God Lives vs. Literalism

[bennyboy]

Hi, guys. I'm not Christian in a churchgoing sense, but I'm not an atheist either. I have maybe half a dozen questions I really want to get answers on, since most of my ansers are drawn from reading the Bible rather than talking to real-live Christians.

One thing that bothers me about Christianity is the idea that there's One message for All people. It seems to me that represents a lack of faith. Was there something special about Abraham or Moses over people living today, in that they were given all the Word, which we now have to interpret and struggle to understand in a modern context?

It seems to me real faith is to believe that God is alive and well in the world, and busily at work guiding us, with new insights and new inspiration.

Is this blasphemy or faith?

 

[happyjoy]

Faith. There is no one way.

 

[samuel]

Jesus said "I am the Truth, the Life, and the Way". By no other way, may a man approach God. That's all that needs to be said! in answer to this question.

 

[happyjoy]

Jesus said "I am the Truth, the Life, and the Way". By no other way, may a man approach God. That's all that needs to be said! in answer to this question.

Just to be clear Jesus didn't say the By no other way, may a man approach God. One should not put words in Jesus mouth.


What that quote means is certainly up to interpretation.

 

[samuel]

Did you see! any quotation marks around that last statement. That says it is not a quote, and what Jesus said is NOT up to any interpretation, other than just exactly what it says. :bigfrown

 

[happyjoy]

Did you see! any quotation marks around that last statement. That says it is not a quote, and what Jesus said is NOT up to any interpretation, other than just exactly what it says. :bigfrown

If it doesn't need an interpretation then why did you interpret it?

I just wanted to make sure the casual reader wouldn't take your interpretation for the words of Jesus.

I think that the quote has several possible interpretations.

 

[Vic C.]

Jesus said "I am the Truth, the Life, and the Way". By no other way, may a man approach God. That's all that needs to be said! in answer to this question.

Just to be clear Jesus didn't say the By no other way, may a man approach God. One should not put words in Jesus mouth.

What that quote means is certainly up to interpretation.

Oh my goodness! The meaning of this verse is as clear as the wrinkles on my 53 year old face!

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. NIV

Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me. NASB

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. NKJV

Jesus saith to him, `I am the way, and the truth, and the life, no one doth come unto the Father, if not through me; YLT

Jesus says to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father unless by me. Darby

Jesus saith to him, I am way, truth, and life; no man cometh to the Father, but by me. Wycliffe

There you are; that represents about 500 years worth of translations from a couple different MMSs.

It means the same now, as it did then, as it did when Jesus spoke the words. :yes

I think that the quote has several possible interpretations.

It has one and only one and this is it!

1 Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

 

[happyjoy]

[quote:yxvoj5l8][quote:yxvoj5l8]*Staff note- snipped for it's total reduncancy*

[/quote:yxvoj5l8][/quote:yxvoj5l8]
There are multiple interpretations to all quotes. You can't speak for Jesus or God. You are speaking for yourself and your interpretation.

 

[samuel]

No unfortunately he is not!. The verses Vic posted are directly from Gods book, the one we call the Bible. These are not the opinions of men, but recorded by the apostles, and prophets as moved by the very hand of God.

 

[happyjoy]

No unfortunately he is not!. The verses Vic posted are directly from Gods book, the one we call the Bible. These are not the opinions of men, but recorded by the apostles, and prophets as moved by the very hand of God.

The quotes are from the bible. The interpretations given were yours and his.

 

[Vic C.]

You're just wasting our time and furthering the derailment of the OP.

totopic (all other posts will be deleted)

 

[samuel]

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

It seems to me, this needs no further interpretation. Only a blind man, would have to have this explained to him.

To phrase it so the modern man understands it: "There is no way Hose that any dude is going to Heaven EXCEPT by Faith, and Trust in Jesus Christ.

 

[Vic C.]

Samuel, I realize you posted right after me and didn't see my last post. :yes

totopic

 

[samuel]

One thing that bothers me about Christianity is the idea that there's One message for All people. It seems to me that represents a lack of faith. Was there something special about Abraham or Moses over people living today, in that they were given all the Word, which we now have to interpret and struggle to understand in a modern context?

It seems to me real faith is to believe that God is alive and well in the world, and busily at work guiding us, with new insights and new inspiration.

When the Bible was written, it was in one context, that is the word of God.
Jam_1:17, Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
This verse tells us that God in never changing, neither is his word.

Any modern context or new revelation, I am afraid comes from other sources than the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. To whom all the promises were given, which pertain to not only the Jew, but the Gentile also. When Jesus gave the final Revelation to John on the Isle of Patmos, that was the closing of Gods book, and any further additions or revelations have been made by man; not God.

 

[Mike]

Hi, guys. I'm not Christian in a churchgoing sense, but I'm not an atheist either. I have maybe half a dozen questions I really want to get answers on, since most of my ansers are drawn from reading the Bible rather than talking to real-live Christians.

One thing that bothers me about Christianity is the idea that there's One message for All people. It seems to me that represents a lack of faith. Was there something special about Abraham or Moses over people living today, in that they were given all the Word, which we now have to interpret and struggle to understand in a modern context?

It seems to me real faith is to believe that God is alive and well in the world, and busily at work guiding us, with new insights and new inspiration.

Is this blasphemy or faith?

Benny, it appears clear that you are being moved by God. Hebrews 10:22 says:
"let us draw near to God with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water."

As you draw near to Him, you will experience Him. You will also do this in reading His Word. The faithful believe everything in the Bible was authored by God. It is Inspired, meaning the writers were penning the words given to them directly by God. The nature and history of the Bible is evidence within the evidence itself. Books written by different people in different locations at different times who never met each other and it shows amazing continuity of the One God! Since it is Inspired, we can't look to other things to replace it. This Word is Living. It is alive at any time. It's as relevant today as it was the days they they were written.

Ecclesiastes 1 says:
9 "What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.

10 Is there anything of which one can say,
"Look! This is something new"?
It was here already, long ago;
it was here before our time.

11 There is no remembrance of men of old,
and even those who are yet to come
will not be remembered
by those who follow."

Anything anyone comes up with today falls short of the True Word of God. We can talk about it and people can write about it, but we can't "rewrite" or create a new message forsaking the original.

Mike

 

[bennyboy]

Wow, guys! Thanks for your many thoughtful answers in just one day. Food for thought, for sure. I have a couple related questions, and then I'm probably done with this idea.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

It seems to me, this needs no further interpretation. Only a blind man, would have to have this explained to him.

To phrase it so the modern man understands it: "There is no way Hose that any dude is going to Heaven EXCEPT by Faith, and Trust in Jesus Christ.

I wonder to what degree some of Jesus' words were meant for a specific audience (i.e. the ones he physically said them to) as compared to being meant for all of us. For example:

Jesus said to him, "If you want to be perfect, sell what you own. Give the money to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then follow me!"

Should I take this to mean that Jesus recommends we should all leave behind our "stuff" to follow Him more purely? I like the idea of poverty as a religious lifestyle, but since I have a family, selling our house (which I own) doesn't feel right somehow. I know plenty of Christians (and Jews before Jesus arrived) have prospered, and in at least Job's case, that's attributed direcly to the will of God. Should Job have sold what he owned, and given the money to the poor?

Ecclesiastes 1 says:
9 "What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.

In context of when this was said, couldn't we say that we are new under the sun? Can you explain what this verse means?


Thanks again for all your answers. I hope you guys don't mind answering a couple more. :D

 

[watchman F]

Hi, guys. I'm not Christian in a churchgoing sense, but I'm not an atheist either. I have maybe half a dozen questions I really want to get answers on, since most of my ansers are drawn from reading the Bible rather than talking to real-live Christians.

One thing that bothers me about Christianity is the idea that there's One message for All people. It seems to me that represents a lack of faith. Was there something special about Abraham or Moses over people living today, in that they were given all the Word, which we now have to interpret and struggle to understand in a modern context?

It seems to me real faith is to believe that God is alive and well in the world, and busily at work guiding us, with new insights and new inspiration.

Is this blasphemy or faith?

I believe the bible is God's word and that He is alive and well in the world, and busily at work guiding us, with new insights and new inspiration.

 

[watchman F]

Jesus said "I am the Truth, the Life, and the Way". By no other way, may a man approach God. That's all that needs to be said! in answer to this question.

Just to be clear Jesus didn't say the By no other way, may a man approach God. One should not put words in Jesus mouth.


What that quote means is certainly up to interpretation.

Yes He did
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

 

[samuel]

When the Lord told the rich man to sell all that he owned, he knew what stood between that man and Heaven. Thus the parable of the camel, and the needles eye that follows.

We all have Worldly obligations we must attend to, but it is how we perceive them that is the problem. Its really not a matter to a point!, what we own, but what owns us. Anything that stands between us, and what God may ask of us, becomes an Idol, and the Idol becomes sin, and sin separates man from God which is death.

Here is my favorite Psalm, if you study it, it explains a lot.

Psalms 1:

1, Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
2, But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
3, And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
4, The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away.
5, Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
6, For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.


If you ask the questions of Scripture, who, where, what, when, why, and how most of the time you will find to whom! a passage of scripture is addressed. Some scriptures are addressed to whom it may concern, but most are definitely addressed to Individuals, Israel, or the gentiles (us). There is one word many have trouble with, that is Saints. While it is assumed this refers to the Church, it does not always - but in some cases applies to Israel. Most people make the mistake when they read of stopping on one verse, you have to read the Bible as a whole Paragraph, Chapter, or book to get the full meaning of many things.

 

[Mike]

Ecclesiastes 1 says:
9 "What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun.

In context of when this was said, couldn't we say that we are new under the sun? Can you explain what this verse means?

Benny, earlier in Ecclesiastes 1 we read:

" 3 What does man gain from all his labor
at which he toils under the sun?
4 Generations come and generations go,
but the earth remains forever.
5 The sun rises and the sun sets,
and hurries back to where it rises.
6 The wind blows to the south
and turns to the north;
round and round it goes,
ever returning on its course.
7 All streams flow into the sea,
yet the sea is never full.
To the place the streams come from,
there they return again."

What this is saying is that there are no new reasons for us to busy ourselves. We can work all day and spend our lives at a crazy pace, and for what? In spite of not having the internet and television, they too could find many things to distract them from spending time with Him. To that end, nothing today is new. We can't think that the Word applied to people when Ecclesiastes was written, but it doesn't apply to us in our lives in 2010. My point in using this is to say, His word applies to us and meets us on our terms as much as they did then.