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I think you are correct in that God does discipline his children, but the punishment mentioned in John's writing is the punishment at "the day of judgment." So I think we agree that a believer needs to keep in mind that God does discipline his children and and it can be severe.

The punishment the elect need not fear is the punishment coming to many on the day of judgement. This makes sense to me in that it seems impossible to me that a person can simultaneously have faith Jesus took upon Himself their sin - and God's wrath for their sin - and yet fear they face God's wrath at the judgement.

A father raises children. A judge brings down the law upon criminals. We are called to be born again and be children of the Most High God. If we don't become children we will come under God as Judge one day and the law will be brought down upon us. At that time 'death' will be the verdict. But as children we will avoid that judgment, but not the punishment that a loving father using to raise his children.

Here are a few verses to show what I mean.

First: John 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

So a person is born again, and sees the kingdom of God, which is a heavenly kingdom. You are no longer considered a criminal waiting for judgment, but a member of the kingdom of God and part of it.

Then in John Jesus begins on a explanations of what it means to be born again, and we see that it means we don't come under judgment.

John 3:18 He who believes in Him is not judged;

In case you don't understand what that means, it means we who believe does not come into judgement, but has passed out of death and into life.

John 5:24 ...and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

So that is the judgment you are talking about. However there still is the bringing up of children. That mean discipleship, which means discipline, training, teaching, reproof, and if needed corresponding punishment. Those are all done because God loves us as children when we believe in Him.

And here are a few verses to consider that address the love of a father for his child, not the verdict of a judge.

Rev 3:19 Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.

Prov 23: 13,14 Do not hold back discipline from the child, although you strike him with the rod, he will not die. You shall strike him with the rod and rescue his soul from Sheol.

Now from dealing with the Lord as my Lord, I have discovered from experience that He is indeed a wonderful, patient, and loving God. So much so that He has at times given me what might best be described and a spiritual spanking when I have gotten stubborn and rebellious. And I am grateful for His corrective actions. They make me a better person and teach me lessons.

So what amazes me is when I come across people that say the know the Lord but don't understand this. How can that be? Perhaps they don't need training in righteousness. Or perhaps they are so close to being perfect that they have not experienced the reproof and discipline of a loving father. If that is indeed the case, good for them, and I am glade for them. Yet there is another possibility which I believe is more likely the case, and that is that they don't really know Him, and are leaning on their own understanding instead of actually seeking the Lord and His wisdom. So I provide the verse below just incase that might be the case.

Is 5:21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

I seek the Lord and I have found Him. In that I have found a God that loves me and is patient with me, but who also reproves me and is not beyond applying the rod to make sure I get the correction needed. I can testify about both His love and His reproof. I hear from the Lord Jesus Christ and the most common thing I hear Him tell me is 'I love you.'. I have at times heard Him tell me that perhaps a dozen times in a day. Yet, and this is much rarer, I have also felt the rod. I once was angry with Him and told Him, "What are you going to do, hit me upside the head?" And He did! Right then I got hit in the head and it felt just like someone had struck me in the right temple of my head. "Wow", It amazed me so much that I completely forgot my anger at Him and just sat there in amazement of His awesomeness. It is an awesome thing to know someone who cares for me enough to help me when I need it most. And I need it most when I get stubborn and rebellious.

If anyone doesn't really know this God, you need to. If you have been reading your Bible and leaning on your understanding of it instead of seeking a close personal relationship with the very real and true God, then you need to stop thinking you are wise and prudent in your own eyes and start seeking what the Lord Jesus Christ has to personally say to you. But be aware, He reproves and disciplines those He loves, and He won't spare the rod if it means spoiling the child!
 
I Corinthians 3:11
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

And. To some the following scripture defines where the above was taking place.
II Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Then the book of life is opened.

Sure sounds like business is being taken care of right at the end. Much like the last minute conversion of one thief on his cross.

eddif
 
A father raises children. A judge brings down the law upon criminals. We are called to be born again and be children of the Most High God. If we don't become children we will come under God as Judge one day and the law will be brought down upon us. At that time 'death' will be the verdict. But as children we will avoid that judgment, but not the punishment that a loving father using to raise his children.

Here are a few verses to show what I mean.

First: John 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."

So a person is born again, and sees the kingdom of God, which is a heavenly kingdom. You are no longer considered a criminal waiting for judgment, but a member of the kingdom of God and part of it.

Then in John Jesus begins on a explanations of what it means to be born again, and we see that it means we don't come under judgment.

John 3:18 He who believes in Him is not judged;

In case you don't understand what that means, it means we who believe does not come into judgement, but has passed out of death and into life.

John 5:24 ...and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

So that is the judgment you are talking about. However there still is the bringing up of children. That mean discipleship, which means discipline, training, teaching, reproof, and if needed corresponding punishment. Those are all done because God loves us as children when we believe in Him.

And here are a few verses to consider that address the love of a father for his child, not the verdict of a judge.

Rev 3:19 Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.

Prov 23: 13,14 Do not hold back discipline from the child, although you strike him with the rod, he will not die. You shall strike him with the rod and rescue his soul from Sheol.

Now from dealing with the Lord as my Lord, I have discovered from experience that He is indeed a wonderful, patient, and loving God. So much so that He has at times given me what might best be described and a spiritual spanking when I have gotten stubborn and rebellious. And I am grateful for His corrective actions. They make me a better person and teach me lessons.

So what amazes me is when I come across people that say the know the Lord but don't understand this. How can that be? Perhaps they don't need training in righteousness. Or perhaps they are so close to being perfect that they have not experienced the reproof and discipline of a loving father. If that is indeed the case, good for them, and I am glade for them. Yet there is another possibility which I believe is more likely the case, and that is that they don't really know Him, and are leaning on their own understanding instead of actually seeking the Lord and His wisdom. So I provide the verse below just incase that might be the case.

Is 5:21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

I seek the Lord and I have found Him. In that I have found a God that loves me and is patient with me, but who also reproves me and is not beyond applying the rod to make sure I get the correction needed. I can testify about both His love and His reproof. I hear from the Lord Jesus Christ and the most common thing I hear Him tell me is 'I love you.'. I have at times heard Him tell me that perhaps a dozen times in a day. Yet, and this is much rarer, I have also felt the rod. I once was angry with Him and told Him, "What are you going to do, hit me upside the head?" And He did! Right then I got hit in the head and it felt just like someone had struck me in the right temple of my head. "Wow", It amazed me so much that I completely forgot my anger at Him and just sat there in amazement of His awesomeness. It is an awesome thing to know someone who cares for me enough to help me when I need it most. And I need it most when I get stubborn and rebellious.

If anyone doesn't really know this God, you need to. If you have been reading your Bible and leaning on your understanding of it instead of seeking a close personal relationship with the very real and true God, then you need to stop thinking you are wise and prudent in your own eyes and start seeking what the Lord Jesus Christ has to personally say to you. But be aware, He reproves and disciplines those He loves, and He won't spare the rod if it means spoiling the child!
Ummm...K2, I'm a bit baffled. Do you realize I agree with you? I wrote the same as you. Just with fewer words.
 

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