Pagan roots of Christmas & Easter

[Poke]

There were NO CHRISTIANS at the time to which you refer...
Romans 1:16

16For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Do you understand what this passage of the NT is saying? TO THE JEW FIRST. Now if the Jews are NOT God's chosen people 1. Why did Jesus come in the FLESH AS A JEW? 2. Why did Jesus state that He had come for the LOST SHEEP OF ISRAEL? 3. Why were ALL the apostles JEWS? You see, you ignorance has become manifest through your statements concerning something which you obviously know NOTHING about.

Do you undestand what this passage of the NT is saying? THE GOSPEL OF CHRIST. The children of God have always been those who love God. There's nothing in that verse that says that Jews get to heaven without Jesus, as you constantly imply. Your "gospel" (that those whom Jesus called sons of Satan are the chosen of God) is from Satan; and lies, murder, and hatred of the celebration of Chist's birthday follow everywhere it is spread, by those who believe what you say.

Why don't you read John 8 several times.

No Poke, IT'S ALREADY a carnival. I had NOTHING to do with it. And further more, refuse to have anything to do with it other than to warn others of it's detriment. You continue to LOVE Christmas and participate all you please, but you have also been warned.

No, you have been warned. There is nothing wicked in the celebration of Christmas. The only wickedness is in those who oppose it. Santa Clause, gift giving, family reunions, decorations, etc. are not evil. It's a day where Christians focus on Jesus even if the secular world focuses on secular things. It's not a holiday were zionists worship the state (4th of July) while the secular world binges on beer. It is not a carnival (if by that you mean bearded ladies and skeeball), in spite of your, and Satan's, best effots to make Christmas a carnival. It's a celebration of Christ's birth.

 

[thessalonian]

Those who oppose Christmass and Easter seem to be the ones who think the day is important rather than what is in the heart of man. It is legalism at it's finest. They like to point fingers at people. Keep it up folks. I worship the Trinity, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. I honor the birth of Christ on Christmass. I don't care what day it is on or who observed what on that day before it was Christmass. I reflect on the scriptural stories of the birth of Christ on that day (not limited to that day of course). The Church calendar is beneficial in that it methodically helps one to go through the whole Bible, not missing parts of it so that our thinking becomes biased in one part of scripture such as Romans.

 

[LittleNipper]

Those who oppose Christmass and Easter seem to be the ones who think the day is important rather than what is in the heart of man. It is legalism at it's finest. They like to point fingers at people. Keep it up folks. I worship the Trinity, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. I honor the birth of Christ on Christmass. I don't care what day it is on or who observed what on that day before it was Christmas. I reflect on the scriptural stories of the birth of Christ on that day (not limited to that day of course). The Church calendar is beneficial in that it methodically helps one to go through the whole Bible, not missing parts of it so that our thinking becomes biased in one part of scripture such as Romans.

You know, I do agree with you in this matter completely. Now if we could only agree in other things :-D And let's face a fact. Christ was carried full term --- 9 months by Mary in her womb. Now I do believe that when JESUS was born HE opened HER womb and you do not ----- WE WILL NOT GO THERE ----- I DON'T WANT TO ARGUE WITH YOU ------ I'm just pointing out that what GOD considers is not at all what man imagines. The fact is that GOD was with us, in the world, for nine whole months before HE was born. I like to use every opportunity to CELEBRATE CHRIST and PROMOTE CHRIST. I feel that people who are bent on making an issue of everything simply waste precious time they could be spreading the GOSPEL MESSAGE and one part of that message is that CHRIST came to this planet (HE CREATED) as a human baby. The FACT is HE sloshed around in Mary's womb for 9 months to accomplish this. The fact is that for me, the EVERGREEN tree represents ETERNAL LIFE. The decorated TREE represents for me THE NEW JERUSALEM. The gold, purple and silver ornaments represent for me CHRIST THE KING. The red ornaments HIS shed BLOOD. The blue HIS PERSEVERANCE with HIS saints. The angels HIS messengers/heavenly host, The bells HIS CLEAR MESSAGE . The candy canes the lowly and ordinary people GOD chose to proclaim to first. The CHRISTMAS VILLAGE with the train running around it is HIS MILLENNIAL KINGDOM. This is what I get from it and what I share with others. If someone disagrees, they need to present the GOSPEL as they are lead, but they should not waste time trying to establish where and how that message should be proclaimed. They should be doing it ALL THE TIME.

 

[thessalonian]

I do believe that when JESUS was born HE opened HER womb and you do not

I don't? What are you saying? She was no longer a virgin after the birth?

I would be quite happy not to debate so much if people wouldn't attack my faith with straw man and red herring charges that don't add up scripturally. Glad we are in agreement on this topic.

Blessings

 

[Imagican]

Guys, there are many passages in the Bible that specifically state that those that love God and accept His Son are NOT to do as those that don't. The purpose is to OVERCOME that which others will do 'willingly'. I have YET to condemn ANYONE for their 'practices'. I have simply tried to point out a 'better way' to get 'closer to God'. Eliiminating the negative and accentuating the positive is certainly not a BAD thing.


There is MUCH in the celibration of Christmas that is not only detrimental to one's walk, there is much that is actually 'AGAINST' Christ. If you choose to ignore this for the sake of the 'party', so be it. This is NO different than the REASON that Christmas was formed to 'start with'.

Unlike many, I question EVERYTHING in my life and compare it to scripture. If there are those that choose to simply accept without discerning, so be it. It's always been this way so it comes as no surprise to me.

EVERYDAY should be a day in which we thank Christ and His Father for the gifts that have been bestowed, and the LOVE that has been offered. But, to change a pagan holiday into a Christian one simply by inserting the name of Christ offers no honor to Christ whatsoever. You may 'think' so, but I KNOW better.

We are NOT to judge our brothers in the 'days' that they celibrate. Just as we are not to judge our brothers and sisters according to their 'faith'. But we are to CERTAINLY offer the 'truth' and understanding of the 'why' of such things in order to help them avoid the possible pitfalls that they may encounter participating in things that may NOT be the RIGHT way to honor the Father or the Son.

A little food for thought and then I'll be on my way:

IF God or Christ HAD wanted us to celibrate the BIRTH of Christ, wouldn't it stand to reason that the actual DATE of His birth would have been given? And of what MAJOR significance was the BIRTH of Christ other than the ACTUAL event taking place. Seems to me that His coming was a pretty TRAMATIC event and points out the overall SAD state of man that God would have to go to such EXTREME lengths in order to 'show His LOVE'. So the birth of Christ was insignificant compared to the DEATH of Our Savior.

And, pershaps, being ALL KNOWING, God, in His infinite wisdom, REALIZED what a 'farce' celibrating Christ's birth MIGHT become were He to offer this date and therefore decided AGAINST allowing something so sacred to be mocked. Left it up to US, thereby continuing to keep the 'true' date sacred.

If one so chooses, the TRUE history of this holiday is VERY easy to discover. Before you start spouting off at the mouth about HOW IMPORTANT it is, perhaps you should KNOW what you are talking about before going to such lengths to defend it.

MEC

 

[Imagican]

Poke,

Your replies take on a very dark undertone. Please, I know that you don't mean to, but your statements ring with sounds that echo the sentiment of the RCC of the past. They hated and persecuted the Jews for many hundreds of years. Denying the Word and that the JEWS ARE GOD'S CHOSEN PEOPLE. There is not a 'TRUE' Christian that exsit that can deny what has been offer through the Word. We have the Word of God Himself STATING that the Jews ARE His Chosen. Your words denying this mean nothing to one of understanding.

The passage that I offered PLAINLY states, 'to the JEWISH FIRST.' Yet you will deny the message that is plainly stated. Jesus WAS a JEW. Even HE stated at first that He came FOR HIS PEOPLE. Your denial indicates that you have either NOT read the Word or have misunderstood it if you have.

I am NOT a Jew. I am what is refered to in the Word as a Gentile. Saved BUT by the Grace of God. If not for Christ I would probably have never even HEARD of the One True God. I would have simply been following what ever 'sounded' good and worshiping little statues, (or big ones) and praying to the works of the hands of men for my blessings. Fortunately God DID send His Son so that ALL may come to the understanding of the 'truth'.

I don't understand your position nor do I WANT to. Yours seems to be one of 'denial' rather than understanding and I will pray that your eyes may be opened in order for TRUE understanding to be revealed.

Bless you, my brother,

MEC

 

[Poke]

We have the Word of God Himself STATING that the Jews ARE His Chosen.

We have the word of the Lord Jesus Christ himself stating that Jews are children of Satan, not of Abraham. Zionist beliefs brings nothing but evil. And, I don't mean evil in the absurd and totally unsupported way that someone says celebrating Christmas is bad, I mean evil as in 9/11, billions drained from the US treasury every year to support Israel and payoff her neighbors, WMD lies, Israeli spies being allowed to run through the US government with impunity, unending conflict in the middle-east, corruption of Christian of biblical doctrines, ad nauseum.

The passage that I offered PLAINLY states, 'to the JEWISH FIRST.' Yet you will deny the message that is plainly stated.

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek." The verse is very clear that salvation is through Christ, not through race. And, absurd claim that it somehow implies that Jews are God's chosen, then it would also imply that Greeks are God's chosen as well, just not first (then there's that first shall be last and last shall be first).

I am NOT a Jew.

You probably have as much Jewish blood in you as anyone today who does claim to be a Jew.

I don't understand your position nor do I WANT to. Yours seems to be one of 'denial' rather than understanding and I will pray that your eyes may be opened in order for TRUE understanding to be revealed.

It's real simple. Christianity, by definition, means that Christians are God's chosen people. This is what the whole Bible teaches. Those who think Jews are God's chosen people seem as if they'd prefer to be sacrificing animals in a Temple than celebrating the birth of our Savior. Those who think Jews are God's chosen people seem to be more concerned with promoting war in the middle-east than with preserving morality in the US.

 

[Imagican]

KKK or Arian Brotherhood?

 

[Poke]

KKK or Arian Brotherhood?

Considering that you're a proud and open racial supremacist, don't you think you're being a bit of a hypocrite in accusing me of being racist, just for not being a racial supremacist?

In the wake of the Sept. 11 terrorist attack, the FBI has stumbled on the largest espionage ring ever discovered inside the United States. The U.S. Justice Department is now holding nearly 100 Israeli citizens with direct ties to foreign military, criminal and intelligence services.

link

How come the state of Israel has never been punished for spying on the US? How come a caught Israeli spy almost never faces anything more than quiet deportation?

How come we don't punish Israel for not sharing their prior knowledge of 9/11? How come we don't punish them for protecting from justice criminals who flee from the US to Israel? How come we didn't punish Israel for trying to sink the USS Liberty? How come we don't punish Israel for selling US military and nuclear technology to China and other places?

The answer isn't just your racism, which is shared by those who run the US government, it's the pure evil the emanates from your particular flavor of racism.

 

[Imagican]

Poke,

I asked a simple question. A simple yes or no would have surficed.

I have simply read what you have to say and your hatred towards Jews is obvious. I'm quite sure that it wouldn't take a 'genius' to figure out, considering how openly you have spoken concerning these people. The only people I have EVER met that would speak in such a manner are members of racial supremist movements, (or wanna be's).

If you are not a member of such you sure fooled me. Not a 'hard thing to do', I admit, but I believe that most that view you comments will take them in the same 'light'.

I hold the Jews in NO higher esteem that ANY other race. I have simply pointed out that the Jews ARE God's chosen people. Not MY choice, I have simply accepted the Word of God. Your denial of this speaks volumes concerning your understanding of the Bible.

MEC

 

[John the Baptist]

"I hold the Jews in NO higher esteem that ANY other race. I have simply pointed out that the Jews ARE God's chosen people. Not MY choice, I have simply accepted the Word of God. Your denial of this speaks volumes concerning your understanding of the Bible.

MEC"

******
Hi, John here: (ARE & WERE are miles apart!)
I highlighted the above asking for your reply to where this is found after their Matthew 10:5-6 'rejection' as stated as.. 'Lost Sheep of the House of Israel' & where their house (fold) is documented as being DESOLATE of Christ, by Christ's own Words? Or how a Revelation 2:5 Candlestick can ever be shown to be removed & then reinstated again? Or where a Revelation 3:16-17 Virgin Fold can be 'Spewed Out' as sickening by Christ, and then be Spewed back in??? Pluss the Revelation 3:9 & Revelation 17:5 ones all having sinned the Sin Against the Holy Ghost that is found in Matthew 12:31-32 and then seeing God contradicts Himself??

No, my friend, old Israel is no more Christ's fold than is the catholic mother of harlots!

 

[Poke]

I have simply read what you have to say and your hatred towards Jews is obvious.

If I criticized the KKK, would that mean I hate whites? That's the logic you're using. Zionism is evil and nothing but evil comes from it.

I hold the Jews in NO higher esteem that ANY other race. I have simply pointed out that the Jews ARE God's chosen people.

To any sane person, you've just contradicted youself.

Not MY choice, I have simply accepted the Word of God. Your denial of this speaks volumes concerning your understanding of the Bible.

Lie. The Bible explicitly says that the children of Abraham, the chosen people, are those who belong to Christ.

Galatians 3:29
If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[stray bullet]

See Hislop thread, click link to contents, scroll down to those pagan festivals

& see these sources

Pagan Holidays: Christmas and Easter Exposed!

Christmas (Christ Mass) and Easter (Pascha) are not pagan holidays. Christmas is the date that Christ's birth is celebrated on the liturgical calender. Thus, the people gather together at Mass to celebrate- Christ-Mass.

Easter/Pascha is a day people celebrate the resurrection of Christ on the liturgical calender. It has nothing to do with paganism.

When various pagan cultures converted to Christianity, many of them kept some of their cultural traditions from pagan holidays and used them to celebrate the new Christian holidays. If you cook a goose every winter to celebrate some pagan day, then you will probably want to cook a goose on Christmas after you convert.

There's nothing wrong with it.

 

[John the Baptist]

See Hislop thread, click link to contents, scroll down to those pagan festivals

& see these sources

Pagan Holidays: Christmas and Easter Exposed!

Christmas (Christ Mass) and Easter (Pascha) are not pagan holidays. Christmas is the date that Christ's birth is celebrated on the liturgical calender. Thus, the people gather together at Mass to celebrate- Christ-Mass.

Easter/Pascha is a day people celebrate the resurrection of Christ on the liturgical calender. It has nothing to do with paganism.

When various pagan cultures converted to Christianity, many of them kept some of their cultural traditions from pagan holidays and used them to celebrate the new Christian holidays. If you cook a goose every winter to celebrate some pagan day, then you will probably want to cook a goose on Christmas after you convert.

There's nothing wrong with it.

*******
Come on, we are not catholic blind baby kittens, bring in some of God's Word for celebrating Christ with colored light bulbs, green trees, colored eggs from chickens? plus rabbits??? :robot: Anything from His Word will suffice.

And these postings (yours included) tell the world that these are not pagan customs? :roll: We do believe in telling the truth according to the Covenant of God, right? 2 Corinthians 4:2
Look, nothing personal, but there is no way to [call or post] that pagan stuff is Gods Truth!
All this proves is that if satan catches the person from the first six years of his life, he has a great chance of having his 'junk' being accepted & believed all of his life.

And I agree with him. When one accepts pagan stuff for Gods way, they will just about accept anything else! Look at the complete text of the Masters Word of Revelation 17:1-5 all in capes!

---John

 

[Quasar]

Thread subject

Hi guys,

The following is an interesting article about PASCHA, or what is now known as Easter, by Rich Robinson, Of the Jews for Jesus organization that will provide you the background for this momentous event , soon to take place again this year.


What About Easter?

At least as late as the fourth century A.D., the holiday known as Easter was called PASCHA ("Passover" in English). Easter, however, appears to be derived from EASTRE, the name or festival of the Teutonic goddess of spring, to whom sacrifices were offered in the month of April. The word is Germanic, not Greek or Hebrew. We can surmise that when Christianity began to make inroads among the Teutonic (Germanic) tribes, the name EASTER was transfered to the Christian celebration, inasmuch as both occurred at the same time of year.

The earliest observation of PASCHA took place at the same time as Passover, on the 14th day of the Jewish month of Nisan. This celebration is referred to as the "Quartodeciman Passover" from the Latin word for "fourteenth."

Moves towards changing the date of PASCHA began early in the second century. The motivation behind this change was fear of the authorities coupled with anti-Jewish sentiment. The actual course of events appears to have been as follows.

Bishop Sixtus of Rome, who presided from A.D. 116-126, may have been the first to observe a Sunday date rather than the 14th of Nisan. These three reasons support the idea.

1. According to the church historian eusebius, a later Roman bishop named Victor sought to impose a Sunday observance on the entire Church and to break ties with those Christians who obseved the 14th of Nisan. He was opposed by Iraneus, who discouraged such a break and argued that peace should be kept among Christians who celebrated the day on different dates. He contended that even earlier church leaders who did not observe the Quartodeciman date were at peace with those who did. In mentioning the names of one church leader after another, Iraneus used reverse chronological order, stopping at Bishop Sixtus.

2. The rule of Bishop Sixtus coicided with the measures of the Roman Emperor Hadrian that were aimed at repressing anything Jewish. (Hadrian's reign was A.D. 117-13 . It would have made sense if the church had been pressured at that time not to observe the 14th of Nisan. Any anti-Jewish feeling would certainly have been catalysed by Hadrian's prohibition of Jewish customs and festigvals. This culminated in the expulsion of the Jews, including the Jewish Christian church leaders, from Jerusalem , circa A.D. 135. (After that, the Jewish church was composed of Gentiles).

3. According to the fourth century Bishop Epiphanius, the Sunday observance of PASCHA was first introduced in Jerusalem after A.D. 135 when the Jews were forced out of Jerusalem by Hadrian. If the new Sunday observance began with Sixtus in his tenure of A.D. 116-126, this would have allowed time for the practice to have spread to Jerusalem by A.D. 135.


The next significant step on record comes from the late second century, the time of Bishop Victor of Rome. As already mentioned, Victor attempted to make the Sunday observance of PASCHA uniform. A primary motivating factor for Victor would have been the presence in Rome of many Christians from Asia Minor who observed the Quartodeciman Passover. Their presence alongside the Roman believers would have meant that Christians were observing two different dates for the same occasion. Perhaps Victor's only motive was his desire to ensure uniformity within the church.

In any case, by the middle of the third century, blatant anti-Semitic statements are found in various Christian sources. In a work called DE PASCHA COMPUTUS, the author, known as Pseudo-Cyprian, wrote contemptuously of following Jewish practice, expressing the desire for Christians not to "walk in blindness and stupidity behind the Jews as though they did not know the day of Passover."

Finally, in the fourth century, PASCHA became decisively separated from Passover and restricted to a Sunday observance. Not only individuals but church councils contributed to the change in date. In A.D. 314, the Council of Arles recommended a single date for the uniform observance of PASCHA, but it was the Council of Nicaea in A.D. 325 that was the watershed that solidified this motion. The date of PASCHA was fixed as the Sunday following the full moon that falls on or after the vernal equinox. The edict of Council of Nicaea proclaimed:

"All the brethren in the East who formerly celebrated Easter
with the Jews, will henceforth keep it at the same time as the
Romans, with us and with all those who from ancient times
have celebrated the feast at the same time with us."

Ultimate official support came from Emperor Constantine, whose conciliar letter to all bishops of the same time period announced it "unworthy" to celebrate PASCHA on Passover.

Nevertheless, complications arose because some churches followed the Jewish or lunar calendar. Full uniformity in calculating the date was not secured until as late as the eighth century. The Eastern Orthodox Church still calculates Easter differently.


Blessings,

Quasar

 

[Quasar]

Thread subject

Hi friends,

The sign of the Son of Man referred to by Jesus in Mt.24:30 is explained from what was written in Rev,12:1-2, called the "Wonderous sign in heaven.'

We know from Lk.2:8-9, the birth of Jesus could not have been in the middle of the winter, on Dec.25th. Roman legend would have it, that was the date of their god Zues's birthday. Shepherds do not watch their flocks by night when it gets cold at that time of year, in that region.

The following is a study that took many years to research by astro physisists, scientists and astronomers in retrogressing the heavenly body positions by computer in the study of what the Star of Bethlehem was. A cursory review is provided below, of the event that accompanied the appearance of the Star of Bethleham, which is another subject that can be further pursued in the link provided at the bottom of the text. Many obervatories throughout the country, like the one in Los Angeles Griffith Observatory, reproduce this event during the Christmas season every year.

The Great and Wonderous Sign - Revelation 12:1-2:

You could say - it is the gospel in the sky. (Ps.89:5) This wonder takes place once every year at a very specific time. When Jesus was born. [The Star of Bethlehem was also involved in this astronomical phenomenon, but so far, only a one time event, and is another subject].

The woman in Rev.12:1-2, represents a virgin with the sun amidst her body, representing her pregnancy. The moon at her feet represents the specific time frame this event takes place.

The only time of year this event can be witnessed, is in late September/early October, as seen from the middle east, at or around the Jewish Holy Convocation - feast and festival - of Rosh Hashanah. Their New Year - which they call 'a year of new beginnings.' It is also the last fall feast and festival of their year which they call the 'feast of trumpets.' They also believe it marks the day God's creation.

The woman's body is in the Constellation of Virgo (The virgin). She represents the virgin Mary, of Israel, and has a crown of twelve stars on her head - representing the twelve tribes of Israel. The sun is amidst her body, signifying her pregnancy.

Her head is about 10% in the previous Constellation Leo (The Lion - of Judah) and the crescent moon is at her feet, about 10% into the Constellation Libra (The scales of righteousness and judgement).

With all the heavenly bodies in motion, this event can take place only between a time frame from 7:15 to 7:45 P.M., a 15 minute window.

So when Jesus talks about His return at His Second Advent in Mt.24:30, it will be at that specific time of year - and time frame, which He referred to as "The Sign of the Son Of Man."

For the full treatment on this outstanding study, read Dr. Ernest L. Martin, PhD., book, "The Star That Astonished the World."

http://www.askelm.com/books/book003.htm

Blessings,

Quasar

 

[Imagican]

John,

So you beileve that the Jews ARE NOT God's chosen? That their rejection of Christ 'changes' His love for them? ALL THE LAW AND ALL THE PROPHETS, remember? So God spent all the effort to lead and educate HIS CHOSEN, and because they turned their backs on Him AGAIN, He has abandoned them? Yeah, I see your logic, whole lotta love there.

ANYONE that could deny that the Hebrews/Jews were/ARE God's CHOSEN, simply hasn't understood the Word AT ALL. People may turn their backs on God, but He has NEVER turned His back on People. The simple fact that He sent His Son AS A JEW is a prime example of what 'I' offer.

In Revalation, IT SPECIFICALLY speaks of the TWELVE tribes and the numbers that will be saved from these twelve. Funny, but there is NO mention of Gentiles being saved. Not that they won't be, but there is PROOF that there WILL be members of the TWELVE TRIBES that ARE saved.

You guys are something else. What church is teaching you these lies? Read the Word for YOURSELF and perhaps it won't be SO confusing. There was a covenant made with Abraham that will NEVER be broken. Yes, there IS a NEW covenant but that doesn't mean God will STOP honoring the OLD.

No Poke, it would be those that refuse to accept the Word as offered that introduce insanity into the hearts of themselves and others. Have neither you nor John ever read the references to the fig tree? That the Gentiles have been grafted ON. Do you NOT understand what this is in reference to?

See what your denominationalism does to your hearts? It makes you SPECIAL, (in your own eyes), when in reality, you're NOTHING short of lowlife sinners who would be better off dropping to their knees BEGGING for forgiveness than arguing points that they don't even understand.

MEC

 

[MrVersatile48]

Just to back Imagican, do also read Genesis 12, Ezekiel 36, Jeremiah 31 & Romans 9-11

& to back John, 'Easter' also comes from pagan goddess Ishtar

I came in here having asked God where this post - that I'd sum up @ 'what is too big/too much for us to do for God, after all He has done for us?' - would fit best

God said here & @ Mining Minor Prophets:-

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cost of Redemption

. . . you were bought at a price. (NIV) 1
Corinthians 6:20

Paul uses the term, redemption, as one of the
processes by which Christ secured salvation for
believers. He states that redemption comes from
Christ (Romans 3:24). Paul writes in Titus 2:14 that
Jesus "gave himself for us to redeem us from all
wickedness" (NIV), or "from all iniquity" (RSV).
Jesus "rescued us from the dominion of darkness "
and it is in Jesus that we have redemption and the
forgiveness for our sins (Colossians 1:13-14).


As Paul explains, Jesus willingly offered Himself as the
payment for our ransom. Christians "were bought at a
price" (1 Corinthians 6:20, 7:23). The price paid for
our redemption was Christ's shed blood on the cross
(Ephesians 1:7). Jesus said there was no greater
love expressed than to lay down your life for a friend
(John 15:13). But, Jesus demonstrated even greater
love when he laid His life down for those who were
His enemies.


Is there anything that God is asking you to do, that
you look at it as too big a "price to pay" to be
obedient? God did not consider it too great a cost
(His Son) to pay to secure your future in Heaven!


Continued tomorrow. . .

Written by Marji "Mike" Kruger

For more on a relationship with God. . . - http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?t=xzkbhybab.0.ggg ... 4027&ts=S0
207&p=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.anchorlife.org%2Fhtml%2Fwhy_bother.htm

 

[John the Baptist]

John,

So you beileve that the Jews ARE NOT God's chosen? That their rejection of Christ 'changes' His love for them? ALL THE LAW AND ALL THE PROPHETS, remember? So God spent all the effort to lead and educate HIS CHOSEN, and because they turned their backs on Him AGAIN, He has abandoned them? Yeah, I see your logic, whole lotta love there.

MEC

******
The fault does not lay with the Godhead's Love my friend, what more could they have done??

And my theology?? No again my friend, the Everlasting Gospel is just that! Revelation 14:6, and it has Eternal Covenant Conditions as seen in Hebrews 13:20.

And no, you can blame God all day long, it changes nothing. I am the same today, yesterday, and forever He states!
The problem is with the one, or ones, or the whole fold as in Revelation 2:5 who divorces their self from God. Got that? Ezekiel 18:21-26

---John

 

[Imagican]

I think so John, but I have still failed to find where you justify God 'abandoning' His chosen for the sake of the Gentiles. What I have gathered from scripture is that the Gentiles have been ADDED to the 'tree of life', grafted is the word actually used. I have NEVER encountered ANY scripture that God has 'changed' and I see that you accept His permenance. So 'when' did He decide to recant His offerings and abandon the Hebrews/Jews?

I seem to remember that EVERY apostle was Jewish, Jesus Himself was born through the seed of David, (if ever there was an honest to goodness Jew, Dave would have been ONE), Jesus preached in the temples, and even STATED at one point that He had NOT come to offer His gift to the 'dogs', (I believe indicating ANY 'other than' the Jews). Peter even battled furiously with Paul over the understanding of 'exactly' WHO Christ's gift was to benefit.

So, I don't accept the 'fact' that the Hebrew/Jewish bloodline IS God's chosen simply for the sake of MY OWN understanding, I accept this offering because it is God's will. Always has been and always WILL be. The relationship between God and man began in that part of the world with a 'particular' people and I believe it will END THERE, (as far as the world we know today), with the SAME people. That they have turned their backs on Him over and over just goes to offer us understanding of JUST how deep God's love can be.

MEC