It isn't Islamophobia when they really are trying to kill you!

[Milk-Drops]

How many have they killed ? stats and frequencies please ? real not projected please, illegal to be a Homosexual ? and you equate this with suicide bombings and beheadings ? please provide evidence that Homosexuals have suffered either.

I'm still waiting for you to show me some evidence. Show me yours first, because its polite for the asked to show their evidence first. I have plenty I can show ya, I'm just waiting to see what you have before spinning this thread off into several different direction.

Can you quote me where I said that all Muslims are bad ? you protested earlier about me putting words in your mouth...based on that I can just as easily say that you are saying all Muslims are good.

One of my first comments and questions was about your view on Islam. You skipped over it and immediately started the strawman game. I assumed that by blowing by clarification, that my assumption was correct. Also considering you haven't named anything specific. When I mention specifics, you blow by it. So, I feel justified in my accusation. Do you want to clear it up or correct me?

The words are yours,who is contorting...you are willing to excuse Muslim behavior and have made it obvious.

No, I never did. What you are doing is called projection. I asked you to back your claims, and you went into blame shifting and straw manning. Dude, just clarify your own position.

Where is your evidence

Why should I supply evidence when its been shown that when I try, you'll ignore it and never show evidence to your stance. To only call people ignorant when they want clarification or point out faulty reasoning.

 

[turnorburn]

Ah meatballsub they "Muslims" Are inherently bad All of them to say otherwise is to call God a liar. Take it one step further we are All inherently bad All of us right down to the very last one. Proof you say you want proof? O.k.

Romans 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

3:13 Their throat is an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips:

3:14 Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness:

3:15 Their feet are swift to shed blood:

3:16 Destruction and misery are in their ways:

3:17 And the way of peace have they not known:

3:18 There is no fear of God before their eyes.

tob

http://bibledatabase.net/html/kjv/romans_3.html

 

[By Grace]

Originally Posted by By Grace Do you understand that because statistics is a mathematical science, it can be used to demonstrate many things irrefutably?

Yes I understand,but radical Muslim violence is in the headlines almost everyday...how could statistics be used to say it is a rare event ? who would believe it other than a Muslim or one sympathetic to their cause ?

You missed the context of my comment, therefore you came to the wrong conclusion.

I mentioned doing a chi square analysis to a person who knows statistics. The test gives the normal distribution for something, and in this case, an act of terrorism being perpetrated by Methodists, Mormons, Mennonites and Muslims as an example, all things being equal. If there were an equal chance for each group committing an act of terror, then a range of 7% or so on either side of 25% would create no significant differences between the Methodists and the Mennonites; they would be committing acts of terror at the same rate as the other. Now if there were acts of terror committed by Mormons at 40% and the Muslims doing 10% there is a big difference, and it is possible to extrapolate from that the Mormons were indeed a terrorist organization.

If you ask about something that you are unsure about, you appear smart because that demonstrates that you want to learn.

 

[Kaliani]

Do you really think, Kallani, that Muslims have a clue as to how "Islam clearly isn't in THEIR OWN best interests"?

Saif Rahman is a gentleman who might interest you. A former/cultural Muslim.

What's a cultural Muslim?

He's describing the Muslims I myself know. The kind who can tag along to Sunday morning service.

 

[Mountain Man]

Originally Posted by By Grace Do you understand that because statistics is a mathematical science, it can be used to demonstrate many things irrefutably?

Yes I understand,but radical Muslim violence is in the headlines almost everyday...how could statistics be used to say it is a rare event ? who would believe it other than a Muslim or one sympathetic to their cause ?

You missed the context of my comment, therefore you came to the wrong conclusion.

I mentioned doing a chi square analysis to a person who knows statistics. The test gives the normal distribution for something, and in this case, an act of terrorism being perpetrated by Methodists, Mormons, Mennonites and Muslims as an example, all things being equal. If there were an equal chance for each group committing an act of terror, then a range of 7% or so on either side of 25% would create no significant differences between the Methodists and the Mennonites; they would be committing acts of terror at the same rate as the other. Now if there were acts of terror committed by Mormons at 40% and the Muslims doing 10% there is a big difference, and it is possible to extrapolate from that the Mormons were indeed a terrorist organization.

If you ask about something that you are unsure about, you appear smart because that demonstrates that you want to learn.

Figures don't lie but liars sure do figure and please spare me the condescension.....i am well aware that people can twist and spin anything and have no interests in the....."science" of deception.

 

[Potluck]

Man, I don't know. I've seen things come up that weren't even on the radar, a little more talk about it, news increases and whatever it is takes root and grows. Same thing is happening with this topic. It's not going to go away, it's going to grow. Years are years and don't kid yourself they are short.
Doesn't matter what opinions are. We will be confronted with radical Islam more and more. It's not just going to go away.
Right now it seems tame, benign... over here across the water. As unsavory as it may seem at the present we will fight them for our survival. Might not be this generation but the next.
Sharia law is tolerated in some of the free-world already. What is tolerated in a present generation will be embraced in the next. All one needs do is look back at anything to do with social behavior to see that.

 

[Destructus86]

The dishonesty in this thread is rampant. Don't play coy, this thread is calling Muslims evil and using the acts of extremists as the reason to disdain all Muslims. Its common sense to point out that not all Muslims are the same and requesting people to back up their positions should be expected.

Im refuting the use of the word "extremist" as a term used as a one size fits all for the sake of defending a radicalized portion of Islam.

When doing so it appears to send people on their own witch hunt to find any and all dirt against Christianity to make that faith look as bad as the other.

And the Crusades was a struggle against Islamic aggression in the first place yet today its made out to be that Christians were on some kind of killing rampage.

And that in itself is another point. Maybe extreme Islam needs to come out of the past, out of the Dark Ages, when that sort of thing was common.

There's been at least 21,000 deadly attacks on innocent people, Christians, Muslims, Catholics, Hispanics, Blacks, Whites, children, gays, the educated, the ignorant, the weathy and the poor since 9/11/2001 all concieved and carried out on ANYONE that doesn't bend to their beliefs.

Now, if the peaceful Muslim would stop hiding behind victimization and actually rise up together and do something then maybe we'd have a chance to really join in unity against this threat. As it is though people are so blinded by their own bigotry to see the true nature of the slaughter thats occurring around them to be able to even entertain the thought of differing beliefs joining together to stop world terrorism.

Muslims are not hiding behind victimization. They are trying to mind their own business and live their life....but it's hard to do when people like you victimize completely innocent people in the name of God.

 

[Potluck]

Muslims are not hiding behind victimization. They are trying to mind their own business and live their life....but it's hard to do when people like you victimize completely innocent people in the name of God.

The people hit with the ball bearings and metal shards when the bomb exploded in Boston were "... trying to mind their own business and live their life." Too. What about them? Why does Muslim victimization get more press than they got? People were maimed and killed among them children.
But I'm being offensive to state it's the duty of the peaceful muslim to raise their voices in unison against those perpretrating these atrocities? If it not theirs then who's it?!?! They MUST protect their belief and help keep people safe from the radicalization of their religion. If they dont then how can anyone else who is NOT of their faith turn these murderers from a belief founded in the peaceful muslim's religion? How can they possibly attain credibility by doing nothing?

Who's duty is it D86? If not theirs then who's?

 

[By Grace]

Figures don't lie but liars sure do figure and please spare me the condescension.

No condescension meant. Not too many people have taken a course or two in statistics, and it is a fascinating study.

am well aware that people can twist and spin anything

Technically that is called skewing. Many people who took those courses in college or grad school know the difference between good statistics and bad statistics, but there are many others who cannot do that. That does not make those people ignorant or dumb. Properly, they are called "uninformed about statistics".

science" of deception

That is hardly the case.

From Wikipedia:
Statistics is the study of the collection, organization, analysis, interpretation and presentation of data. It deals with all aspects of data, including the planning of data collection in terms of the design of surveys and experiments.

If it were not for statistics there would be no pharmaceutical companies, nor practice of medicine nor counseling. That is because treatment plans and medication dosages are based on scientific studies based on statistics, which determine the best. units to be delivered, and the optimal effect that these medications have on humans over a certain time.

At this point, I am not going to teach you about statistics. My reason for the last several posts on statistics is simply informative. I was hoping that by informing you of what statistics can and cannot do, you would less likely to make statements as you have made on statistics in the future. You need to know that despite the common belief that 95% or more of the acts of terror that happen in the world are done by Muslims, it REMAINS possible that by doing the proper analysis, it would be possible to nail the facts with statistics.

END OF DERAIL

 

[tessiewebb]

Might have to change the Header of this thread a bit, to read "..kill you or at least run you out of the neighborhood". I've said in another post that Muslims use passive-aggressive tactics as well as violent ones. Their rapid rate of mosque building is nearly the equivalent of drug dealers moving into your area in that property values go down quickly and people move from neighborhoods rather quickly after one of the mosques is built there. It certainly seems purposeful in that Britons report Muslim attendees cars being parked in private driveways, on private property and some less discreet harassment tactics, such as defacing other people's property, all of it achieving the end that Islam gains more of England's living space. For what England is doing about this see: http://lawandfreedomfoundation.org/

Naperville Sun The DuPage County (IL) Board has reached a $445,000 settlement with the Irshad Learning Center, effectively settling the dispute with the group seeking a permit for an Islamic center on 75th Street just east of the Naperville city limits.
The groups sued, charging that the board’s ruling violated its rights under the First and 14th amendments. Federal Dhimmi Judge and Clinton appointee, Rebecca Pallmeyer of the Northern District of Illinois, ruled March 29 that the board had improperly denied the group’s request for the permit....

Sitkiewitz and her husband, whose home sits directly next to the ICWS property, were among many neighbors who voiced opposition during the public comment portion of the county board meeting. Many said that the proposed use, which would allow up to 166 people to visit each day, would overwhelm its septic capacity. They also said that plans to pave over portions of the property for a parking lot would result in stormwater flooding, and that traffic on the already-busy Army Trail Road would become more dangerous.

http://www.barenakedislam.com/2013/...will-negatively-affect-their-property-values/


http://www.barenakedislam.com/2011/...upage-county-rejects-proposed-islamic-center/



From another post: Neighbors long had objected to plans for the center, citing concerns about parking and late-night services. But supporters of the center have said religious bias is behind the objections

 

[Mountain Man]

Technically that is called skewing. Many people who took those courses in college or grad school know the difference between good statistics and bad statistics, but there are many others who cannot do that. That does not make those people ignorant or dumb. Properly, they are called "uninformed about statistics".

The confusion of the good that can be done with something and the bad that can be done with it is common,statistics are an educated guess,do you realy think that you can find out what 100 people think about something by asking 10 of them ?

If it were not for statistics there would be no pharmaceutical companies, nor practice of medicine nor counseling. That is because treatment plans and medication dosages are based on scientific studies based on statistics, which determine the best. units to be delivered, and the optimal effect that these medications have on humans over a certain time.

Statistics in this case are good,i never said that all statistics are bad but within the context of Muslim violence I cannot accept that Muslims are no more violent than any other religion based on statistics....can you ?

 

[Potluck]

21,000 attacks by Islamic terrorists have been documented since 9/11/01

My question is will those statistics be accepted or will they be ignored/refuted for the sake of the image of Islam?

 

[jasoncran]

Might have to change the Header of this thread a bit, to read "..kill you or at least run you out of the neighborhood". I've said in another post that Muslims use passive-aggressive tactics as well as violent ones. Their rapid rate of mosque building is nearly the equivalent of drug dealers moving into your area in that property values go down quickly and people move from neighborhoods rather quickly after one of the mosques is built there. It certainly seems purposeful in that Britons report Muslim attendees cars being parked in private driveways, on private property and some less discreet harassment tactics, such as defacing other people's property, all of it achieving the end that Islam gains more of England's living space. For what England is doing about this see: http://lawandfreedomfoundation.org/

Naperville Sun The DuPage County (IL) Board has reached a $445,000 settlement with the Irshad Learning Center, effectively settling the dispute with the group seeking a permit for an Islamic center on 75th Street just east of the Naperville city limits.
The groups sued, charging that the board’s ruling violated its rights under the First and 14th amendments. Federal Dhimmi Judge and Clinton appointee, Rebecca Pallmeyer of the Northern District of Illinois, ruled March 29 that the board had improperly denied the group’s request for the permit....

Sitkiewitz and her husband, whose home sits directly next to the ICWS property, were among many neighbors who voiced opposition during the public comment portion of the county board meeting. Many said that the proposed use, which would allow up to 166 people to visit each day, would overwhelm its septic capacity. They also said that plans to pave over portions of the property for a parking lot would result in stormwater flooding, and that traffic on the already-busy Army Trail Road would become more dangerous.

http://www.barenakedislam.com/2013/...will-negatively-affect-their-property-values/


http://www.barenakedislam.com/2011/...upage-county-rejects-proposed-islamic-center/



From another post: Neighbors long had objected to plans for the center, citing concerns about parking and late-night services. But supporters of the center have said religious bias is behind the objections

that protest has nothing to do with religious objections.

 

[By Grace]

Statistics in this case are good,i never said that all statistics are bad but within the context of Muslim violence I cannot accept that Muslims are no more violent than any other religion based on statistics....can you ?

I never posted that, nor did I insinuate that. Therefore it is mot relevant to what I stated, nor relevant to the context. perhaps you may need to read what I posted again especially about the 4 M religions.

 

[By Grace]

21,000 attacks by Islamic terrorists have been documented since 9/11/01 My question is will those statistics be accepted or will they be ignored/refuted for the sake of the image of Islam?

That has been ignored so far, so your you answered your own question, friend.

 

[Potluck]

That has been ignored so far, so your you answered your own question, friend.

Then statistics don't matter and neither do facts.
There isn't much evidence left. Nothing tangible, nothing real and nothing substantial.
That leaves ignorance, lack of information and and political hype on which to base an opinion.
I don't call that an intelligent method. But then ignorance and propaganda are the tools of the aggression. And ignorance and misinformation are so much easier to spread than informed thought.

 

[Mountain Man]

Islam has advanced in America because christianity has retreated, Muslims have strict rules with no compromise that unites people while Christianity has been made to be all things to all people with no absolutes or unity based on them.....the cultural defeat is of no surprise and unavoidable.

 

[Potluck]

Islam has advanced in America because christianity has retreated, Muslims have strict rules with no compromise that unites people while Christianity has been made to be all things to all people with no absolutes or unity based on them.....the cultural defeat is of no surprise and unavoidable.

Well, if the peaceful Muslim won't defend his/her own religion from being distorted for the works of evil and the Christian is accused of victimizing the peaceful Muslim for doing something they should be doing but aren't then I'm afraid the only thing left to the detractors of the Christian effort is tolerance of Sharia law. At first anyway. After that it's either fight them or join them because I don't see much tolerance from the other side. Quite the opposite really. Tolerate everything but opposition. All else is live and let live as long as living is within certain parameters of course.

 

[By Grace]

Then statistics don't matter and neither do facts.

I do not know where the tally of 21,000 attacks comes from, but I don't doubt that. It is also my opinion that 95% of them were done by Muslims, but my opinion is not the same as facts. Therein lies the rub, and the reliance on statistics. With the proper usage of statistics, it can be a very compelling case for the EXPONENTIAL increase of terror ny Muslims, and the silence of the "good Muslims" who condone that sort of thing because they refuse to condemn it.

There isn't much evidence left. Nothing tangible, nothing real and nothing substantial.

HUH??

That leaves ignorance, lack of information and and political hype on which to base an opinion.

If statistics are NOT used, that is what happens. No one can argue with properly done statistics.

And ignorance and misinformation are so much easier to spread than informed thought.

Please read this post in its entirety: HERE

 

[Potluck]

There isn't much evidence left. Nothing tangible, nothing real and nothing substantial.

HUH??

If no facts then what's left?
Not much