O
Orthodox Christian
Guest
You plan on ever answering the question, Gary? here it is again, in case you forgot it in your word parsing frenzy.Gary said:More deflections
Christian Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
-
Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
-
-
Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
-
-
How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
-
G
Gary
Guest
OC is now Soma's pawn as well... LOL
Next hoop OC.... come... JUMP
:bday:
Remember, you have at least two unanswered questions...
So which "thread" in the of the Sermon on the Mount is found in the Quran?
Care to highlight any "threads" from the Gita found in the Sermon on the Mount?
Jump now...
Next hoop OC.... come... JUMP
:bday:
Remember, you have at least two unanswered questions...
So which "thread" in the of the Sermon on the Mount is found in the Quran?
Care to highlight any "threads" from the Gita found in the Sermon on the Mount?
Jump now...
B
bibleberean
Guest
I have just read the Bhagavad Gita and it is not much of a read.
It was a waste of my time because not only does it lacks real wisdom it simply confirmed what I already knew about Hindu beliefs.
I skimmed through most of it's boring contents pausing and carefully reading some of the verses that caught my eye.
There are only 18 chapters composed of 700 verses in the BG. I read it over in a couple of days. It was not that impressive.
It really isn't necessary to read all of the book.
Look at it's description of salvation.
GRACE OF THE GITA
I promise the study of this sacred dialogue of ours will be equivalent to worshipping Me with knowledge-sacrifice. (18.70)
Whoever hears this sacred dialogue with faith and without cavil becomes free from sin, and attains heaven ¾ the higher worlds of those whose actions are pure and virtuous. (18.71)
Grace of God from the scriptures.
1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1 Corinthians 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Hinduism has a different god and a different message.
It was a waste of my time because not only does it lacks real wisdom it simply confirmed what I already knew about Hindu beliefs.
I skimmed through most of it's boring contents pausing and carefully reading some of the verses that caught my eye.
There are only 18 chapters composed of 700 verses in the BG. I read it over in a couple of days. It was not that impressive.
It really isn't necessary to read all of the book.
Look at it's description of salvation.
GRACE OF THE GITA
I promise the study of this sacred dialogue of ours will be equivalent to worshipping Me with knowledge-sacrifice. (18.70)
Whoever hears this sacred dialogue with faith and without cavil becomes free from sin, and attains heaven ¾ the higher worlds of those whose actions are pure and virtuous. (18.71)
Grace of God from the scriptures.
1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1 Corinthians 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Hinduism has a different god and a different message.
O
Orthodox Christian
Guest
Spare me the air claims, my avoidant little also-ran.Gary said:
You have been dropping and avoiding questions throughout this thread.
Let me know when you're ready to answer any one of them, cupcake.
B
bibleberean
Guest
Get back on topic.
No personal bickering.
I will delete this thread if it doesn't stop. 8-)
Thanks,
Robert
No personal bickering.
I will delete this thread if it doesn't stop. 8-)
Thanks,
Robert
G
Gary
Guest
Back to the topic.... the answer is... RETARDED.
:D :D
Unless of course you are someone who thinks this is "inspired"; a "thread" to the Sermon on the Mount.
14:15
When one dies in the mode of passion, he takes birth among those engaged in fruitive activities; and when one dies in the mode of ignorance, he takes birth in the animal kingdom.
:silly:
:D :D
Unless of course you are someone who thinks this is "inspired"; a "thread" to the Sermon on the Mount.
14:15
When one dies in the mode of passion, he takes birth among those engaged in fruitive activities; and when one dies in the mode of ignorance, he takes birth in the animal kingdom.
:silly:
D
DivineNames
Guest
Gary said:
"The basis of Upanisadic ethics is to be found in the conception of evil, not as offending against the will of the gods or swerving from sacrifical rectitude as in the earlier period, but as the result of a metaphysical error which sees variety alone where there is also the unity of Brahman.(1) Empirical thought, failing to grasp the ultimate reality, distorts it or cuts it up into parts and presents them as distinct from one another. Evil is due on the practical side to this mistaken view of Reality as finiteness is on the theoretical side. It is thus contingent and has no place in the Absolute rightly understood. This misleading presentation of Reality is seen in the case not only of the objective world, but also of the self. It is because each of us regards himself as distinct from others that he strives to guard or aggrandize himself. 'When unity is realized and every being becomes our very self - how can there be any delusion or sorrow then?' In other words, all evil is traceable to aham-kara, the affirmation of the finite self, and the consequent tendency to live not in harmony with the rest of the world, but in opposition or at best in indifference to it. The impulse behind this aham-kara is not in itself bad and does not need to be wholly suppressed. The instinct to live or strive to be, which is what aham-kara signifies, is a common feature of all animate existence and is only a manifestation of the desire for self-realization. But, being really a desire to transcend finite being, it will remain unsatisfied until it is rationalized through a knowledge of the ultimate truth and the wider self is averred in place of the narrower one. That is the meaning of Aham Brahma asmi, which represents the realization of Brahman in one's own self as the highest ideal of life."
(1) "Evil originates... in the consciousness that diversity alone is true and it is overcome by the knowledge that unity underlies it, whatever explanation may eventually be given of that unity-in-diversity itself."
M. Hiriyanna, Outlines of Indian Philosophy
Matthew 25:35-40, NIV
(35) For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in,
(36) I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'
(37) "Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink?
(38)When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you?
(39)When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?'
(40)"The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'
Hitler spent some time in prison. If someone went and visited him in prison, were they visiting Christ?
B
bibleberean
Guest
Visiting a person in prison doesn't mean we have visted a child of God which is "one of His".
When Jesus refers to "one of mine". It means the children of God. In that particulor instance He means Jews during the period known as the "Great Tribulation. Matthew 24 etc.
Not everyone is the brethren of Christ.
Not everyone is of God... So, not everyone visited in prison is one of His.
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
There are children of wrath which all Christians used to be...
Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
When Jesus refers to "one of mine". It means the children of God. In that particulor instance He means Jews during the period known as the "Great Tribulation. Matthew 24 etc.
Not everyone is the brethren of Christ.
Not everyone is of God... So, not everyone visited in prison is one of His.
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
There are children of wrath which all Christians used to be...
Ephesians 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
O
Orthodox Christian
Guest
And thus, the High Priestly prayer, wherein Jesus prays that we all may be One. Modern Western Christianity emphasizes individual revelation and/or experience. The fruit of this is innumerable denominations and the many conflicts that we have between us in Christendom.
Christianity in its pure state, in its primitive presentation keeps inviolate the notion of individuality, but within the bounds of Oneness. There is One Baptism, One Faith, One Lord, One Church. Christ is among us when two or three are gathered in His Name.
In short, the teachings of the East, including the Eastern Christian Church and the Oriental religions- reveal Western Individualism to be a manifestation of illusion, and, I might say, evil.
Sad to say, I am just as caught up in the affair of aggrandization of self as any of my Western counterparts.
I thank you for posting that, Divine Names, it has spoken to me regarding my own conduct.
In answer to your question regarding Hitler: yes- unequivocably, yes.
B
bibleberean
Guest
Not everyone is a child of God.
Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
The above verse is a clear refutation for those who contend that "good works" is what will save us.
Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Not everyone we visit in prison is a child of God nor should should they be considered "one of His".
Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
The above verse is a clear refutation for those who contend that "good works" is what will save us.
Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Not everyone we visit in prison is a child of God nor should should they be considered "one of His".
D
DivineNames
Guest
bibleberean said:
So Christ isn't concerned that everyone should be helped...
B
bibleberean
Guest
No one I am aware of posted anything like that...
Preaching the gospel to the lost and helping people in need is a good thing.
The point is not everyone we visit or help is a child of God.
Those who are not saved are "not one of His".
Matthew 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Matthew 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
S
Soma-Sight
Guest
Hey great posts DivineNames and Orthodox!
You guys obviously have a background in philosophy!
The eastern collective "Christlike" approach to spiritualulity versus the Western individualized "selfish" approach to spirituality.....
An intersting contradiction....
You guys obviously have a background in philosophy!
The eastern collective "Christlike" approach to spiritualulity versus the Western individualized "selfish" approach to spirituality.....
An intersting contradiction....
B
bibleberean
Guest
Soma
To the pit with Philosophy.
The issue in a Christian forum is "what does the bible say".
The philosophy of the Hindus is at odds with the bible and so is yours.
Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
All of your arguments that Hindus are saved through their own "good works" are refuted by the bible.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Christians are saved by Christ for good works.
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Hindus are saved by doing good works and escaping rebirth.
Chapter 8, Verse 15.
After attaining Me, the great souls, who are yogis in devotion, never return to this temporary world, which is full of miseries, because they have attained the highest perfection.
Chapter 8, Verse 16.
From the highest planet in the material world down to the lowest, all are places of misery wherein repeated birth and death take place. But one who attains to My abode, O son of Kunti, never takes birth again.
The false god of hinduism is at odds with our Great God and Saviour Jesus Christ.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
To the pit with Philosophy.
The issue in a Christian forum is "what does the bible say".
The philosophy of the Hindus is at odds with the bible and so is yours.
Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
All of your arguments that Hindus are saved through their own "good works" are refuted by the bible.
Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Christians are saved by Christ for good works.
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Hindus are saved by doing good works and escaping rebirth.
Chapter 8, Verse 15.
After attaining Me, the great souls, who are yogis in devotion, never return to this temporary world, which is full of miseries, because they have attained the highest perfection.
Chapter 8, Verse 16.
From the highest planet in the material world down to the lowest, all are places of misery wherein repeated birth and death take place. But one who attains to My abode, O son of Kunti, never takes birth again.
The false god of hinduism is at odds with our Great God and Saviour Jesus Christ.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
S
Soma-Sight
Guest
I guess you are right BB!
You must mean I am saved by THESE good works of Christ or is it different ones?
I will hand you over to ravaging men, artisans of destruction. You shall be fuel for the fire, your blood shall flow throughout the land. You shall not be remembered, for I, the LORD, have spoken. (Ezekiel 21:33-37 NAB)
B
bibleberean
Guest
Soma-Sight said:
You flip from one belief system to another. You don't even know the context of the verse in Ezekiel or what it means. You are one confused individual Soma.
That verse is about punishment for evil. Even man punishes criminals. It has nothing to do with good works for the saved. :roll:
O
Orthodox Christian
Guest
This is ignorance personified.bibleberean said:
See if you recognize this quote:
"In Him we live and move and have our being."
Yes, Paul said it, but he was quoting a Greek philosopher.
As did the Fathers of the Church.
Philosophy means "love of knowledge."
Some prefer ignorance.
The issue for Christians everywhere is "what does Christ say" and "what is Christ saying." The bible seems to say different things according to different people. Christ is not so divided.Bibleberean said:
Is that an ex Cathedra statement?Bibleberean said:
Finish the quote so as to not butcher its implication:
The argument is not against philosophy, but rather against philosophy that denies Christ is Divine.
D
DivineNames
Guest
Gary said:
Gita 11:53-54 (53) Not by the Vedas, or an austere life, or gifts to the poor, or ritual offerings can I be seen as thou hast seen me. (54) Only by love can men see me, and know me, and come unto me.
Gita 18:55 By love he knows me in truth, who I am and what I am. And when he knows me in truth he enters into my Being.
compare with-
1 Corinthians 13:3 If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing. (NIV)
1 John 4:8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. (NIV)
Gita 9:27 Whatever you do, or eat, or give, or offer in adoration, let it be an offering to me; and whatever you suffer, suffer it for me.
compare with-
1 Corinthians 10:31 So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God. (NIV)
Something that we do not find in the Bible:
Gita 4:11 In any way that men love me, in that same way they find my love: for many are the paths of men, but they all in the end come to me.
Gita 9:23 Even those who in faith worship other gods, because of their love they worship me, although not in the right way.
So even worshipping the "God of the Bible" may be acceptable...
(Bhagavad Gita translation: Juan Mascaro)
B
bibleberean
Guest
But worshipping the god of reincarnation and another way of salvation is not acceptable.
It is not what truth that the Bible and the Gita have in common that separate the saved from the unsaved but the differences.
The bible and the Gita have huge differences.
The bible points to Jesus and life the Gita points to death and destruction while claiming it points to life.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Matthew 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
It is not what truth that the Bible and the Gita have in common that separate the saved from the unsaved but the differences.
The bible and the Gita have huge differences.
The bible points to Jesus and life the Gita points to death and destruction while claiming it points to life.
Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Matthew 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
To post messages that only instigate a leaning toward universalism is no different than what Pope John Paul did with religious leaders. Beware! The Catholics have adopted the Eastern religions into their "recreational" practices. I have seen this with my own eyes! In several of the Catholic community centers you will find Yoga classes, and many eastern type classes of meditation listed as weekend retreats and evening classes during the week. ALL IN THE NAME OF RECREATION! Many people gather within the walls of their community centers and sit and meditate on the teachings of the eastern religions. They say it is okay as long as they don't worship the gods of these religions, but then they go and meditate on emptying the mind, so they can concentrating on nothingness, bliss, nirvana and all sorts of other strange and senseless means of meditations! They are in effect! Ignoring the teachings of Jesus and thinking on other religious mind sets! And they think nothing of it!
Well, If concentrating on the nothing (which is really impossible to do. duh! :roll: ) is what they think is the proper way to grow closer to God, then they are truly going off the straight path and onto a crooked one that leads them astray! Hinduism and other eastern religions have so many gods, it's almost impossible to count them all in the course of one hour! Hindu's respect and give honor to cows and rats more than they do people! They say to worship false gods! Just because they have some behavioral etiquette correct, doesn't mean they are leading people in the right path towards knowing the ONE and ONLY TRUTH OF JHVH GOD.
Where are you guys coming from? Just because the Hindus say something profound you think they are okay in their philosophies? :o
2 Corinthians 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
The trickery of the devil is very Attractive, isn't it, guys! :-?
Even the Catholic Church now embraces the trickery, diversions of the Eastern Religions! IS YOUR CHURCH NEXT? Or are you going to just do it on your own, without being a part of any so called organized religion? Regardless! It is still the embracing of other religions! Thou shalt not have any gods before me! The first commandment is clearly being broken by the Catholic chruch and those who adhere to the practices of other religions that only lead one away from truth by means of trickery! presenting truth while all along it leads you astray! [/b]
Sad, so sad indeed!
Beware the wolves in sheeps clothing!
.
Well, If concentrating on the nothing (which is really impossible to do. duh! :roll: ) is what they think is the proper way to grow closer to God, then they are truly going off the straight path and onto a crooked one that leads them astray! Hinduism and other eastern religions have so many gods, it's almost impossible to count them all in the course of one hour! Hindu's respect and give honor to cows and rats more than they do people! They say to worship false gods! Just because they have some behavioral etiquette correct, doesn't mean they are leading people in the right path towards knowing the ONE and ONLY TRUTH OF JHVH GOD.
Where are you guys coming from? Just because the Hindus say something profound you think they are okay in their philosophies? :o
2 Corinthians 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
The trickery of the devil is very Attractive, isn't it, guys! :-?
Even the Catholic Church now embraces the trickery, diversions of the Eastern Religions! IS YOUR CHURCH NEXT? Or are you going to just do it on your own, without being a part of any so called organized religion? Regardless! It is still the embracing of other religions! Thou shalt not have any gods before me! The first commandment is clearly being broken by the Catholic chruch and those who adhere to the practices of other religions that only lead one away from truth by means of trickery! presenting truth while all along it leads you astray! [/b]
Sad, so sad indeed!
Beware the wolves in sheeps clothing!
.