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vic said:Jason. why did you remove the "Temple" pic in your first post?
Exactly. The baptism of the Jews is different than the baptism of Jesus Christ. He baptizes with the Holy Spirit, God himself.vic said:I hear ya and understand what you are saying.
How do you understand this verse?
Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
or this verse?
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Do you thimk that maybe Jesus was stating some "conditions" of the New Covenant?
Just a little sidebar to the topic at hand. I don't want to neglect Jason's questions.
vic said:I hear ya and understand what you are saying.
How do you understand this verse?
Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
Intial response....there are 2 comings of Christ...First off, Baptism is for adults, or those of age....of course God will mete out his spirit (as Jesus recieved) as in accordance of Isa 11:2. Believer's on their baptism (according to God's determination) should recieve a portion (or all) of the Holy Spirit as defined in Isa 11:2. Jesus recieved the full power of the Spirit which enabled him to accomplish God's purpose.
The second portion "fire" comes later during the Messianic Kingdom phase. The "fire" purifies, or purges the soul/spirit of it's sin. IMO.
or this verse?
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
That is a Jewish understanding of Baptism...Jesus is amazed that Nic doesn't understand this because being a pharisaic leader, he should be familiar with the concept....look up http://www.Jewishencyclopedia.com article on Baptism....it will mention that it is considered a rebirth....
Jhn 3:10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?
Do you thimk that maybe Jesus was stating some "conditions" of the New Covenant?
Yes I do...but it's a here now (taste) , in full later (Messianic Kingdom) situation.
Just a little sidebar to the topic at hand. I don't want to neglect Jason's questions.
It is off topic isn't it....
The big confusion among Christians is not knowing the difference between the Tribulation, or persecution of Christians, and the Wrath of God on unbelievers, which happens at the end of the 7 years.
JM said:There's been an update on Price's work, I may bite the bullet and buy it.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/073691 ... e&n=283155