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Possessed or Not Possessed?

Spiritual realities are just as real as the tangible things we perceive with our five senses. There is more to life than what meets the eye; the natural eye that is. There are two realms running concurrently the spiritual realm, and the physical realm. Both realms are as real as the other. In fact, the spiritual realm is even more real because it is what I like to call the parent realm. In other words, everything originates there. What we perceive with our five senses changes and pass away, but spiritual realities are eternal, meaning they will exist forever. This is what makes the spiritual realm superior to the natural.

Now, whether or not you believe in a spiritual realm does not negate the truth that it indeed exists! It contains spiritual matter, beings, and activities that affect what goes on in the Earth. In the realm of the spirit, there are forces of good and evil, God and Satan, angels and demons. This may sound like something out of a science fiction movie but it is no fairy tale. It is real and taking place right now. There are two kingdoms in operation: the Kingdom of God and the Kingdom of Darkness. In the first, Jesus Christ is Lord; the second is headed by Satan and his forces. The battle that rages on a constant basis is for the souls of men.

We have been conditioned to believe only what we can see, hear, touch, and smell; however, we must not forget that the spiritual realm is higher than the physical realm. All physical things originated in the unseen, spiritual realm, including all of mankind. We should keep in mind that we are spirits living in physical bodies, and the spiritual things we cannot see are just as real as the physical things we can see.
 
Satan will do everything within his power to discourage the Believer, to try to get him to throw the Cross aside. This is why Believers do not go to church. Satan will give them a million excuses not to go and fellowship and worship with true Christ Disciples in church because they will be delivered. When a Believer doesn't tithe and make God first, all they are now doing is saying religious things out their mouth. This is called double-mindedness. They have left their First Love. They are unstable in all their ways. Do not trust and believe anything they say. They receive nothing from the Lord. They are fleshly worldly minded people that promote the Kingdom of darkness. Sin is jumping all over them. The demon of double-mindedness and the demon of leviathan (pride) are operating in the soul and the flesh of this Believer who is living with a voided Cross in their daily walk. These demons will mix truth and a lie together. Satan has done everything within Hell's power to hide the real problem from this Believer, which is sin.
 
iLOVE said:
Satan will do everything within his power to discourage the Believer, to try to get him to throw the Cross aside. This is why Believers do not go to church. Satan will give them a million excuses not to go and fellowship and worship with true Christ Disciples in church because they will be delivered. When a Believer doesn't tithe and make God first, all they are now doing is saying religious things out their mouth. This is called double-mindedness. They have left their First Love. They are unstable in all their ways. Do not trust and believe anything they say. They receive nothing from the Lord. They are fleshly worldly minded people that promote the Kingdom of darkness. Sin is jumping all over them. The demon of double-mindedness and the demon of leviathan (pride) are operating in the soul and the flesh of this Believer who is living with a voided Cross in their daily walk. These demons will mix truth and a lie together. Satan has done everything within Hell's power to hide the real problem from this Believer, which is sin.
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When someone believes they must tithe they have not only taken the Word of God away, they have disrespected the work of Christ, believing his work is not good enough and they must pay God what is his to please him, Works come first then Jesus in this false made up doctrine.

You are trying to lead people away from the work of Christ and put them in chains. Your trying to give people a guilty conscience and no encouragement of the blessed hope of the finished work of Christ.
 
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A lot of times, possibly most of the time from what I've seen, mental illness comes from trauma at the hands of someone elses' sin, honestly. There are a lot of causes, some we aren't even sure of, we're still learning about it. I just think it unfair to make an assumption that is the person's fault. I promise you people with mental illness consider this view plenty on their own, whether it is true or not--because mental illness plays with your mind. Sometimes it is true. I was the one who fed my addiction until it consumed me, I own up to it. But my case is not everyone's case, and taking a scripture and attaching a meaning to it that it's context does not necessarily support is a pretty shaky foundation to stake claims on.
Does sin affect us, yeah. When we don't follow God's rules such as treating others as we'd like to be treated, the result is behaviors that hurt ourselves and those around us. Does this lead to mental illness, not always. I just feel like that is a blanket assumption, trying to take one case and apply it across the board. David did many hurtful things to others. Whether he was ever mentally ill or not I don't know, but of course actions that damaged his relationships with others and with God would hurt him.
 
kiwidan said:
When someone believes they must tithe they have not only taken the Word of God away, they have disrespected the work of Christ, believing his work is not good enough and they must pay God what is his to please him, Works come first then Jesus in this false made up doctrine.

You are trying to lead people away from the work of Christ and put them in chains. Your trying to give people a guilty conscience and no encouragement of the blessed hope of the finished work of Christ.
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God extends mercy beyond theology. Don't put a cap on God's mercy. Whenever you believe that a person can be outside the bounds for God's grace and mercy you are believe wrong. There is something wrong with your view of God. Christians can be guilty of this or more guilty of this than other faith systems. If your belief allows you to mistreat, you are guilty of misbelieving as well as misbehaving. All people are made in the image of God. God sent His Son Jesus to die for all people. This is why it says to pray for your enemies. This is a constant reminder that no one is outside the bounds for God's grace and mercy. Lord Jesus Christ grace and mercy is boundless. Again, if your view of God allows you to withdraw mercy, your view of God is incorrect.

God takes personal interest in individual people. One of the most powerful things about Lord Jesus Christ ministries is that He chose to heal one person at a time. Jesus did not need to go to person, after person, after person, after person after person but He did. You know why? Because He taught us something about the Father; that God takes personal interest in individual people. When you read the book of Mark we learn that Jesus was always surrounded by hundreds and sometime thousands of people who were the sickest in the land. He could have waived His hand and healed them all. However He chose to heal them on at a time. Because our Heavenly Father cares about individual people. God displays His power in our pain - God extends mercy beyond theology - God takes personal interest in individual people.
 
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questdriven said:
A lot of times, possibly most of the time from what I've seen, mental illness comes from trauma at the hands of someone elses' sin, honestly. There are a lot of causes, some we aren't even sure of, we're still learning about it. I just think it unfair to make an assumption that is the person's fault. I promise you people with mental illness consider this view plenty on their own, whether it is true or not--because mental illness plays with your mind. Sometimes it is true. I was the one who fed my addiction until it consumed me, I own up to it. But my case is not everyone's case, and taking a scripture and attaching a meaning to it that it's context does not necessarily support is a pretty shaky foundation to stake claims on.
Does sin affect us, yeah. When we don't follow God's rules such as treating others as we'd like to be treated, the result is behaviors that hurt ourselves and those around us. Does this lead to mental illness, not always. I just feel like that is a blanket assumption, trying to take one case and apply it across the board. David did many hurtful things to others. Whether he was ever mentally ill or not I don't know, but of course actions that damaged his relationships with others and with God would hurt him.
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Because you mentioned King David's name, please read 1 Chronicles 21:1-30 NKJV. When David became double-minded and listened to Satan...read what happens.
 
iLOVE said:
God extends mercy beyond theology. Don't put a cap on God's mercy. Whenever you believe that a person can be outside the bounds for God's grace and mercy you are believe wrong. There is something wrong with your view of God. Christians can be guilty of this or more guilty of this than other faith systems. If your belief allows you to mistreat, you are guilty of misbelieving as well as misbehaving. All people are made in the image of God. God sent His Son Jesus to die for all people. This is why it says to pray for your enemies. This is a constant reminder that no one is outside the bounds for God's grace and mercy. Lord Jesus Christ grace and mercy is boundless. Again, if your view of God allows you to withdraw mercy, your view of God is incorrect.

God takes personal interest in individual people. One of the most powerful things about Lord Jesus Christ ministries is that He chose to heal one person at a time. Jesus did not need to go to person, after person, after person, after person after person but He did. You know why? Because He taught us something about the Father; that God takes personal interest in individual people. When you read the book of Mark we learn that Jesus was always surrounded by hundreds and sometime thousands of people who were the sickest in the land. He could have waived His hand and healed them all. However He chose to heal them on at a time. Because our Heavenly Father cares about individual people. God displays His power in our pain - God extends mercy beyond theology - God takes personal interest in individual people.
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Ok, well I will just carry on and put Jesus Christ first, and not worry if I have done enough, and given God enough money to please him with my good works that are all so good, im sure God is impressed..
 
iLOVE said:
Because you mentioned King David's name, please read 1 Chronicles 21:1-30 NKJV. When David became double-minded and listened to Satan...read what happens.
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I think you're reading stuff into the passage that isn't there. Even if we want to say David was mentally ill (and that is unclear at best), that alone doesn't support your case. Suffering in this life exists because of sin, Adam's fall, and the resulting curse, that includes mental illness. That doesn't mean it's always or even usually the person's own fault. Anymore than it's someone's fault for getting cancer--sometimes, yes, if they contributed to it by smoking or an otherwise unhealthy lifestyle, other times the cause is unknown or unidentifiable, or we aren't advanced enough to know what it is yet. I just have a major problem with this line of thinking. Not just as someone who knows from experience what mental illness is like, but as someone who hears from people suffering from PTSD and other mental illnesses because of traumatic abuse they've endured.
 
I'm sorry, it's hard not to be more confrontational about this than I actually want to be. Just, if you wouldn't tell a cancer patient "hey, this is your fault", then you shouldn't tell a mental health patient this either. At the very least I feel like this should not be assumed to be the case.
 
I have severe mental illness. I think spiritual components are vital to my recovery, but I don't think that my primary problem is Satanic in nature. I was sick when I got saved, I'm in recovery now--that alone is a miracle, to me at least.

Now...my counselor, he's got a Masters Divinity, great man...he says that he sometimes has clients/patients who would probably not be in treatment if they could get saved and apply Christian morality to their lives. I think that's definitely true of depression, and may be true of some other mood disorders, and I think its definitely true of a lot of the personality disorders (personal opinion).
 
questdriven said:
I think you're reading stuff into the passage that isn't there. Even if we want to say David was mentally ill (and that is unclear at best), that alone doesn't support your case. Suffering in this life exists because of sin, Adam's fall, and the resulting curse, that includes mental illness. That doesn't mean it's always or even usually the person's own fault. Anymore than it's someone's fault for getting cancer--sometimes, yes, if they contributed to it by smoking or an otherwise unhealthy lifestyle, other times the cause is unknown or unidentifiable, or we aren't advanced enough to know what it is yet. I just have a major problem with this line of thinking. Not just as someone who knows from experience what mental illness is like, but as someone who hears from people suffering from PTSD and other mental illnesses because of traumatic abuse they've endured.
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Time out! We have a miscommunication understanding. iLove never stated King David was mentally ill.
 
kiwidan said:
When someone believes they must tithe they have not only taken the Word of God away, they have disrespected the work of Christ, believing his work is not good enough and they must pay God what is his to please him, Works come first then Jesus in this false made up doctrine.

You are trying to lead people away from the work of Christ and put them in chains. Your trying to give people a guilty conscience and no encouragement of the blessed hope of the finished work of Christ.
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Brother, what you said can indeed be very true, however, may not be necessarily true in all cases...

The Lord our God does not change.
It depends on the heart if tithing would be disrespecting the cross. If it is within the believers means to tithe, and is upon his heart to do so, or if they simply want to help as much as possible, then to assess the amount based on the old ways would not be disrespectful and would provide him with a yardstick to go by.

Tithing is the only place in scripture whereby it is written that we can test God. If a believer is working out his faith & salvation, and wishes to confirm for themselves that the word of God is true...so wants to tithe in order to see what God will do, God will happily honor His (OT) promise and bless them.

Where we get in trouble would be if we were to take on an obligation to tithe, because our Lord's work on the cross did indeed modify the OT covenant...however, that's not to say that the Lord couldn't/wouldn't put it upon individuals hearts to tithe. (Romans 14!!!)

Blessings be upon you & yours, Brother. :yes
 
A demon controls the thoughts and actions of a person who has not the Holy Spirit dwelling in them, Matthew 17:14-18; Luke 4:33-35; 8:27-33. The Holy Spirit dwells in the believer after they have accepted Jesus as Lord and Savior and where the Holy Spirit dwells the demons have to flee, Romans 8:9-11; 1Corinthians 3:16; 6:19. Satan can tempt us as his only desire is to take us away from God and as a child of God we have to guard ourselves from the wiles of Satan.

1John 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
 
for_his_glory said:
A demon controls the thoughts and actions of a person who has not the Holy Spirit dwelling in them, Matthew 17:14-18; Luke 4:33-35; 8:27-33. The Holy Spirit dwells in the believer after they have accepted Jesus as Lord and Savior and where the Holy Spirit dwells the demons have to flee, Romans 8:9-11; 1Corinthians 3:16; 6:19. Satan can tempt us as his only desire is to take us away from God and as a child of God we have to guard ourselves from the wiles of Satan.

1John 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.
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That is not true. Many Christians sin daily. Are they doing these things on their own?
 
iLOVE said:
That is not true. Many Christians sin daily. Are they doing these things on their own?
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I never said we are without sin as we are all sinners saved by Gods grace and we will make mistakes at times, but a demon can not house where the Holy Spirit dwells.
 
for_his_glory said:
I never said we are without sin as we are all sinners saved by Gods grace and we will make mistakes at times, but a demon can not house where the Holy Spirit dwells.
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This is correct. A demon can never enter the spirit-man...it is sealed. However, he will enter the inner-man (soul) and the flesh (mind) of a Believer from a wounded soul and trauma. Sin gives access to the demonic. These are called strongholds, bondage, and yokes.


A Spirit of Infirmity
10 Now He was teaching in one of the synagogues on the Sabbath. 11 And behold, there was a woman who had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bent over and could in no way raise herself up. 12 But when Jesus saw her, He called her to Him and said to her, “Woman, you are loosed from your infirmity.” 13 And He laid His hands on her, and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God.

14 But the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because Jesus had healed on the Sabbath; and he said to the crowd, “There are six days on which men ought to work; therefore come and be healed on them, and not on the Sabbath day.”

15 The Lord then answered him and said, “Hypocrite!b]'>[b] Does not each one of you on the Sabbath loose his ox or donkey from the stall, and lead it away to water it? 16 So ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan has bound—think of it—for eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the Sabbath?” 17 And when He said these things, all His adversaries were put to shame; and all the multitude rejoiced for all the glorious things that were done by Him.


Jesus said this woman was a daughter of Abraham, which means she was saved. If you look up the word infirmity in the Strong's, it means soul. This woman soul was wounded from sin.
 
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iLOVE said:
Can a Christian have a Demon(s)? What does the bible say on this topic?
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The Bible says that greater is He that is in you, than he that is in the world (referring to Satan). A person who has the indwelling Holy Spirit cannot be demon possessed, but can certainly be oppressed, attacked, hindered, troubled, diseased, etc. by evil spirits. Christians are constantly at war with evil spirits as noted in Ephesians chapter 6.
 
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