Pastors with bodyguards

[PrivateTimm]

Many points have been made as to why a pastor should have a bodyguard.
Absolutely none of the points hold water to Scripture.
Some people have thrown in our weaknesses to justify a pastor's weaknesses.

The truth is, the pastor should be setting the example for his flock.
What he is saying is this: "I can't trust in God for my safety and neither should you".

I for one would no longer listen to a pastor trying to tell me the truth when he doesn't believe the truth himself.

I notice you completely ignored these questions of you.

Do you wear a seatbelt? If so, why isn't Jesus good enough?

Do you lock the doors to your home? If so, why isn't Jesus good enough?

Do you cross the street against the light? If not, why isn't Jesus good enough?


Luke 22:35-36
<sup class="versenum">35 </sup>Then Jesus asked them, “When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?”
“Nothing,” they answered.
<sup class="versenum">36 </sup>He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.


Nehemiah 4:17-21

<sup class="versenum">17 </sup>who were building the wall. Those who carried materials did their work with one hand and held a weapon in the other, <sup class="versenum">18 </sup>and each of the builders wore his sword at his side as he worked. But the man who sounded the trumpet stayed with me.
<sup class="versenum">19 </sup>Then I said to the nobles, the officials and the rest of the people, “The work is extensive and spread out, and we are widely separated from each other along the wall. <sup class="versenum">20 </sup>Wherever you hear the sound of the trumpet, join us there. Our God will fight for us!”
<sup class="versenum">21 </sup>So we continued the work with half the men holding spears, from the first light of dawn till the stars came out.

Did the men not trust God to protect them while they built the wall? Did Jesus not trust his Father to protect his disciples?

 

[Eugene]

Prosperity/Word of Faith teachers are false teachers. They teach a gospel which is a different gospel, and that for their own selfish gain.

Oh no, are we saying that prosperity preaching is not following Christ as the Apostle Paul did? 1 Cor 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ. I will add a thought though: Philippians 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

2 Cor 11:7 Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely?
2 Cor 11:23 Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool) I am more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft.
2 Cor 11:24 Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one.
2 Cor 11:25 Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep;
2 Cor 11:26 In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;
2 Cor 11:27 In weariness and painfulness, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness.
2 Cor 11:28 Beside those things that are without, that which cometh upon me daily, the care of all the churches.
2 Cor 11:29 Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is offended, and I burn not?
2 Cor 11:30 If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things which concern mine infirmities.

 

[Brother Mike]

Oh no, are we saying that prosperity preaching is not following Christ as the Apostle Paul did? 1 Cor 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ. I will add a thought though: Philippians 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

Php 4:16 For even in Thessalonica ye sent once and again unto my necessity.
Php 4:17 Not because I desire a gift: but I desire fruit that may abound to your account.

2Co 8:4 Begging us most insistently for the favor and the fellowship of contributing in this ministration for [the relief and support of] the saints [in Jerusalem].

1Co_9:9 For it is written in the law of Moses, Thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn. Doth God take care for oxen?
1Ti_5:18 For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

Heb 6:14 Saying, Surely blessing I will bless thee, and multiplying I will multiply thee.
Heb 6:15 And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise.
Gal_3:9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

I think I am wondering what this is about since the Word teaches abundant blessing and Prosperity.

3Jn_1:2 Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.

Psa_112:3 Wealth and riches shall be in his house: and his righteousness endureth for ever.

Job 36:11 If they obey and serve him, they shall spend their days in prosperity, and their years in pleasures.

The best I can put together is some may not want to obey and serve God because they are afraid of God blessing them.

The other thing troubling me is what price do you put on someone healed of cancer? Seems some have a dollar amount that would exceed being worth that. We just got the doctors report and praise report from a women just healed. The problem of course was that she lived several states away and my Pastor had to fly his jet to make it to all the meetings in that state and 2 others.

Shameful how the women gets to live when that money could have been spent on the poor, because you know God runs out of money at times.

What is a prosperity Gospel anyways, Good news that God is your source? Certainly don't want to preach that.

Mike.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Luke 22:35-36 35 Then Jesus asked them, “When I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?” “Nothing,” they answered. 36 He said to them, “But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.

Without this verse you have nothing to build a case on.
And you do not understand the meaning.

The disciples produced 2 swords, Jesus said, "that is enough".
When Jesus was about to be arrested, they asked him if they should strike with the swords, and one of them struck a servant of the high priest.

Jesus said, "no more of this" and he healed the man.

He was teaching them a lesson.
The vindictiveness of the disciples was to retaliate.
Jesus shows this is unwise zeal.

Why?
Because they thought they were doing good but they were only serving evil.
This attack would have given the Jews a reason to kill Jesus.

You see, any attack by Christians shows we are not loving and trusting Jesus as he wants us to.
There is no witness to your enemies by attacking them.

Jesus could have attacked the enemy himself if that was the example he wanted to give us.

We need to understand that trusting Jesus in all aspects of our lives is the most important thing we can do.
We all have shortcomings in this area and that just gives us something to work on.
As we draw closer to Jesus, our trust grows stronger.

Do pastors need body guards?
Only if they are not trusting in Jesus.

 

[Eugene]

What is a prosperity Gospel anyways, Good news that God is your source? Certainly don't want to preach that.

That certainly should show Paul the way wouldn't you think? Delivered from instead of unto prison he wouldn't have had to suffer? Was Paul prospering physically? 2 Tim 4:13 The cloke that I left at Troas with Carpus, when thou comest, bring with thee, and the books, but especially the parchments, or possibly prospering as his soul prospered? Again 1 Cor 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

2 Tim 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
2Ti 4:5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
2Ti 4:6 For I am now ready to be offered, and the time of my departure is at hand.
2 Tim 4:7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:
2 Tim 4:8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.

I reckon there is little purpose in mentioning the circumstances surrounding Heb 11:38 (Of whom the world was not worthy) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth. These just didn't know what they gave their lives to wasn't the prosperity they could have had. And then it seems them of these great ministries not enjoying the same prosperity as their pastors are just not doing it right either. In 1 Tim 6:5 We read of them supposing that gain is godliness. Do I believe in hearings? Of course and God's gifts are not limited but is available to all who would come to Him in their time of need according to Heb 4:16.

Blessings Mike in Jesus' name.

 

[PrivateTimm]

Because they thought they were doing good but they were only serving evil. This attack would have given the Jews a reason to kill Jesus. You see, any attack by Christians shows we are not loving and trusting Jesus as he wants us to. There is no witness to your enemies by attacking them. Jesus could have attacked the enemy himself if that was the example he wanted to give us.

Well, you completely ignored the Nehemiah passage and ignored all the other questions which were more then rhetorical.

I won't insult you by saying you don't understand the passage, but I will say your interpretation from above is different from any commentary I've ever read and any preacher/pastor I've ever heard.

The reason that Jesus healed the man and told Peter to put away his sword was because He had to be arrested and go through what he was going to go through as he explained in verse 37.

Luke 22:37 It is written: ‘And he was numbered with the transgressors’; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment.”

Jesus is quoting Isiah 53. He had to be arrested and condemned to death on a cross to fulfill his destiny and to have our sins die with him on the cross.

So now, please answer the question about seatbelts, helmets for your children, coats in winter and any other common sense protection we take in our every day lives to keep us safe.

 

[Brother Mike]

Well, you completely ignored the Nehemiah passage and ignored all the other questions which were more then rhetorical.

I won't insult you by saying you don't understand the passage, but I will say your interpretation from above is different from any commentary I've ever read and any preacher/pastor I've ever heard.

you know Timm, your full of pride and arrogance. You publicly and falsely accused a minister of the Word and now putting down and had no evidence of any wrong doing. Just made it up.......

and now allenwynne who believes God can and will protect. Seatbelts are the law where I live and we obey the law, we put coats on because it gets cold, I never wore a helmet to ride my bike (Not around in them days) but I came out safe.

I was reconsidering what I thought about you and your Walk with God, but your making it very difficult for me.

I used to believe in prosperity preachers. Then I stopped believing in them because I heard a very good case against it here in fact. Continuing to mull it over, I now realize that yes, it is true.

What is the prosperity Gospel? The whole Gospel is good news and a prosperity gospel. Jesus said if your faithful with unrighteous mammon then you can be trusted with the true riches. Sounds like prosperity to me.

Jesus preached to the Poor, so they don't have to be poor no more. That would seem like good news to poor people.

What the Word does teach is that we are not to focus on wealth or uncertain riches. Millions can come and go, but the Word is eternal. Jesus said if we put the Kingdom of God first, then everything else is added to us. You would be surprised what comes your way that you wanted by putting God's things first.

If we sow seed (Money) we believe that God will multiply our seed sown as God is not mocked and we reap what we sow if we faint not. Giving and reaping are God's system and we need faith in that. Our Job, and the World's system is broken, and not a sure thing.

Deu 8:18 But thou shalt remember the LORD thy God: for it is he that giveth thee power to get wealth, that he may establish his covenant which he sware unto thy fathers, as it is this day.


So what do I need in life? I need everything that I need to do the plan of God. If that is a Jet airplane the bless God I better get in faith for one because I have to give an account to Jesus if I come short.

I need enough to bless others, I need to have abundance so someone else can have. I may not personally need 10 houses but I can put my faith on them because God has people that can sure use them. I don't focus on myself, I use my faith and trust in God to get into my hands the things for the Kingdom.

You will find that those who claim to be against God's Prosperity are very covetous and have a price tag on what is expensive just like Judas did. We don't want to be like Judas who felt that something costing a years worth of wages was to much to be wasted on Jesus. We don't want to be focused on wealth or getting wealth either.

Mike.

 

[PrivateTimm]

You publicly and falsely accused a minister of the Word and now putting down and had no evidence of any wrong doing. Just made it up....... and now allenwynne who believes God can and will protect. Seatbelts are the law where I live and we obey the law, we put coats on because it gets cold, I never wore a helmet to ride my bike (Not around in them days) but I came out safe. I was reconsidering what I thought about you and your Walk with God, but your making it very difficult for me.

I didn't "accuse" Copeland of anything. It is a fact that he has 9 private airplanes, a private airstrip, lives in an 18,000 square foot lakefront mansion and lives a pretty extravagant lifestyle for a supposed minister of the Gospel. I believe you made a big deal about the government granting the tax exemption status of the planes. What is legal is not the same as what is right in God's eyes.

I won't respond in kind to your bullying and name calling, suffice it to say I am requesting that you stop and stick with issues and address them.

 

[Lewis]

This article below went down a couple of days ago. And as I stated before after a woman charged the pulpit and tried to stab my pastor' the security got tighter.

Louisiana pastor shot and killed while preaching


Bond is set at $1 million for a Louisiana man accused of shooting and killing a church pastor as he preached in Lake Charles, Louisiana, on Friday night. Calcasieu Parish sheriff's deputies arrested 53-year-old Woodrow Karey, a church deacon, and charged him with second-degree murder, after he called 911 and told the dispatcher what he had done, sheriff's spokeswoman Kim Myers said.
Witnesses told police that Karey walked into the Tabernacle of Praise Worship Center around 8:20 p.m. and shot Pastor Ronald Harris twice -- the first time as Karey entered the church and then again at close range after Harris had fallen to the floor, Myers said.
Karey fled the scene on foot but later called the sheriff's office and surrendered without incident, Myers said.
During his arrest, Karey directed the deputies to two guns he had discarded in a wooded area. One of the firearms was a shotgun and the other was a pistol, police said. Police have not said which weapon was used to kill the pastor.
Karey has no known criminal history and the motive for the killing is unknown, police said.
Calcasieu Parish Chief Deputy Stitch Guillory told CNN on Sunday morning there were 50 to 60 witnesses at the church.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Now it appears the pastor either had consensual sex or raped the guys wife.