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[_ Old Earth _] How well do you actually know The Theory of Evolution?

Greetings Barbarian

When you reply please add cites for your evidence....I can't find the primary paper for this evidence and it looks promising and convincing... perhaps your best evidence for a strange co-incidence yet, showing "macro-evolution" as a possibility.

http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/T/Taxonomy.html
View attachment 6025
This is interesting and hard to explain, if it exists...please show me the primary paper source link. I hope the study also compares giraffe, elephant, crocodile and hippo.

Shalom
 
The evolution of the globin family genes: Concordance of stochastic and augmented maximum parsimony genetic distances for α hemoglobin, β hemoglobin and myoglobin phylogenies
Journal of Molecular Biology
Volume 105, Issue 1, 25 July 1976, Pages 39–74
Richard Holmquist,
Thomas H. Jukes,
Herbert Moise
Morris Goodman,
G.William Moore
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0022283676901947

Here's a nice one from cytochrome c:
http://biologie-lernprogramme.de/da...er/daten/lit/fitch_phylogeny_construction.pdf

Comparative Biochemistry and Physiology Part B: Comparative Biochemistry
Volume 39, Issue 3, 15 July 1971, Pages 455–482
Evolution of hemoglobin in primates and other therian mammals
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0305049171901921
http://www.oxfordjournals.org/subject/medicine/
Oxford JournalsMedicine & Health & Science & Mathematics
Molecular Biology and Evolution Volume 11, Issue 3

Molecular evidence for the inclusion of cetaceans within the order Artiodactyla.

  1. D Graur and
  2. D G Higgins
http://mbe.oxfordjournals.org/content/11/3/357.short

Artiodactyl%20family%20tree.gif

http://bioweb.uwlax.edu/bio203/s2009/nelson_lau4/classification.htm
 
turnorburn said:
Earlier you said "That doesn't mean he didn't create things with the ability to change" what do you mean by this statement?

tob
Click to expand...
It means exactly what it says. I don't know how I could make it clearer.
 
Barbarian said "God's word that life was created naturally."

i replied with..

Hebrews 13:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

God spoke everything into existence

That doesn't speak to things being created naturally, then you said..

"You're making that passage say more than it does"

How does what i said do that?

tob
 
Barbarian observes:
God's word that life was created naturally."

TOB writes:
i replied with..

Hebrews 13:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
Click to expand...

God says:
Gen. 1:24 And God said: Let the earth bring forth the living creature in its kind, cattle and creeping things, and beasts of the earth, according to their kinds. And it was so done.

God wins.
 
Genesis 1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so

After his kind not in his kind.. after his kind not according to their kinds: and it was so.

tob

Yes God does win..
 
turnorburn said:
Barbarian said "God's word that life was created naturally."

i replied with..

Hebrews 13:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

God spoke everything into existence

That doesn't speak to things being created naturally, then you said..

"You're making that passage say more than it does"

How does what i said do that?

tob
Click to expand...
You're assuming things about what that text is saying, namely, that it refers to everything. It could simply be referring to the basic building blocks and matter, and from there God allowed things to change and develop, as Barbarian stated. God spoke some things into existence, that is clear, but just how much and what, isn't so clear.

I suppose you should define precisely what you mean by "everything".
 
turnorburn said:
Genesis 1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so

After his kind not in his kind.. after his kind not according to their kinds: and it was so.
Click to expand...
What do you mean by "after his kind"? I really hope you're not trying to argue that these living things are somehow after God's kind:

Gen 1:24 And God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds--livestock and creeping things and beasts of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. (ESV)

Gen 1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind: cattle and creeping things and beasts of the earth after their kind"; and it was so. (NASB)

Gen 1:24 And God saith, `Let the earth bring forth the living creature after its kind, cattle and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after its kind:' and it is so. (YLT)

en 1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that crawl, and the wildlife of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. (HCSB)

Gen 1:24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. (NIV)

Gen 1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind"; and it was so. (NKJV)
 
Free said:
You're assuming things about what that text is saying, namely, that it refers to everything. It could simply be referring to the basic building blocks and matter, and from there God allowed things to change and develop, as Barbarian stated. God spoke some things into existence, that is clear, but just how much and what, isn't so clear.

I suppose you should define precisely what you mean by "everything".
Click to expand...

John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

tob
 
Free said:
What do you mean by "after his kind"? I really hope you're not trying to argue that these living things are somehow after God's kind:

Gen 1:24 And God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds--livestock and creeping things and beasts of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. (ESV)

Gen 1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures after their kind: cattle and creeping things and beasts of the earth after their kind"; and it was so. (NASB)

Gen 1:24 And God saith, `Let the earth bring forth the living creature after its kind, cattle and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after its kind:' and it is so. (YLT)

en 1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that crawl, and the wildlife of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. (HCSB)

Gen 1:24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. (NIV)

Gen 1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth the living creature according to its kind: cattle and creeping thing and beast of the earth, each according to its kind"; and it was so. (NKJV)
Click to expand...

Each was made after its kind, a spider is a spider, a bird is a bird, a monkey is a monkey, man is man, made in Gods image, we know that Jesus made us we were made in his image, man is the only one made in Gods image..

tob
 
Free said:
And this answers my post how?
Click to expand...

Why are we going around like this Free, you said "I suppose you should define precisely what you mean by "everything"

So i replied with John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

tob
 
turnorburn said:
Why are we going around like this Free, you said "I suppose you should define precisely what you mean by "everything"

So i replied with John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

tob
Click to expand...
It doesn't provide any clarity. You've merely replaced "everything" with "all things," which is saying the same thing. What is it that you think these terms are referring to?

You are continually assuming two things: 1) what God spoke into existence, and 2) how God made things. You equate the two but they are not necessarily one and the same. In those two things you are continually making all the passages you cite say more than they are saying. You have not given any evidence that those passages actually say what you are making them say.
 
The evidence is in the scripture..

Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

This doesn't speak of things being created by natural means, how do you see it?

tob
 
Maybe this will help?

Evolution states that each animal evolved from some other kind of animal. Man evolved from apes, birds evolved from dinosaurs, mammals evolved from fish, etc, etc, etc. The phrase “after his kind” proves evolution wrong. Genesis 1 teaches that God created grass, herbs, trees, whales, birds, cattle, creeping things, and every living thing after their kind. God did not use the process of evolution to create His creatures. He spoke by the word of His mouth and a whale was created. He spoke by the word of His mouth and a monkey was created. He spoke and the crow was created. A fish cannot become a mammal, because a fish is of a different kind, than a mammal. Therefore, evolution is not in harmony with what Genesis 1 teaches us. One cannot be a theistic evolutionist for God created each living thing after their own kind. God created it, it did not evolve into different kinds.

https://douloitheou.wordpress.com/2013/09/17/creationism-4-after-his-kind/

tob

*edit: forgot something "again"

Psalm 33:8 Let all the earth fear the LORD: let all the inhabitants of the world stand in awe of him.
9 For he spake, and it was done; he commanded, and it stood fast.
 
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