Justification vs Self Righteousness

[savedbygrace57]

the curse

Romans 5 is a pretty good explanation of permanently being made the righteousness of God, thereby being cast in the form of righteousness forever

So how does Rom 5 teach that one is made permanently Righteous ?

 

[Jesse Stone]

jeff77 #20

Sorry. Didn't mean to suggest you were interpreting anything. More of a general statement against a common practice. I was agreeing with what you said, adding my own two cents worth.

 

[JCitoL]

the biblical term "righteousness" means abundant and everlasting life for all humans, while the "unrighteousness" is when someone suffers or dies somewhere

Blessings

 

[jeff77]

jeff77 #20

Sorry. Didn't mean to suggest you were interpreting anything. More of a general statement against a common practice. I was agreeing with what you said, adding my own two cents worth.

I see that now. Sorry I misunderstood you.

 

[Jesse Stone]

jeff77 #20

Sorry. Didn't mean to suggest you were interpreting anything. More of a general statement against a common practice. I was agreeing with what you said, adding my own two cents worth.

Okaay. Now I'm at a loss. My post #21 doesn't show up on my computer. It skips from 20 to 22. Weird. Thus this response posted again. I thought it didn't take. Yet it shows up on your computer since you responded to it. Something isn't working right.

Tried it again and it comes out as something else altogether. Wow! Any way, all's well that ends well.

 

[WIP]

It has not been removed. I can see it just fine. Just thought you should know.

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

the curse



So how does Rom 5 teach that one is made permanently Righteous ?

Fantastic question my brother/sister; here is the answer:
Romans 5 Verses 10-11 : "For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement."
Notice the usage of the terms "being reconcilED" (past tense) and "have NOW receivED" (present and past tense). These show that we are NOW ALREADY justified in God's sight.
Moving forward, you have verses 12-19: "12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
17 For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

If you look at verse 12 it says that sin entered into the world by one man, not when YOU (or anyone else) sinned, and that one man was Adam. So sin in the world is Adam's fault, not yours. And death came by sin, and death passed upon all men because all sinned (because they were all made sinners by Adam's one sin). So through Adam's one sin, all (which is what really the old English 'many' means) mankind was dead. BUT, through one man, Jesus the Anointed One, the free gift of justification came unto all mankind. (verse 15-16).
Verse 18 - so by Adam's one sin, all men (we are all man, there is a female man and a male man, all are mankind, or man) were condemned (in a prison of sin), BUT by Jesus' one act of righteousness the free gift of justification (or righteousness) came upon all men.

So these are all things spoken of in the past tense. Look also at 2 Cor 5:19-21 and you see that everything old in you has passed away (past tense), and ALL things have become new in you AND ALL things are of God. Is sin of God? No, ALL BELIEVERS ARE THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD.
See also Isaiah 54:17 - what righteousness do we have? GOD'S OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS. Therefore, it is not of you, it is of Him, and since you didn't earn it, it was a free gift, you can't do anything to lose it either, otherwise it would have been earned.
Did ANYONE (besides Jesus) have the Holy Spirit IN him/her before the resurrection when Jesus breathed on the disciples and they were reborn with the Holy Spirit inside them (John)? NO.
When did we get the Holy Spirit LIVING inside of us, we being HIS temple? At the new birth, when we became righteous!
God doesn't live anywhere that is not holy. YOU, all Believers, are HOLY.
KABOOM! Someone just shouted the roof off their house because they never knew this!
You never confess your sins to God the Father because He has already paid for and cancelled them all out by Jesus' blood, which was an overpayment for our sins. You receive forgiveness (which has already been done) and your cleansing (which again has already been done). You're already, always forgiven. You are righteous NOW.

1 John 4:17 "As He is, so are WE in THIS WORLD." Is Jesus righteous? Then so are you. Otherwise God would be a liar because He could not otherwise say this statement. Same with rich, healed, delivered, victorious in all things, strong of spirit, strong of mind, strong of body, prosperous, etc....

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

the biblical term "righteousness" means abundant and everlasting life for all humans, while the "unrighteousness" is when someone suffers or dies somewhere

Blessings

Actually the literal translation of righteousness is "right standing" or you can also use it to describe something that works/runs/operates as it should, as in a 'righteous machine', or a 'righteous man'

 

[savedbygrace57]

the curse

BUT, through one man, Jesus the Anointed One, the free gift of justification came unto all mankind. (verse 15-16).

Do all men without exception have Justification of Life through the One Man, Jesus the anointed ?

What about those whom it is written that they shall not see Life here Jn 3:36

36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

Hi savedbygrace57,

Yes, those verses say that justification came unto mankind. It doesn't all mankind was justified - they have to believe in Jesus; specifically Romans 10:9-10, because they must believe that Jesus is Himself the Lord God and that God (the Father) raised Him from the dead. Why raised Him from the dead? Why doesn't it say you believe His sacrifice for your sin? Because in believing that Jesus was raised from the dead on the 3rd day means that God the Father accepted His sacrifice for our sins and they were all wiped out.
So God is not holding man's sins against him, because Jesus already paid the punishment for ALL of them, but they must believe and receive it.
I could give you a car, and it's yours, but unless you believe me and receive what I have done for you, that car will never be utilized by you, even though it was yours the whole time. It's a good example.

Salvation has been completed, like a radio broadcast, and it has been broadcast to all mankind, but only those who use their antenna (faith) can receive the signal of salvation and obtain it. That's why it's been done UNTO all mankind, but only those who BELIEVE shall have it. The wrath of God remains on all others who persist in unbelief.
But as for YOU, and me, and all other Believers, we are saved now, forever and are righteous forever.

 

[agua.]

Yes, I can see how we are justified by faith as well as works but what I understand is that the works are performed by God through us and we don't take credit for the works.

Well said !

The false prophets in Jesus' day had selfish good works without obedient faith.

Mat 7:21-23 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. (22) Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?' (23) Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

 

[JCitoL]

Actually the literal translation of righteousness is "right standing" or you can also use it to describe something that works/runs/operates as it should, as in a 'righteous machine', or a 'righteous man'

and what is right?!, can the evil be right after no human would rather suffer from unpleasant/insufferable affliction(s)?!, or is it right that the suffering/dying be neglected to suffer/die?!

Matthew 7:12 "all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.",

Luke 6:5-11 "And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath. And it came to pass also on another sabbath, that he entered into the synagogue and taught: and there was a man whose right hand was withered. And the scribes and Pharisees watched him, whether he would heal on the sabbath day; that they might find an accusation against him. But he knew their thoughts, and said to the man which had the withered hand, Rise up, and stand forth in the midst. And he arose and stood forth. Then said Jesus unto them, I will ask you one thing; Is it lawful on the sabbath days to do good, or to do evil? to save life, or to destroy it? And looking round about upon them all, he said unto the man, Stretch forth thy hand. And he did so: and his hand was restored whole as the other. And they were filled with madness; and communed one with another what they might do to Jesus.",

Luke 9:51-56 "And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he stedfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem, And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him. And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem. And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.",

1 John 2:6 "He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.",

Luke 6:31-36 "as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise. For if ye love them which love you, what thank have ye? for sinners also love those that love them. And if ye do good to them which do good to you, what thank have ye? for sinners also do even the same. And if ye lend to them of whom ye hope to receive, what thank have ye? for sinners also lend to sinners, to receive as much again. But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil. Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful."

Blessings

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

Hi JCitoL, I honestly have no idea what you are asking, could you please clarify what you are saying?
The only thing I picked up was you asking "what is right?" To that I will say what is right, with respect to having right standing with God, is to be righteous. You are righteous when you are saved, because you have been translated out of the state of sin and into the state of righteousness, all through trusting Jesus to be your sacrifice for sin.

 

[JCitoL]

Hi JCitoL, I honestly have no idea what you are asking, could you please clarify what you are saying?
The only thing I picked up was you asking "what is right?" To that I will say what is right, with respect to having right standing with God, is to be righteous. You are righteous when you are saved, because you have been translated out of the state of sin and into the state of righteousness, all through trusting Jesus to be your sacrifice for sin.

and what is the biblical term/concept "righteousness"?!, is it possible that the "righteousness" consist in the infliction of evil on the humans?!, or did Jesus Christ cause evil to the people?!

Blessings

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

Hi JCitoL,
The biblical term righteousness means right standing with God; it means you are right with God, there is nothing between you, because Jesus' blood has made you righteous.
It is not possible that righteousness means evil inflicted on mankind or by mankind; that would be called "evil". Your question is like asking is it possible that sunlight is not really light but it's actually darkness...of course not - if it were darkness you could not see, because there is light, you can see.
The Holy Bible says that Jesus did not come to condemn the world, but to save it, because God SO loved the world. (read John chapter 3).

 

[JCitoL]

isn't there some shown purpose of God after all?!, for example, what was/is the mission of Jesus and His disciples?!, why had/has God the Father made Them to work as His servants?!, what was/is their work as spiritual workers?!

John 3:17 "God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.",

John 12:49-50 "I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.",

Matthew 18:11-13 "the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray.",

John 15:16-17 "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you. These things I command you, that ye love one another.",

1 Corinthians 10:24-33 "Let no man seek his own, but every man another's wealth..... Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God: Even as I please all men in all things(i.e. in all good things), not seeking mine own profit, but the profit of many(i.e. of the others), that they may be saved.",

Romans 15:1 "We then that are strong ought to bear the infirmities of the weak, and not to please ourselves."

Blessings

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

The mission of Jesus was to destroy the works of the Devil as we learn in 1 John. This includes saving the souls of all mankind, and giving them new life from above (so that their spirit is recreated is Jesus' exact image). On the cross, for us, in our place as our substitute, Jesus took all sin, poverty, lack, disease, suffering, pain, sickness, defeat, etc and by His stripes we were healed of all these things, and through His blood we have entered into the new Covenant by faith where God has given us The Blessing of Abraham (Gal 3:13-14, Gen 13:2, Gen 12:3, Gen 24:35) which is the Blessing of the Lord (Genesis 1:28, Proverbs 10:22).
The work of all those who believe in Jesus is to announce the Good News (the Gospel, which is the Blessing (see Hebrews 4 and Gal 3) to those who don't know Him yet, and to teach them how to follow Jesus just as the original disciples did (to make disciples of all nations).
And it is to occupy until He comes, which is on every level - to call the shots, to dictate policy, to make laws, to run the government, to be the salt and the light of the Earth, and to enforce the Devil's defeat.

 

[BigSodaExposer]

Mathew 5:20 "For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."

 

[TheCurseoftheRodain]

Mathew 5:20 "For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven."

What is this post about?
Also, I like your signature.

 

[veryberry]

The book of John is a great book to read on how to obtain eternal life.

John 20:31 - But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.