name for the devil, not a title.

 

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Yep Satan Lucifer devil red dragon for sure but the glorious name of Jesus conquers him
 

jaybo

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Satan is the devil's name.

Job 1:7, "The Lord said to Satan, “Where have you come from?” And Satan answered the Lord, “From roving about on the earth, and from walking back and forth across it.” It doesn't say "the devil".

Zechariah 3:2a, "The Lord said to Satan, “May the Lord rebuke you, Satan! " It doesn't say "the devil".

Matthew 4:10, "Then Jesus said to him, “Go away, Satan! For it is written: ‘You are to worship the Lord your God and serve only him.’”. It doesn't say "the devil".

Mark 3:23, "So he called them and spoke to them in parables: “How can Satan cast out Satan?" It doesn't say "the devil".

Luke 22:31, “Simon, Simon, pay attention! Satan has demanded to have you all, to sift you like wheat," It doesn't say "the devil".

Romans 16:20, "The God of peace will quickly crush Satan under your feet. The grace of our Lord Jesus be with you." It doesn't say "the devil".

1 Corinthians 5:5, "hand this man over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord." It doesn't say "the devil".

... and many more places. There is no Biblical justification for saying that "Satan" is a title. It's the devil's name; it's always capitalized There are many places -- 34 times in my Bible -- where "devil" is used as Satan's title.
 

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There is no Biblical justification for saying that "Satan" is a title. It's the devil's name; it's always capitalized There are many places -- 34 times in my Bible -- where "devil" is used as Satan's title.
Um - you DO realize that neither the original Hebrew or Greek have upper and lower case letters?
Capitalization is strictly COMMENTARY?
 

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Um - you DO realize that neither the original Hebrew or Greek have upper and lower case letters?
Capitalization is strictly COMMENTARY?
What does that have to do with my post? Are you saying that there was no such thing as a proper name vs a title?

Again, there is no Biblical justification for saying that "Satan" is a title. It's the devil's name; it's always capitalized [in our modern Bibles]. There are many places -- 34 times in my Bible -- where "devil" (not capitalized) is used as Satan's title. It is ridiculous to bring up the subject of capitalization regarding proper names in Scripture.
 

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You cannot judge anything along those lines by english translation. You have to go to the original source. And since Satan was transliterated into Greek from the Hebrew you have to investigate how the ancient Jews who spoke that language used it. That has been preserved in the Hebrew and Aramaic texts of 2nd Temple period Jewish writings.

And they use satan as the normal word for adversary.
 

jaybo

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You cannot judge anything along those lines by english translation. You have to go to the original source. And since Satan was transliterated into Greek from the Hebrew you have to investigate how the ancient Jews who spoke that language used it. That has been preserved in the Hebrew and Aramaic texts of 2nd Temple period Jewish writings.

And they use satan as the normal word for adversary.
Then why is "Satan", the proper name, used repeatedly throughout both Testaments? Multiple times!!

It's used by God over and over in Job -- ten times by my count --, and Jesus said in Matthew 4:10, “Go away, Satan! For it is written: ‘You are to worship the Lord your God and serve only him.’” If Jesus and God call the devil by his name "Satan" that's proof enough for me that it is his proper name.
 
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