IS THE BIBLE TRUE?

[Klee shay]

The law is now written in our hearts, so the bible is true for those who accept Jesus Christ as the Son of God - desiring to abide in the will of God.

The bible is true for everyone, or the bible is true for noone.

Yes, sehad but you cannot force a man to see when he closes his eyes can you? For that man who closes his eyes to the things of God, is the bible true for them?

Free will can deny the things of God.

To say the bible is true for everyone or the bible is true for no-one, does not respect the free will for individuals to choose.

 

[ChristineES]

It almost seems to me that the non-believers are saying that once the Bible is accpepted, then we cease to think. Maybe you don't mean to me saying that, but that is how it is coming across. I have studied evolution, the Big Bang theory, and whatever. I had to in school and I chose to later. I don't accept them, and I have a right to reject them; just as you have a right to reject The Bible.

 

[Novum]

It almost seems to me that the non-believers are saying that once the Bible is accpepted, then we cease to think. Maybe you don't mean to me saying that, but that is how it is coming across. I have studied evolution, the Big Bang theory, and whatever. I had to in school and I chose to later. I don't accept them, and I have a right to reject them; just as you have a right to reject The Bible.

Perhaps I have been guilty of overgeneralizing, and for that I apologize. But, in this post, you are as well. Some Christians, including a number of regular posters on this board, have reconciled their acceptance of the above theories with their belief in the truth of the bible.

 

[ChristineES]

Perhaps I have been guilty of overgeneralizing, and for that I apologize. But, in this post, you are as well. Some Christians, including a number of regular posters on this board, have reconciled their acceptance of the above theories with their belief in the truth of the bible.

You are right, I should have said "some nonbelievers". I apologize, I sometimes type quickly without paying attention to what I say. That is what comes to being in a hurry.

 

[mutzrein]

The Bible is true. Not all understandings are.

Yes I agree. Take Matt 16:18 for example.

 

[gingercat]

The golden rule -

Novum, this basic principle came from the Bible. Did you know that?

In fact, all good morals are in the Bible. God gave humanity morals to live by.

No human can outsmart the Bible as far as moral principles. That's how we know it is from God.

 

[Novum]

Novum, this basic principle came from the Bible. Did you know that?

Wrong, gingercat.

"This is an ordinance: Act for the man who acts, to cause him to act. This is thanking him for what he does."
- The Tale of the Eloquent Peasant In line B1 142 page 64 of The Tale of Sinuhe and Other Ancient Egyptian Poems, tr. R.B. Parkinson OUP, ~1970-1640 BCE

"That nature only is good when it shall not do unto another whatever is not good for its own self."
- Dadistan-i-Dinik 94:5, Zoroastrianism, ~700BC

"What you do not want others to do to you, do not do to others."
â€â€Confucius, c. 500 B.C.

Confucius, and others, said the same thing long before your Jesus ever supposedly lived. What's more likely is that the writers of the bible liked this pre-existing statement and placed it in the bible.

In fact, all good morals are in the Bible. God gave humanity morals to live by.

No human can outsmart the Bible as far as moral principles. That's how we know it is from God.

Let's try a little experiment, gingercat.

Situation 1: You're on top of a tall building and there is a frightened woman at the edge, clearly ready to jump. She turns to you and asks, "Am I fat?"

What would you say? What would the bible say?

Situation 2: You are walking down the street when a frightened man runs past you. A few minutes later, he is followed by a large man with a gun who asks which way the frightened man went.

What would you say? What would the bible say?

 

[Nocturnal_Principal_X]

Rather interesting information on the "Golden Rule":

Ethic of reciprocity

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethic_of_reciprocity

(Emphasis added by me)
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The ethic of reciprocity (or the Golden Rule) is a general moral principle found in virtually all religions and culture, often as a fundamental rule.

In Western culture, it is most commonly rendered by the active formulations:

"Love your neighbor as yourself" as given by Moses in the Torah, (Leviticus 19:18) and affirmed by Jesus Luke 10:27 etc.

"Do to others as you would have them do to you." as given by Jesus in the Gospels, Luke 6:13, Matt7:12 popularly rephrased as: "Treat others as you want to be treated".

Most other formulations are passive/negative. e.g.,

"What you do not want others to do to you, do not do to others." - Chinese sage Confucius
"What is hateful to you, do not to your fellow man." - Jewish sage Hillel

This traditional guiding rule was (and is) so highly valued that it has for centuries been known in English as the "Golden Rule".

Its universality suggests it is related to innate aspects of human nature (see altruism).
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A little further down the page the following can be found:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethic_of_r ... ristianity
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Christianity

The ethic of reciprocity is the essence of the teaching of Christianity. Key Biblical texts on the subject of the ethic of reciprocity include (here quoted from the New International Version):

Part of the Lord's Prayer:

Forgive us our [debts], as we forgive our [debtors]. (Some translations of Matthew have debts or trespasses, while Luke has sins)

“So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.†(Matthew 7:12)

“Do to others as you would have them do to you.†(Luke 6:31)

“Love your neighbor as yourself†(Matthew 19:19; 22:39) (Mark 12:31) (Luke 10:27) Romans (13:9) (James 2:8)

“The entire law is summed up in a single command: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’†(Galatians 5:14)
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[Novum]

The ethic of reciprocity (or the Golden Rule) is a general moral principle found in virtually all religions and culture, often as a fundamental rule.

Yes, and this is precisely what we would expect to see. It is very clear that a society in which its members follow the golden rule would potentially be more stable, last longer, and have less suffering than a society with less other-minded citizens. As such, we would expect to see the golden rule firmly entrenched in major religions like Islam, Hinduism, and Christianity.

 

[gingercat]

This is my understanding of the Bible that all good morals are from the Bible. You cannot miss any good morals that is not in the Bible, period. It is my understanding that non-beliervers or non-Christians think they have their own good morals; this is mistaken; they got the idea from the Bible's teachings, whether they realize it or not.

I am from buddist country and they are claiming that they have their own morals. It is arrogance in their part, IMHO.

 

[thessalonian]

The Bible is true. Not all understandings are.

Yes I agree. Take Matt 16:18 for example.

Great example. People just don't want to take it at face value and will come up for all kinds of obvuscations for why Peter is not the rock that Jesus was talking about. Some even write in to the margins hand gestures about Jesus pointing to himself.

 

[Novum]

This is my understanding of the Bible that all good morals are from the Bible. You cannot miss any good morals that is not in the Bible, period. It is my understanding that non-beliervers or non-Christians think they have their own good morals; this is mistaken; they got the idea from the Bible's teachings, whether they realize it or not.

I am from buddist country and they are claiming that they have their own morals. It is arrogance in their part, IMHO.

Then you deny that there is at least one "good moral" (the golden rule) that did not originate in the bible, even though there is mounds of historical evidence that Confucius, and others, said the same thing hundreds of years before your jesus. I'm not even sure what to say.

And what would your bible's morals tell you about the situations I posted that you ignored?

 

[gingercat]

Then you deny that there is at least one "good moral" (the golden rule) that did not originate in the bible,

That is correct. And don't come after me on this one becausje this is my conviction and understanding of the Bible. You keep yours and I keep mine. :D I will not debate about it.

 

[Novum]

Then you deny that there is at least one "good moral" (the golden rule) that did not originate in the bible,

That is correct. And don't come after me on this one becausje this is my conviction and understanding of the Bible. You keep yours and I keep mine. :D I will not debate about it.

I'm not asking you to debate about it, as that's clearly out of the question. I would like to point this out to the forum, though, as quite possibly the very definition of closed-mindedness - that, even faced with the historical fact that the golden rule has existed hundreds (if not thousands) of years before Jesus ever supposedly did, gingercat still refuses to believe that it originated anywhere other than the bible.

 

[gingercat]

Then you deny that there is at least one "good moral" (the golden rule) that did not originate in the bible,

That is correct. And don't come after me on this one becausje this is my conviction and understanding of the Bible. You keep yours and I keep mine. :D I will not debate about it.

I'm not asking you to debate about it, as that's clearly out of the question. I would like to point this out to the forum, though, as quite possibly the very definition of closed-mindedness.

Suit yourself, you like to make sure that how others are closed-minded

 

[ArtGuy]

I'm not asking you to debate about it, as that's clearly out of the question. I would like to point this out to the forum, though, as quite possibly the very definition of closed-mindedness - that, even faced with the historical fact that the golden rule has existed hundreds (if not thousands) of years before Jesus ever supposedly did, gingercat still refuses to believe that it originated anywhere other than the bible.

Duly noted. It's not an uncommon occurence around here, unfortunately.

 

[gingercat]

I'm not asking you to debate about it, as that's clearly out of the question. I would like to point this out to the forum, though, as quite possibly the very definition of closed-mindedness - that, even faced with the historical fact that the golden rule has existed hundreds (if not thousands) of years before Jesus ever supposedly did, gingercat still refuses to believe that it originated anywhere other than the bible.

Duly noted. It's not an uncommon occurence around here, unfortunately.

What can I say, I am proud to be Jesus' follower and I believe God is all loving and righteous and none can compare to Him. That's why I am so in love with Him :angel:

 

[gingercat]

BTW, if I am so closed-minded like you guys are claiming, I would not be converted to be Christian from non-believer. Your claim does not make sense at all.

 

[ArtGuy]

What can I say, I am proud to be Jesus' follower and I believe God is all loving and righteous and none can compare to Him. That's why I am so in love with Him :angel:

That's all well and good, but it doesn't make you any less closed-minded when you say, "I don't care what facts you presented, I'm not going to discuss this with you, so there." It's possible to assert that morality comes from God without having to claim that nobody had ever thought of "do unto others" until 2000 years ago, extensive evidence to the contrary be damned.

 

[gingercat]

but it doesn't make you any less closed-minded when you say, "I don't care what facts you presented, I'm not going to discuss this with you, so there."

That is your obsevation and I respect it. nontheless I will not discuss with someone who already closed to what I offered and explained many times. watch what you are saying Artguy. Read what I went through with Novum in my thread befor you criticize me in this manner. I gave him my best shot to reach out to him.

Jesus is the judge on these things. :o