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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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I AM...I AM WHOM I AM
- Thread starter Classik
- Start date
Classik
Member
Such expression seems to kind of hide the ID of the ONE who sent me (as is in the case of Moses). And of course visiting a King would require your telling him all he needs to know.
Christ_empowered
Member
I always kinda thought it was a way of simply and elegantly stating His might. No gimmicks, no elaborate names or idols, simply....I AM. Kind of like when God refers to Himself (and rightly so) as "the alpha and the omega." Simple, but profound.
God's_gift
Member
Kidron
Member
Classik
Member
Which says:
“Very truly I tell you,†Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!â€
Classik
Member
Any explanation?
Jethro Bodine
Member
No beginning, no end, no interruptions...he just is.
"...peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come.." (Rev. 1:4 NIV)
"...peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come.." (Rev. 1:4 NIV)
Its not his name.
He gave his proper noun to Moses in the next verse. Unless you have a Hebrew language bible you will not see it because it is blotted out in your translation and replaced with 'Lord'.
FYI regardless of the language "i am" is a verb, most people think verb identifies action but it also is a state of being. 'I am' in this case is a state of being (eternal) it could also be used in response to a question, such as are you so and so? why yes I am. Unfortunately the translators made a theological decision for you by capitalizing it and then teach it as a proper noun.
I also have thoughts about John 8:58 but Im in the car and will respond later
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Classik
Member
Drive safely. :D
John 8:58 before Abraham was, I am.
Well, I have come to understand when God told Moses "eheye asher eheye" (I will ever be what I now am) is simply saying he is eternal. Even when he told Moses "eheye" has sent me to you. Eheye or as it is translated "I am" is a verb or a state of being in both Hebrew and the English languages not a proper noun as many teach.
His proper noun is found in the very next verse. However in the english translation it is as I mention blotted out. And replaced as 'The Lord'
"And God said moreover to Moses, Thus shall you say to the people of Israel, The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you; this is my name forever, and this is my memorial to all generations."
However in the biblical Hebrew language it is still there as HVHY or in Hebrew יחרח. And according to the ben asher texts pronounced Yehovah.
ויאמר עוד אלהים אל-משה כה תאמר אל-בני ישראל יהוה אלהי אבתיכם אלהי אברהם אלהי יצחק ואלהי יעקב שלחני אליכם זה-שמי לעלם וזה זכרי לדר דר:
It is Yehovah which God says shall be his appelation forever. This name (appellation) in fact is used well over six thousand times in the Tanakh to identify God. Never again do we read of the verb 'eheye'.
Yeshua is recorded as saying "before Abraham was, I am. Being "I am" as I understand it is not a proper noun nor is it the name of God. What then did he mean by it?
Now I believe the 'sent one' Yeshua pre-exsited however it was in the mind of the Creator (fore-ordained) not in a litoral sense nor was he part of some triune nature of a sovereign God. Especially as Yehovah Himself said "there are none beside me" and He alone is our saviour.
Here is some of the writings of the Hebraic thoughts on Messiah. Which seem to support this idea of foreordination of which I tend to favor.
"Seven things were created before the world was created: Torah, repentance, the Garden of Eden (i.e.Paradise), Gehinnom, the Throne of Glory, the Temple, and the name of the Messiah" (Pes. 54a).
"From the beginning of the creation of the world king Messiah was born, for he entered the mind (of God) before even the world was created" (Pesikta Rab. 152b)
Even Peter a Hebrew man supports this idea as he writes. "But with the precious blood of christ, as the lamb without blemish and without spot. Who verily was foreordained (destined) before the very foundation of the world, but was made manifest in these last times for you"
Paul allude to this aswell when he writes
... as it is written, "A father of many nations have I made you" ) in the sight of Him whom he believed, even God, who gives life to the dead and calls into being that which does not exist.
As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Anyways thats my take on it.
Well, I have come to understand when God told Moses "eheye asher eheye" (I will ever be what I now am) is simply saying he is eternal. Even when he told Moses "eheye" has sent me to you. Eheye or as it is translated "I am" is a verb or a state of being in both Hebrew and the English languages not a proper noun as many teach.
His proper noun is found in the very next verse. However in the english translation it is as I mention blotted out. And replaced as 'The Lord'
"And God said moreover to Moses, Thus shall you say to the people of Israel, The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you; this is my name forever, and this is my memorial to all generations."
However in the biblical Hebrew language it is still there as HVHY or in Hebrew יחרח. And according to the ben asher texts pronounced Yehovah.
ויאמר עוד אלהים אל-משה כה תאמר אל-בני ישראל יהוה אלהי אבתיכם אלהי אברהם אלהי יצחק ואלהי יעקב שלחני אליכם זה-שמי לעלם וזה זכרי לדר דר:
It is Yehovah which God says shall be his appelation forever. This name (appellation) in fact is used well over six thousand times in the Tanakh to identify God. Never again do we read of the verb 'eheye'.
Yeshua is recorded as saying "before Abraham was, I am. Being "I am" as I understand it is not a proper noun nor is it the name of God. What then did he mean by it?
Now I believe the 'sent one' Yeshua pre-exsited however it was in the mind of the Creator (fore-ordained) not in a litoral sense nor was he part of some triune nature of a sovereign God. Especially as Yehovah Himself said "there are none beside me" and He alone is our saviour.
Here is some of the writings of the Hebraic thoughts on Messiah. Which seem to support this idea of foreordination of which I tend to favor.
"Seven things were created before the world was created: Torah, repentance, the Garden of Eden (i.e.Paradise), Gehinnom, the Throne of Glory, the Temple, and the name of the Messiah" (Pes. 54a).
"From the beginning of the creation of the world king Messiah was born, for he entered the mind (of God) before even the world was created" (Pesikta Rab. 152b)
Even Peter a Hebrew man supports this idea as he writes. "But with the precious blood of christ, as the lamb without blemish and without spot. Who verily was foreordained (destined) before the very foundation of the world, but was made manifest in these last times for you"
Paul allude to this aswell when he writes
... as it is written, "A father of many nations have I made you" ) in the sight of Him whom he believed, even God, who gives life to the dead and calls into being that which does not exist.
As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Anyways thats my take on it.
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Comprehender
Member
Well put, Jethro!
God is timeless... which some say we only experience eternity in the "now."
You can't feel something yesterday or tomorrow, only now, presently.
I consider "I AM" in relation to a few other scriptures...
"The kingdom of God is WITHIN YOU."
"Be still and know that I AM God."
"I AM the truth, the way & the light."
As for me I see nothing wrong with the translation. It is just the same as saying 'I was (past) , I am (now or present) I will be (future) which is perfectly acceptable as well. Both of them tell me He is unchanging and eternal. If you see something other than that then please know it was not my intention.
The point I am trying to make is I am is not the name He told us to call Him by. The other point I trying to make was what Yeshua meant when he said 'Before Abraham was, I am'.
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