If being gay is a sin, why did God make people like that?

[Reido]

There is a major difference between homosexuality and the other things you mentioned that I think you may have missed.
Homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone, unlike the others.
They may all be sins, but they aren't all the same.

Hello, I missed nothing. I won't argue with you, but I challenge the idea that homosexuality hurts no one. Druggies, alcoholics, adulterers, etc. use that same sort of rationalization.

Example; you are a wife and you find out your hubby is cheating on you, with another man! You may have been able to resolve and overcome the situation had it been a woman. Instead, the idea of it being a man instead is too much to bear. You fall into a severe state of clinical depression. You also find out you just contracted an STD that your husband got from his male partner. Your family is torn apart and your children are affected in ways that are almost impossible to deal with.

But homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone...

Gen 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

The problem is that the situation you presented was not just homosexuality. It was homosexuality AND cheating.

 

[Vic C.]

That's not a problem and you are just rationalizing. Ok, the hubby was a with a man before marriage and spread his STD to you. It has caused problems during your pregnancy and has even been passed on to the unborn child.

You may continue trying to convince yourself and others that it "doesn't hurt anyone" but you will be deceiving yourself and others.

I'm not trying to hate on anyone or come down on you personally, but in life, we have to deal with the sometimes hard facts of reality and the devastation our sins and sin nature bring upon ourselves and others. We have become a "I just only care about me" society in a guise of making it look like we care about others. If we really care about others, we'd be out there letting people know about the potential dangers of our actions.

Please forgive me for being such a realist sometimes. What is more truthful, shrouding the truth in fallacies and niceties in an effort to not hurt someone's feelings or telling them the truth because you care, even if it means that person will somehow not like you anymore?

 

[Reido]

That's not a problem and you are just rationalizing. Ok, the hubby was a with a man before marriage and spread his STD to you. It has caused problems during your pregnancy and has even been passed on to the unborn child.

You may continue trying to convince yourself and others that it "doesn't hurt anyone" but you will be deceiving yourself and others.

I'm not trying to hate on anyone or come down on you personally, but in life, we have to deal with the sometimes hard facts of reality and the devastation our sins and sin nature bring upon ourselves and others. We have become a "I just only care about me" society in a guise of making it look like we care about others. If we really care about others, we'd be out there letting people know about the potential dangers of our actions.

Please forgive me for being such a realist sometimes. What is more truthful, shrouding the truth in fallacies and niceties in an effort to not hurt someone's feelings or telling them the truth because you care, even if it means that person will somehow not like you anymore?

Heterosexuality can cause STDs as well.
I suppose you're right, it can hurt people. But it's not comparable to things like murder and theft and such. And it seems like you're talking more about sexuality in general and it's adverse effects than just homosexuality.

 

[Vic C.]

Heterosexuality can cause STDs as well.

<bangs bead> Cause or spread?

I suppose you're right, it can hurt people. But it's not comparable to things like murder and theft and such. And it seems like you're talking more about sexuality in general and it's adverse effects than just homosexuality.

A concession; I like that. ;) ... and just so it's known, I'm not talking about homosexuality at all. I am referring to the physical homosexual act itself. That is the sin in question here.

 

[animal]

Do gay quadriplegics go to hell?

 

[Reido]

A concession; I like that. ;) ... and just so it's known, I'm not talking about homosexuality at all. I am referring to the physical homosexual act itself. That is the sin in question here.

Well, my stance is easily changed when I realize I'm wrong. So if I'm wrong about something a concession will usually happen.
I think I understand what you're saying now.

 

[CatholicFirefighter]

If being gay is a sin, why did God make people like that?

Catholic Church Teaching says that having homosexual tendencies is not a sin.

But acting on those tendencies is.

Also, God does not "make" people homosexuals.

Adam and Eve fell in the Garden, and everything has been messed up since then.

But with Jesus Christ, all immoral actions can be fought/overcome.

People just need to accept Jesus Christ as God and get in the game ...

 

[peter33]

thats the thing though, there are many unbelievers out there and aiming ti take God out of everything. the difference is, they are smaller groups but have louder voices. we christians and God fearing folk, whom there is more of, have to make our voices even louder! or else ppl will think its ok to sin.

 

[Paidion]

There is a major difference between homosexuality and the other things you mentioned that I think you may have missed. Homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone, unlike the others.

I agree with Vic that homosexuality does hurt other people ---- in the ways which Vic has mentioned, as well as many other ways. Here are just a couple more:

Male homosexuals often hurt their partners physically because of the nature of anal sex which is commonly practised among male homosexuals.

I have seen statistics which indicate that children raised by homosexual couples are much more likely to become homosexuals themselves, and thus the harm increases.

 

[Eichblatt]

I believe that gayness is a lie.

The devil lies to you and you lie to yourself and you THINK you're gay. But you never were and never will be.

I'm not speaking out of ignorance, I've been through that.

 

[turnorburn]

Romans 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

I know I know turnorburn is just another bible thumper isn't he, not exactly, we don't think the way the Lord thinks lets take a look.

Isaiah 55:6 Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

turnorburn

 

[Slippermen]

this is my first post on here, not sure if this is where it goes so if it must be moved to another forum let it be. anyway, i am straight young man of 22 and a strong Christian but this subject has always bothered me. i am very against gay marriage, lifestyle, etc and all that, and everytime i talk about my views on this subject, i get critizised, called a "bigot" or whatever because i dont agree with that lifestyle. its rediculous. they are a minority group acting like a whole race of people. i feel strongly about it because, i am myself am a romantic and i love women and love being romantic with them. when i hear about the perversion that has taken over our culture, it makes me just plain sick. its the grossest thing i can imagine a human being doing. but i am curious however, if God said so specifically in the Bible that homosexuals will not enter the Kingdom of God, then how come they exist? ive heard many reasons, the most prominent one being that ever since the fall of man and the existence of sin, mankind has simply gotten sick and created in itself many different sins, including homosexuality. is this true though? is someone being gay a product of mankinds sin? i'd really like to know.

well I see it like this, someone insults you for being Christian-calls you all sorts of names, and even tries to attack you or kill you-I would think differently then.
I am a believer in gay rights-and this belief-time and time again has kept me out of the church, praying or anything else Christian-I believe in God-I keep distance from the church and any organized religion because I don't want to listen to humans about things they cannot know.
If the worst thing I can do in life is believe gays deserve equal rights-then I am pretty sure I am not doing that bad in life
I am not gay, but I know gays and they are good people-and I won't turn my back on them, I don't believe its a choice-but thats my opinion

 

[JoJo]

I always believed that people were not born homosexual until the other day when talking to my mother about my aunt.

Some background: My aunt "Lynn" (a lovely, sweet, wonderful Christian) spent many years, after a failed marriage, living the homosexual lifestyle with her partner. That was about 20 years ago. Today my aunt is not with the woman, or any other woman, now and I don't know why she abandoned the lifestyle, but she did.

While talking to my mom the other day, I learned that my aunt and my grandma had a very strange conversation (in my mom's presence) just shortly before my grandma passed away. It went something like this:

Grandma: Lynn, I just want you to know that I'm sorry for all the years that I couldn't accept the way you were and the choices you made.

Aunt Lynn: silent

Grandma: I guess we made the wrong choice.

Aunt Lynn: quizzical look on her face

Grandma: When you were born, you had two sets of parts: both female and male. Back then, they left these sorts of decisions up to the parents. We decided you should be a girl. I'm sorry. I think we made the wrong decision.

After hearing about this conversation, I was left feeling very sad and confused. My aunt clearly did not choose her own sex (her parents did) or her sexual orientation. Perhaps if my grandparents had chosen for my aunt to be a boy, my aunt would have been attracted to the appropriate sex.

Somehow I believe the good Lord will take this into consideration.

 

[Cornelius]

Being a Christian is not about living our lives anymore. Real Christianity is about giving up our lives, no matter what they are or were. Its not about being gay or not, its not about anything, but dying to that which we were and taking up that which we are. Actually Who we are. Christ is suppose to be in us and living through us.

Our old nature, gay or straight has really nothing to do with it, but living for God has. Christ needs to live through us, and that is the difference between religion and real Christianity.

In religion we battle with the "right and wrong" of the situations. We want to find common moral ground with God and justify certain situations , but in reality that is not what the Gospel is about, is it? No , its about loosing our lives, gay or straight and then allowing Christ to take up that space and start a new life. A new life in Him, does not allow for me to have any of my own life to myself anymore. I must take that to the cross .Only then, will He free us all, gay or straight, to walk as He walked in this life. 1Jn 2:6 he that saith he abideth in him ought himself also to walk even as he walked.

The final answer would be: A gay person , or straight person has the same responsibility when it come to salvation. ALL must loose their old lives , IF they want to partake of the New.

 

[Joe67]

Being a Christian is not about living our lives anymore. Real Christianity is about giving up our lives, no matter what they are or were. Its not about being gay or not, its not about anything, but dying to that which we were and taking up that which we are. Actually Who we are. Christ is suppose to be in us and living through us.

Our old nature, gay or straight has really nothing to do with it, but living for God has. Christ needs to live through us, and that is the difference between religion and real Christianity.

In religion we battle with the "right and wrong" of the situations. We want to find common moral ground with God and justify certain situations , but in reality that is not what the Gospel is about, is it? No , its about loosing our lives, gay or straight and then allowing Christ to take up that space and start a new life. A new life in Him, does not allow for me to have any of my own life to myself anymore. I must take that to the cross .Only then, will He free us all, gay or straight, to walk as He walked in this life. 1Jn 2:6 he that saith he abideth in him ought himself also to walk even as he walked.


The final answer would be: A gay person , or straight person has the same responsibility when it come to salvation. ALL must loose their old lives , IF they want to partake of the New.

Cornelius,

Man cannot choose this giving up and this walking; this dying and living(serving).

God justifies whom he will. He reconciles us through the death of His Son. He makes us to fall on our face as dead when he speaks his justification to us.

God sanctifies whom he will. He saves us in ministry by the power of the resurrection life that is in His Son, Jesus, who he called to the priesthood when he raised him from the dead. He makes us to stand on our feet when he sets us apart for the ministry of grace under Jesus, our Head.

All nations are blessed in God's will to justify the family of Shem(spiritual symbolism), and to sanctify the family of priests to minister to the nations the grace of God in the Lamb of God. The spiritual quality of the Ham frame of mind must perish. Ham dishonored his father and mother. He exposed his father's drunkenness and nakedness. The spiritual qualities represented by Shem and Japeth will rise from the grave unto eternal life. Japeth is given to abide in the tent of Shem. They walked backward and covered their father's nakedness. Love covers a multitude of sins. These are God's two witnesses.

The nations are not given to live in the city with the priesthood of Jesus and his family of priests, they come every new moon and every sabbath to benefit in the grace of God in Jesus and his body.(Coming on the new moon prepares you to come on the sabbath / both are symbolic of the spiritual qualities of God in Jesus Christ).

Joe

 

[turnorburn]

Question: "What was the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah?"

Answer: What was the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah? It is abundantly clear that Sodomy was the primary evil. The biblical account of Sodom and Gomorrah is recorded in Genesis chapters 18-19. Genesis chapter 18 records the LORD and two angels coming to speak with Abraham. The LORD reiterated His promise to Abraham that he would have a son through Sarah. The LORD also informed Abraham that "the outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous." Verses 22-33 record Abraham pleading with the LORD to have mercy on Sodom and Gomorrah because Abraham's nephew, Lot, and his family lived in Sodom.

Genesis chapter 19 records the two angels, disguised as human men, visiting Sodom and Gomorrah. Lot met the angels in the city square and urged them to stay at his house. The angels agreed. The Bible then informs us, "Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom  both young and old  surrounded the house. They called to Lot, 'Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them.'" The angels then proceed to blind all the men of Sodom and Gomorrah and urge Lot and his family to flee from the cities to escape the wrath that God was about to deliver. Lot and his family flee the city, and then "the LORD rained down burning sulfur on Sodom and Gomorrah  from the LORD out of the heavens. Thus he overthrew those cities and the entire plain, including all those living in the cities  and also the vegetation in the land."

The men of Sodom and Gomorrah, thinking that the visiting angels were men, wanted to have sex with them. Those who attempt to explain away the biblical condemnations of Sodomy claim that the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah was inhospitality. While the men of Sodom and Gomorrah were certainly being inhospitable, that clearly was not all. The men of Sodom and Gomorrah desired to perform Sodomy gang rape on the angels. Also, God never declared inhospitality to be an abomination to Him, while Leviticus 18:22 makes God’s view of homosexuality clear: “Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.â€Â

While Sodom and Gomorrah were surely guilty of many other horrendous sins, Sodomy was the reason God poured fiery sulfur on the cities, completely destroying them and all of their inhabitants. To this day, the area where Sodom and Gomorrah were located remains a desolate wasteland. Sodom and Gomorrah serve as a powerful example of how God feels about sin in general, and Sodomy specifically.

"Post note" "I replaced the word homosexual to Sodomy Sodomites"


turnorburn

"Not Gay" "Not Homosexual" but "Sodomy"


http://www.gotquestions.org/Sodom-and-Gomorrah.html

 

[Cornelius]

Man cannot choose this giving up and this walking; this dying and living(serving).

God justifies whom he will.

That is correct. But He calls some people who have been in the gay life too. He predestines those whom He has chosen to be conformed into the image of His Son. Those who are called are many, but few will manifest Christ (chosen) because , even though they were called ("invited" in the Greek) they did not lay down their lives , did not take up their cross and they did not die to self.

How do you know you are chosen?
When you bear the fruit of the chosen. You know God has given you grace to bear fruit, WHEN you bear fruit. Not it your own strength , but through His grace.

 

[JoJo]

That is correct. But He calls some people who have been in the gay life too. He predestines those whom He has chosen to be conformed into the image of His Son. Those who are called are many, but few will manifest Christ (chosen) because , even though they were called ("invited" in the Greek) they did not lay down their lives , did not take up their cross and they did not die to self.

Thank you, Cornelius. That is very eye-opening. Are you saying that, although a person is called/chosen by Christ, if he doesn't die to self, he will not be saved? Could you please perhaps provide a verse about dying to self?

 

[Adullam]

For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.
Mat.16:25

For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. Rom. 8:13

 

[JoJo]

Thanks!