Natural Disasters

[Ruben]

Are disasters like hurricane Katrina and the tsunami of 12/26/04 punishments from God like the Flood and Sodom and Gomorrah?

 

[Heidi]

They have to be. God controls rainbows so He controls the weather.

 

[Ruben]

No one can escape the effects of sin in this world, the pain, suffering, and sorrows with death being the final chapter for everyone. If the wicked are then made to suffer in hell as well as suffer the effects of sin now, isn't this like 'double jeopardy'?

 

[Rick W]

It rains on the believer and the unbeliever alike.

 

[Ruben]

So what are you saying? Is God indifferent to human suffering? Or because the wicked and the righteous are intermingled that some of the innocent have to suffer along with the guilty?

 

[cubedbee]

Are disasters like hurricane Katrina and the tsunami of 12/26/04 punishments from God like the Flood and Sodom and Gomorrah?

No, they are not. Before the Flood, the whole Earth was evil and Noah was the only righteous man who found favor in God's eyes. Before Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed, the whole populations were evil, except for righteous Lot and his family. The common theme of these judgements from God is that God eradicated the wicked and spared the righteous.

Neither Katrina nor the tsunami did this. Neither completely wiped out the wicked, and neither spared the righteous. Both simply killed indiscriminately. God's judgement is just, not indiscriminate. These were natural disasters, nothing more, nothing less.

 

[Quath]

No, they are not. Before the Flood, the whole Earth was evil and Noah was the only righteous man who found favor in God's eyes. Before Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed, the whole populations were evil, except for righteous Lot and his family. The common theme of these judgements from God is that God eradicated the wicked and spared the righteous.

I agee with you that it looks random because it could have been much, much worse in New Orleans. The rich and middle class left moreso than the poorer class. So if this was God's wrath, it was directed more at the poor.

On the other hand, Genesis 8:21 said that after the flood that killed all the wicked people, God says of man "every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood." So people were still wicked (not sure what the flood was suppose to really accomplish then.) So by this story, God will destroy and let some wicked people flee.

In Sodom and Gomorrah, I am sure there were babies and children that were as innocent as you can find among people. God didn't spare them, so He killed the innocent with the guilty.

You can also look at the Exodus, where God kills the Egyptian first born whether they had slaves or not. The children killed and the people that lost a child were for the most part innocent of the crime they were punished for.

Quath

 

[Rick W]

So what are you saying? Is God indifferent to human suffering? Or because the wicked and the righteous are intermingled that some of the innocent have to suffer along with the guilty?

Christ never said His kingdom was of this earth. Even Satan tempted Him with earthly dominion of all the nations. The hope of the christian is for rest within the Kingdom of God, not protection from worldly woes.

 

[TheScarletPimpernel]

After the flood of Noah God made a covenant which was that He would not destroy the world again by a flood. I don't think that He is small minded about it, "oh well, I'll just flood one or two places and get my penny's worth out of it", He said that He would not thus faith requires of us to believe that He is not the author of it. Faith also requires us to "love our neighbour" and so help the victims of. In perspective faith is not asking much of us? Will the victims of the N.O. flood find refuge and support from others or will they become like social outcasts like the "okies" of the dust bowl? With no home or place of their own? Anyone eager to show thier faith will have ample opportunity!

I read that according to the news reports the hurricane was level 5 where the defences were built to withstand a level 3; so no-one expected the ferocity of the storm. The report I read said that Katrina was on course for a direct hit on New Orleans which would have caused a catastrophic failure of the flood defences but at the last minute turned aside from a bullseye hit. There was also plenty of advance warning so the losses are largely material although some did sadly lose thier lives it could have been a lot worse. It's hard to imagine a whole city being ruined to be sure and it's pretty obvious that natural disasters are getting more disasterous as time goes on, terrible times they are we are living in! It's all the more reason for us to cling to our faith and seek the help of God!

 

[PHIL121]

I don't see Katrina as a specific sign. I see it more as a warning.

God will not be mocked. And America has become rather arrogant now that capitalism has one the cold war.

 

[Nocturnal_Principal_X]

I have to say no. I believe God allows them to happen but I don't think He necessarily uses them to punish people. Natural disasters are just another part of the fallen world due to Adams sin, after all the Bible even says that the world suffers for the sin of man.

 

[TheScarletPimpernel]

Absolutely no I'm in agreement there. I still believe that God's preffered method of changing hearts is the gospel message. A natural disaster to my understanding is simply too blunt an instrument. People say, oh yeah well what about egypt then, well that was really quite a specific situation where God's people were being held as slaves and second to that God also interceded and interacted with the rulers of in order to warn them. This entire scene just does not apply to the random natural disasters of today.

I do believe that it is possible you could see it as a kind of judgement against sin but only because people choose not to depend on God for thier protection; if they walk away from Him or stay outside of His grace there is nothing to protect them from the natural elements of the world. I've heard plenty of testimonys of believers saved out of one thing or another. On the other hand it is all to easy to blame God for these things thus there is never really any change in thought of men for thier fellow man; like I say it's too blunt an instrument to lead people to repentance. The scripture also says that GOD is patient and kind towards us to lead us to repentance thus I hope I have now made my case to thoroughly squelch the, "it's judgement from God" argument.

Rom 2:4 Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?

It says YHWH is forbearing! A hurricane is not forbearing thus either the scripture is Wrong and God lied or this is in fact exactly what the world believes it to be, "a force of nature". Sometimes it seems as though athiests and non believers have a better grasp of the truth than does the church!

 

[von]

God control's every force of nature. He is no respector of persons. The Bible speaks of these things happening in the last days. All over the earth.
We as Americans tend to believe that God is not going to punish us. We are the strongest nation on the face of the earth. We are the richest nation on the earth. We also have forsaken God. We must humble ourselves and turn from our wicked ways, then will God heal our land.
What I really believe though and if you check back at the times that we have faced disaster, our President was coercing Israel to give away the land that the Lord had promised them and everytime we interfere with that we have some kind of disaster in our nation. That is none of our business and God will not tolerate any nation that interferes or comes against Israel.
Believe me we are going to see much more of these sorts of problems in our nation. For one to think that God is pleased with our nation I sincerely have to ? their sincerity with the Word of God.

 

[Merry Menagerie]

It rains on the just and the unjust.

 

[Petrushka]

I have to say no. I believe God allows them to happen but I don't think He necessarily uses them to punish people. Natural disasters are just another part of the fallen world due to Adams sin, after all the Bible even says that the world suffers for the sin of man.

In my opinion this is the most concise and accurate response to the OP. :smt023

 

[D46]

I believe also as stated that natural disaster do happen and it rains on us all. But I also think that America has a date with God's woodshed. I think New Orleans and Biloxi could bery well be a higher power saying, "America, this is your wakeup call." How often did God warn Israel of impending wrath unless they altered their lifestyle and belief system...over and over yet, they would not heed his warning. They soon felt his wrath through sickness, pestilence and death either by disease or sword. Just look in the book of Judges alone at the times they were warned...

Judges 2:11 (KJV) And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and served Baalim:

Judges 3:7 (KJV) And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD, and forgat the LORD their God, and served Baalim and the groves.

Judges 3:12 (KJV) And the children of Israel did evil again in the sight of the LORD: and the LORD strengthened Eglon the king of Moab against Israel, because they had done evil in the sight of the LORD.

Judges 4:1 (KJV) And the children of Israel again did evil in the sight of the LORD, when Ehud was dead.

Judges 6:1 (KJV) And the children of Israel did evil in the sight of the LORD: and the LORD delivered them into the hand of Midian seven years.

Judges 10:6 (KJV) And the children of Israel did evil again in the sight of the LORD, and served Baalim, and Ashtaroth, and the gods of Syria, and the gods of Zidon, and the gods of Moab, and the gods of the children of Ammon, and the gods of the Philistines, and forsook the LORD, and served not him.


http://jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%2 ... merica.htm