Lists of Apostate Preachers

[AKJVReader]

From all the information i have read about CS Lewis he was heretical in what he said at times. Did you read the previous posts that i have posted in this thread with the links? Do you want to believe CS Lewis is the best theologist of the last century. just because he is popular? Consider all the occult fantasy books that he wrote and how he inspired Harry Potter and other books about witchcraft. Or do you want to examine all the facts about him and make a proper judgment?

 

[jasoncran]

From all the information i have read about CS Lewis he was heretical in what he said at times. Did you read the previous posts that i have posted in this thread with the links? Do you want to believe CS Lewis is the best theologist of the last century. just because he is popular? Consider all the occult fantasy books that he wrote and how he inspired Harry Potter and other books about witchcraft. Or do you want to examine all the facts about him and make a proper judgment?

funny you push easter and i bet you celebrate christmas. i can reasonsably show you that those have pagan influence and or origins to them.

easter isnt what the lord commanded us to do, its communion and its do this as ye oft, meaning as much the church wants..everyday, once a year, or month.

i dont mind churches that do easter but technically the easter eggs is where the problem is.

 

[kiwimac]

From all the information i have read about CS Lewis he was heretical in what he said at times. Did you read the previous posts that i have posted in this thread with the links? Do you want to believe CS Lewis is the best theologist of the last century. just because he is popular? Consider all the occult fantasy books that he wrote and how he inspired Harry Potter and other books about witchcraft. Or do you want to examine all the facts about him and make a proper judgment?

I have read quite a number of C.S. Lewis' books, both the theological and the fictional. They are, mostly, excellent reading. I consider that the point you are making is both myopic & US-centric.

 

[reba]

a: evangelical or
b: American.

I find it very sad the so many folks do not want to 'touch' this subject. We ,us guys in the pew, are the ones who should be 'testing the spirits' etc. We should hold these guys accountable to the Word. Yet we don't... We tend to get lost in the showmanship, the glitz, the Hollywood of the 'big names'. As if they can do no wrong...

If Paul, Peter, James .... lived the lifestyle of these guys would they have any credibility? Scripture is twisted to accommodate the lavish way of life.. lavish at the expense of the the true Gospel.

The lack personal responsibility , multiple marriages, flies in the face of God's Word...

2Pe 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
2Pe 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

 

[theLords]

From all the information i have read about CS Lewis he was heretical in what he said at times. Did you read the previous posts that i have posted in this thread with the links? Do you want to believe CS Lewis is the best theologist of the last century. just because he is popular? Consider all the occult fantasy books that he wrote and how he inspired Harry Potter and other books about witchcraft. Or do you want to examine all the facts about him and make a proper judgment?

Jason has a fantastic point. You probably celebrate Easter and Christmas which have pagan origins, and yet you point the finger at Lewis as being occultist for writing Narnia? (Narnia, which by the way, is a fantasy novel for children that contains spiritual metaphors of Christ all throughout it)

Your links are deceptive misinformation. That has already been pointed out in this thread by Handy.

I thought I'd take a look at the PDF about Lewis...and right away I saw that this wasn't Lewis "in his own words" but rather a series of quotes of Lewis', lifted out of their contexts and then skewered by the authors, as well as a number of quotes of what others had to say about Lewis.

Since I've read many of Lewis' works, I'm familiar with some of the quotes that were listed. For instance this particular quote from the Screwtape Letters:

God "often makes prizes of humans who have given their lives for causes He thinks bad on the monstrously sophistical ground that the humans thought them good and were following the best they knew"....

The fuller context of the quote is WWII and how many in the war took up the "cause", these would be both English and German, Christians on both sides of the fence...we can compare this to those Christians who fought in the Civil War for both the North and the South...each side thought their "cause" was right...at least one side (if not both sometimes) can be wrong...and yet God will make "prizes" of them anyway because in their own mind they were not willfully sinning against Him, in their error they thought they were doing the "right" thing. God is not going to deny a believer eternal life just because he fought for Germany in WWII or the South in the Civil war....

There is also this quote that the PDF points out as Lewis' "false teaching"

"There are three things that spread the Christ-life to us: baptism, belief, and that mysterious action which different Christians call by different names -- Holy Communion, the Mass, the Lord's Supper" (From Mere Christianity)

The authors of the PDF point to this as "proof" that Lewis taught a "salvation by works".

But again, the fuller context of the quote is this:

Now the God who arranged that process is the same God who arranges how the new kind of life—the Christ life—is to be spread. We must be prepared for it being odd too. He did not consult us when He invented sex: He has not consulted us either when He invented this.

There are three things that spread the Christ life to us: baptism, belief, and that mysterious action which different Christians call by different names—Holy Communion, the Mass, the Lord's Supper. At least, those are the three ordinary methods. I am not saying there may not be special cases where it is spread without one or more of these. I have not time to go into special cases, and I do not know enough. If you are trying in a few minutes to tell a man how to get to Edinburgh you will tell him the trains: he can, it is true, get there by boat or by a plane, but you will hardly bring that in. And I am not saying anything about which of these three things is the most essential. My Methodist friend would like me to say more about belief and less (in proportion) about the other two. But I am not going into that. Anyone who professes to teach you Christian doctrine will, in fact, tell you to use all three, and that is enough for our present purpose. (Mere Christianity)

What Lewis is getting at in this passage of Mere Christianity is that the new life we have in Christ is "spread" or grows in us via belief, baptism and communion. These three things are what all Christians have in common and he is entirely correct in this. If I know of a believer who constantly refuses baptism or communion, I would question his "belief". If I know of someone who is baptised, and yet believes that Jesus is in no way God, then I would question the baptism...

Lewis goes on to say:

I cannot myself see why these things should be the conductors of the new kind of life. But then, if one did not happen to know, I should never have seen any connection between a particular physical pleasure and the appearance of a new human being in the world. We have to take reality as it comes to us: there is no good jabbering about what it ought to be like or what we should have expected it to be like. But though I cannot see why it should be so, I can tell you why I believe it is so. I have explained why I have to believe that Jesus was (and is) God. And it seems plain as a matter of history that He taught His followers that the new life was communicated in this way.

In other words, I believe it on His authority. (Mere Christianity)

Again, Lewis wasn't defining the "exact moment of salvation" or anything like it...he was explaining essentials of Christian life and growth...and baptism and communion are most definitely part of essential life and growth, every bit as much as belief is. Demons believe, they are not baptized nor take communion.

I was reading through the PDF further and was just so overwhelmed by the misquotes, the taking things out of context and the innuendos in it...then I got to the part about Lewis promoting pedophilia (yes, pedophilia, child sexual abuse) in the scenes in Narnia between Lucy and Mr. Tumnus.

That's when I stopped reading. There is only so much gossip and lies I'm willing to stomach about a fellow brother in Christ.

I took a look at the others on the "Wolf List" ...I believe some are false teachers, I believe some are solid biblical teachers. But I do believe that the true "wolf" here may very well be Stewart himself.

 

[handy]

From all the information i have read about CS Lewis he was heretical in what he said at times. Did you read the previous posts that i have posted in this thread with the links? Do you want to believe CS Lewis is the best theologist of the last century. just because he is popular? Consider all the occult fantasy books that he wrote and how he inspired Harry Potter and other books about witchcraft. Or do you want to examine all the facts about him and make a proper judgment?

AKJV, let me ask you this...have YOU truly "examined all the facts about him" to make a "proper judgment"? Or have you just read what others have had to say about him.

Have you read "Mere Christianity", the "Screwtape Letters", "Surprised by Joy" or any of the other books by Lewis, yourself? Have you examined for yourself, his works, in context?

If you haven't read through these books yourself, and are just relying upon what others have had to say...then you truly don't have the right to accuse Lewis of being an apostate preacher, a very serious accusation to hurl at someone.

I've said this many times at this site...and it's something I teach my kids as well...we are not "allowed" to bear false witness against someone just because that person is famous, or popular for that matter...false witness is false witness, even if it's said against George Bush, Barak Obama or C.S. Lewis.

 

[AKJVReader]

funny you push easter and i bet you celebrate christmas. i can reasonsably show you that those have pagan influence and or origins to them.
easter isnt what the lord commanded us to do, its communion and its do this as ye oft, meaning as much the church wants..everyday, once a year, or month.
i dont mind churches that do easter but technically the easter eggs is where the problem is.

lol!

I have never pushed for easter here and i DO NOT celebrate Christmas for many reasons even though my parents pushed it onto me i reject it!

even if it's said against George Bush, Barak Obama or C.S. Lewis.

you just got 3/3!

Have you read "Mere Christianity", the "Screwtape Letters", "Surprised by Joy" or any of the other books by Lewis, yourself? Have you examined for yourself, his works, in context?

I believe that God does not want me to read them and i have never been interested in any of CS Lewis's books, does writing a book about Christianity guarantee that that person is a Christian? What about CS Lewis's books about the occult? Why would Hollywood love CS Lewis if he was a Christian hero?

 

[kiwimac]

What books about the occult? Do you mean the Narnia series?

 

[Pizzaguy]

I believe that God does not want me to read them and i have never been interested in any of CS Lewis's books....

And to think, I have defended you here before. 2

You are parading around in what I call "Will-full and arrogant ignorance".

"The Screwtape Letters" was fiction, but I can't imagine a more realistic portrayal of one of Satan's higher 'generals' advising a lower demon on earth in the destruction of a man's witness and spiritual life. Lewis could WRITE like few I've ever read, and his apologetic works were stunning.

 

[handy]

Have you read "Mere Christianity", the "Screwtape Letters", "Surprised by Joy" or any of the other books by Lewis, yourself? Have you examined for yourself, his works, in context?

I believe that God does not want me to read them and i have never been interested in any of CS Lewis's books, does writing a book about Christianity guarantee that that person is a Christian? What about CS Lewis's books about the occult? Why would Hollywood love CS Lewis if he was a Christian hero?

You said, "Do you want to examine all the facts about him and make a proper judgment?" and yet you now admit that you haven't done so yourself?

Lewis has no books about the occult...he writes fantasy...if you don't like fantasy don't read them but don't mis-characterize them either. I doubt Hollywood has any love for CS Lewis...just the money that the films based upon his books might generate.

In what are truly Lewis' own words, rather than cut/paste hack jobs meant to discredit, which sums up the gospel as pithily as has ever been written outside the Bible itself:

Then comes the real shock. Among these Jews there suddenly turns up a man who goes about talking as if He was God. He claims to forgive sins. He says He has always existed. He says He is coming to judge the world at the end of time. Now let us get this clear. Among Pantheists, like the Indians, anyone might say that he was a part of God, or one with God: there would be nothing very odd about it. But this man, since He was a Jew, could not mean that kind of God. God, in their language, meant the Being outside the world Who had made it and was infinitely different from anything else. And when you have grasped that, you will see that what this man said was, quite simply, the most shocking thing that has ever been uttered by human lips.

One part of the claim tends to slip past us unnoticed because we have heard it so often that we no longer see what it amounts to. I mean the claim to forgive sins: any sins. Now unless the speaker is God, this is really so preposterous as to be comic. We can all understand how a man forgives offenses against himself. You tread on my toe and I forgive you, you steal my money and I forgive you. But what should we make of a man, himself unrobbed and untrodden on, who announced that he forgave you for treading on other men's toes and stealing other men's money? Asinine fatuity is the kindest description we should give of his conduct. Yet this is what Jesus did.

He told people that their sins were forgiven, and never waited to consult all the other people whom their sins had undoubtedly injured. He unhesitatingly behaved as if He was the party chiefly concerned, the person chiefly offended in all offences. This makes sense only if He really was the God whose laws are broken and whose love is wounded in every sin. In the mouth of any speaker who is not God, these words would imply what I can only regard as a silliness and conceit unrivalled by any other character in history.

Yet (and this is the strange, significant thing) even His enemies, when they read the Gospels, do not usually get the impression of silliness and conceit. Still less do unprejudiced readers. Christ says that He is "humble and meek" and we believe Him; not noticing that, if He were merely a man, humility and meekness are the very last characteristics we could attribute to some of His sayings.

I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: "I'm ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don't accept His claim to be God." That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic—on a level with the man who says he is a poached egg—or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God: or else a madman or something worse. You can shut Him up for a fool, you can spit at Him and kill Him as a demon; or you can fall at His feet and call Him Lord and God.

But let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to. (Mere Christianity)

And what is Lewis' own personal conclusion regarding the gospel?

We are faced, then, with a frightening alternative. This man we are talking about either was (and is) just what He said or else a lunatic, or something worse. Now it seems to me obvious that He was neither a lunatic nor a fiend: and consequently, however strange or terrifying or unlikely it may seem, I have to accept the view that He was and is God.

AKJV, I exhort you to at least read through Mere Christianity. You don't even need to buy it, there are PDF's availiable on line and most libraries have the book. After reading it through, if you then want to say that Lewis is an apostate preacher, and discuss which points of his you disagree with, fair enough...

However, if you are going to copy/paste what some have to say regarding Lewis, hear from those who have read his works that the copy/paste jobs were misleading and dishonest, then refuse to even try to see for yourself what the man's testimony and teachings are...then you have no credibility whatsoever.

 

[Pizzaguy]

However, if you are going to copy/paste what some have to say regarding Lewis, hear from those who have read his works that the copy/paste jobs were misleading and dishonest, then refuse to even try to see for yourself what the man's testimony and teachings are...then you have no credibility whatsoever.

And, AJKV, this from a man who insists he's going to get things right by ONLY reading ONE translation of the Bible? You work hard to make sure you have it right about God's word - why not make sure you have it right about C.S. Lewis?

Go read some of his stuff.

 

[tim-from-pa]

Regarding the OP list false teachers, there are some that think I am part of the (fill in the blank) _________ crowd because of my belief in lost tribes teaching. (Kept his name out so as I am not accused of preacher bashing and belittlement). However, his teaching seems to question more the authenticity of those claiming to be Jews and they believe in multiple man-lineage creations besides Adam, including the serpent seed doctrine. I don't embrace these doctrines and believe that all men came from Adam, specifically Noah since the flood was world wide.

I suppose I can live with that but the thing that really galls me about this false teacher is his denial of the obvious (as opposed to obscure) doctrines. He can't even keep a Jewish calendar correctly. He sits there with that smirk on his face and calls those who disagree with him "yo-yo's" and yet I doubt that he knows a synodic month from a draconic month in calendars and astronomy. He claims the ancient Israelites used only the sun and not the moon. Yet, King David very clearly made reference to the moon regarding the timing of the feasts. The word "month" has it etymology in the word "moon". Even clock hands have this 12:1 ratio in movement in case anyone wondered where that came from. I can't help but to think its an excuse to "change the times" so as not to celebrate Passover when the Jews do.

When someone gets something this straightforward blatantly and pridefully wrong, I say get away from them. It even sounds stupid. This man is a minute hand short of a true clock.

 

[theLords]

I believe that God does not want me to read them and i have never been interested in any of CS Lewis's books, does writing a book about Christianity guarantee that that person is a Christian?

If you have never read his books then you cannot give an honest opinion of them. The only opinion you can form is one that comes from another. Your source (Van Nattan) is biased (and crazy and quite possibly a racist) which hence force takes away all of your credibility.

What about CS Lewis's books about the occult? Why would Hollywood love CS Lewis if he was a Christian hero?

Um, here's one world for you my dear: money. Hollywood will do anything to make a buck. Did you get upset when the Passion of the Christ came out? Does Hollywood love Jesus Christ? Does Hollywood's production of the Gospel of Christ nullify God's purity?

Do you understand what the occult is? It's not mere "fantasy" or else all literature would be occultic. If you even bothered to read the book which you won't, you'd understand that the witch in the story is WICKED and portrayed as such. So in fact, the occult is CONDEMNED within the book. While Christ is glorified.

 

[theLords]

Okay, this thread went off topic so it was split into another thread. For all of you who were engaged in the discussion about OT feasts here is the link to the new thread: http://www.christianforums.net/f17/should-christians-observe-ot-feasts-35663/

or

http://www.christianforums. net/f17/should-christians-observe-ot-feasts-35663/ (remove the space before the . and net)

 

[jasoncran]

lol!

I have never pushed for easter here and i DO NOT celebrate Christmas for many reasons even though my parents pushed it onto me i reject it!



you just got 3/3!



I believe that God does not want me to read them and i have never been interested in any of CS Lewis's books, does writing a book about Christianity guarantee that that person is a Christian? What about CS Lewis's books about the occult? Why would Hollywood love CS Lewis if he was a Christian hero?

the akjv translate the word easter instead of passover? isnt that a thread?

easter by traditions from the apostles wasnt celebrated. but rather communion. that is the command. now then the date isnt right but to take a service and ponder the cross isnt a bad thing but add the eggs then we are going astray.

its not salvinical to do that but if one is going to call a christian into the occult, best come clean first.

 

[Stormcrow]

...and his apologetic works were stunning.

"Mere Christianity" is a classic. Many, many people I know came to Christ because of that one book.

One of my favorite quotes of all time from C.S. Lewis:

[FONT=arial,helvetica][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?

If the whole show was bad and senseless from A to Z, so to speak, why did I, who was supposed to be part of the show, find myself in such violent reaction against it?

A man feels wet when he falls into water, because man is not a water animal: a fish would not feel wet.

Of course, I could have given up my idea of justice by saying that it was nothing but a private idea of my own. But if I did that, then my argument against God collapsed too--for the argument depended on saying that the world was really unjust, not simply that it did not happen to please my private fancies.

Thus in the very act of trying to prove that God did not exist--in other words, that the whole of reality was senseless--I found I was forced to assume that one part of reality--namely my idea of justice--was full of sense. Consequently atheism turns out to be too simple. If the whole universe has no meaning, we should never have found out that it has no meaning: just as, if there were no light in the universe and therefore no creatures with eyes, we should never know it was dark. Dark would be without meaning.

--C.S. Lewis, "Mere Christianity"[/FONT][/FONT]

If that's "apostate thinking" may the whole church be corrupted by it.

 

[AKJVReader]

the akjv translate the word easter instead of passover? isnt that a thread?

Yes it does but that doesn't mean i celebrate it, i know that many KJV people do not celebrate Easter.

easter by traditions from the apostles wasnt celebrated. but rather communion. that is the command. now then the date isnt right but to take a service and ponder the cross isnt a bad thing but add the eggs then we are going astray.

I agree with you there

if one is going to call a christian into the occult, best come clean first.

Hey i'm telling you the truth that CS Lewis was into the occult. It's pretty obvious
that he was, just read his occultic fantasy books and what occultists have said. I'm definitely NOT into the occult so i can say i'm clean on that issue.

One of my favorite quotes of all time from C.S. Lewis:

That quote is CS Lewis and not from the Bible. If you look at CS Lewis's life weigh up all the facts before making a judgment. Like i say if CS Lewis was a real Christian why does Hollywood and many occultists love him? If he was a real Christian they would all hate him and ridicule him, but they never do. We live in very deceptive times, Jesus says do not be deceived and then He says do not be deceived.

 

[kiwimac]

How would you know if you have never read C.S. Lewis' books? Fantasy is not the same as the occult.

 

[Stormcrow]

That quote is CS Lewis and not from the Bible.

At the risk of offending some, the attitude expressed in the quote above is precisely why many moral, rational, decent people think the church is filled with ignorant, backwards, knuckle-dragging, Bible-thumpers.

I can't blame them. :bigfrown

And while I'm at it, I'd be willing to bet that the combined works of C.S. Lewis have helped lead millions of souls to Christ.

How many of your diatribes against Catholics and others - like these so-called "apostate preachers" have led even one person to Christ???

How can you bear true witness about works which you admit you've never read??? Did you even read the quote I posted from Mere Christianity? Or any others posted to you???

What does your KJV say about "bearing false witness"?????

Jesus spoke in parables. C.S. Lewis wrote using allegories. Here's an excellent article explaining how both are used in Lewis's work. (Don't worry, no actual quotes from Lewis in it, so your mind or soul won't be poisoned by them!)

http://www.thenarniaacademy.org/article_allegory.htm

Here's a snippet:

C. S. Lewis’ novels, The Chronicles of Narnia are often considered allegories, although C. S. Lewis himself did not intent [sic] them to be. Contained in each of the seven books are allegorical elements which represent many aspects of the Christian faith and religion.

'Nuf said!

 

[Jenann]

I checked out the lists....anything other than a quick glance is a waste of time as there is so much info involved that it would take away precious time from reaching the lost to thoroughly read it all.

I did notice a couple of televangelists on the list that are way off base and it saddens me to know they are dishing out loads of false doctrine. t You would also find them on a ministy watch list I found recently that exposed things like financial accountability red flags and instances in which they were being investigated.....wish I could remember the name of the site. Follow the money.

Just know your Savior, know your Bible, test the spirits, and find out who your unsaved or newly saved friends are watchng and expose false teaching in your circle of influence.