predestined

[Christ_empowered]

You mean...does God maybe already know who will and won't turn to Him, under the right conditions? I don't quite get the question...

...my older, wiser Pentecostal friend told me that God sometimes gives certain people extra grace under tough circumstances, because He knows they'll turn to Him in time. I can't find Biblical evidence--maybe you could pull the Saul-to-Paul conversion as an example--but it makes sense. Like how so many now Born Again Christians shouldn't even be alive (for those of us with shady back stories). How so many of us (obviously wretched or not) seem to have been eased into accepting Christ over time. I dunno.

I'm torn on the whole thing. I think of the seeds--you know, the ones in good soil, shallow soil, rocky soil--and I think...maybe some of us are just more likely to become Born Again than others. Then I think...work out your salvation with fear and with trembling. John 3:16. My best Baby Christian guess is that salvation is more God's work than our work, but how that plays out varies by individual.

 

[Classik]

Thanks for the reply, CE. By 'end' I mean: where one will spend his/her eternity.

 

[follower]

If you can find a copy of The New Testament , an expanded translation, by Kenneth S. Wuest,
the answer is YES! Exuberantly! and immediately after immersion in the Name of Yeshua the JOY of Salvation is experienced(by the living redeemed from their sins) because it is so.

Actually, does GOD know our ends?

 

[Deborah13]

Thanks for the reply, CE. By 'end' I mean: where one will spend his/her eternity.

Yes, I believe God knows everything that will happen in His creation from the beginning to the end.

 

[Gary]

not necessarily 'struggle'. If someone's end is already guaranteed...why should one try to be Christian?

The invitation is there but not all accept.
.

That is, the decision is ours to make?

While I believe the story line is all laid out, I also believe that all there is belongs to God and He reserves the right to change His mind. Here are 3 examples of God doing just that.

Exodus 32
14 And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.

Jonah 3
10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not.

1 Chronicles 21
15 And God sent an angel unto Jerusalem to destroy it: and as he was destroying, the Lord beheld, and he repented him of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed, It is enough, stay now thine hand. And the angel of the Lord stood by the threshingfloor of Ornan the Jebusite.




So it's not always so cut and dried. Just as the Lord had a change of heart regarding the destruction He was going bring upon the people, He may also change His mind in regards to the "vessels of honor" as well as the "vessels of wrath".

The talk Abraham had with the Lord regarding the destruction of Sodom is a perfect example of the Lord willing to change His mind.

Genesis 18
26 So the Lord said, “If I find in Sodom fifty righteous within the city, then I will spare all the place for their sakes.”


One other thing to remember is this:

Matthew 19
25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”
26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”



Thoughts?

.

 

[Classik]

Thanks. Certain issues are quite hard to fully absorb.

God being such a loving GOD may decide: 'Well...everyone to my Throne'

 

[Willie T]

Thanks. Certain issues are quite hard to fully absorb.

God being such a loving GOD may decide: 'Well...everyone to my Throne'

That might be a bigger possibility than we think.

 

[Gary]

Thanks. Certain issues are quite hard to fully absorb.

God being such a loving GOD may decide: 'Well...everyone to my Throne'

You can bank on it.

Revelation 20
11 Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

.

 

[follower]

not necessarily 'struggle'. If someone's end is already guaranteed...why should one try to be Christian?

from what Scripture says, like the Bereans, check it out,
some are raised for life, some for judgment , as it is written >

"John 5:22-30King James Version (KJV)
22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me."

and again from Revelation about the people of earth, "the rest of mankind" (most all of people on earth) >>
"Revelation 9:20-21 ESV - The rest of mankind, who were not ...
The rest of mankind, ... did not repent of the works of their hands nor give up worshiping demons and idols of gold and silver and bronze and stone and wood, ..."