Psychedelic drugs VS. the Holy Ghost.

[Gary]

You see that kind of stuff on the norm do you ?

If one is on hallucinogens.......yes. You said people aren't meant to see those things.

 

[YosefHayim]

If one is on hallucinogens.......yes. You said people aren't meant to see those things.

Are you asking "if we aren't meant to see what we see on psyhedelics, then why are those things seen on psyhedelics"?

 

[Brother Mike]

How is 3 persons as 1 God different than 1 God as 3 persons? Is God one God or 3 gods?

The scriptures say there is one God, and the three which are one are God.

Did 3 come first or did 1 come first?

And from 3 creeds on this site, they all say the 3 are of the same substance.
http://www.crcna.org/welcome/beliefs/creeds/nicene-creed

I don't know how they are different....................... You go to a Apostolic church though and say 3 is 1 and they boot you out there door.

If you stick to Jesus is of the same substance as the father, God of God, then that is the original wording of the Trinity doctrine. Nobody can fault you as you can post the actual doctrine made in 325ad.

This whole 3 is 1 and 1 is 3 split a major denomination in 1928. The assymbiles of God split in half over this.

I am not trying to give you a hard time Brother, but if you run into a Trinity purist or a Oneness person, then at least you have more information to see where they are coming from.

It don't matter to me either, but it does to a whole lot of folks out there. Something we can keep in mind when trying to understand all these differences.

Drugs V.S the Holy Spirit

I have had this thought that inside people seek by nature the Holy Spirit and that joy He brings. Since they are misdirected, they seek fake substitues to get what every fiber in their being cries out for...... Peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Not saying I am 100% right, but I believe God put this crying out inside for the living waters offered and folks try to get that in natural ways.

Be blessed..........

 

[Gary]

Are you asking "if we aren't meant to see what we see on psyhedelics, then why are those things seen on psyhedelics"?

I was thinking of something else. It's not important.

 

[YosefHayim]

I don't know how they are different....................... You go to a Apostolic church though and say 3 is 1 and they boot you out there door.

If you stick to Jesus is of the same substance as the father, God of God, then that is the original wording of the Trinity doctrine. Nobody can fault you as you can post the actual doctrine made in 325ad.

This whole 3 is 1 and 1 is 3 split a major denomination in 1928. The assymbiles of God split in half over this.

I am not trying to give you a hard time Brother, but if you run into a Trinity purist or a Oneness person, then at least you have more information to see where they are coming from.

It don't matter to me either, but it does to a whole lot of folks out there. Something we can keep in mind when trying to understand all these differences.

Drugs V.S the Holy Spirit

I have had this thought that inside people seek by nature the Holy Spirit and that joy He brings. Since they are misdirected, they seek fake substitues to get what every fiber in their being cries out for...... Peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Not saying I am 100% right, but I believe God put this crying out inside for the living waters offered and folks try to get that in natural ways.

Be blessed..........

I'm not apostolic, or whatever etc., etc.,

I simply read the bible, and go to a nondenom church (that even I am still unsure of). I haven't gotten much into church doctrines and history enough.

All I can say is from my own reading there is one god, and 3 manifest persons that are manifested, or simply are God.

I don't see the difference. I'm still confused as to where I may have been wrong in my first post.

Did I use the wrong creed?

I use the word "manifest" as in 1 Ti. 3:16 = And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

 

[Lewis]

Are you asking "if we aren't meant to see what we see on psyhedelics, then why are those things seen on psyhedelics"?

Your going overboard here.

 

[Angel]

Hallucinogens never felt good to me. And they certainly do NOT feel like the prompts of the Spirit.

 

[Cturtle]

How is 3 persons as 1 God different than 1 God as 3 persons? Is God one God or 3 gods?

The scriptures say there is one God, and the three which are one are God.

Did 3 come first or did 1 come first?

And from 3 creeds on this site, they all say the 3 are of the same substance.
http://www.crcna.org/welcome/beliefs/creeds/nicene-creed

The 3 always were one. They have been since the beginning. Reading Genesis 1:1-2 and john 1:1. In the beginning God created the earth. And at the end of vs. 2...the Spirit of God was hovering. John 1:1 in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Jesus was the Word, and He became flesh in the new testament

 

[Cturtle]

I'm not apostolic, or whatever etc., etc.,

I simply read the bible, and go to a nondenom church (that even I am still unsure of). I haven't gotten much into church doctrines and history enough.

All I can say is from my own reading there is one god, and 3 manifest persons that are manifested, or simply are God.

I don't see the difference. I'm still confused as to where I may have been wrong in my first post.

Did I use the wrong creed?

I use the word "manifest" as in 1 Ti. 3:16 = And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Imo you were not wrong in your original post. Keep with what you are thinking and let the rest go. The enemy is just trying to cause you confusion, so that it takes you away from focusing on the Word, and Jesus our Savior
Much peace in abundance to you!

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Describing the essence of the Holy Trinity, the Church fathers explained that the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost were of the same "substance" which make up the Godhead, which is one God manifest as three persons.

"And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God, begotten of his Father before all worlds, God of God, Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; by whom all things were made; who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Ghost of the Virgin Mary... And I believe in the Holy Ghost the Lord, and Giver of Life, who proceedeth from the Father [and the Son]; who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified;" - Nicene Creed​

So they three are of one spiritual substance. I don't know if my mind is just playin with words, but the Scriptures declare that the Holy Ghost teaches us all things, and brings things to remembrance. That is the Holy Ghost he which enlightens us with the truth.

So once the the spiritual substance, which is the person of the Holy Ghost, dwells within us we are enlightened with wisdom and knowledge.

Now many, who are not of God, but of the flesh, believe that psychedelic drugs are able to enlighten the users. Drugs are often refered to as a substance. Thus now a chemical substance interacts with the physical body this time, instead of a spiritual substance which renews the inner man.

Furthermore, according to John 14:26, we see the Holy Ghost doing two things.

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach...​

He Comforts, and he Enlightens.

Psychedelics are used to simultaneously put oneself in a state of euphoria or Nirvana (comfort), and furthermore are used to obtain a sort of "spiritual enlightenment."

Many "psychonauts" will take psychedelic drugs (LSD, LSA, DMT, Marijuana, MDMA, and Psilocybin, to name a few) to put oneself in an altered state of mind in order to reach the higher self, divine self, or in otherwords the false egotistical delusion that oneself is God or a god (See Genesis 3:5 and Psalm 100:3).

Psyhedelic comes from greek words meaning "Mind/sould manifesting". Similarly the synonym "Entheogen" means "god within" or "becoming divine within".

Does this all this say conclusively that "psychedelics" are a counterfeit "substance" mimicking the Holy Ghost, offering false peace and enlightenment? Are drugs a counterfeit Holy Ghost?

In the end we can say that drugs are sorcery according to scripture. Pharmakeia, the greek for "sorceries" or "magic" is defined also as the use of drugs. A pharmakeus is a maker of magic potions.

Brother there is in NO WAY any kind of comparable anything when you are talking about the TRINITY.
How you could even entertain a thought about drugs being anything like the trinity of God. Better yet how could you even think to ask this type of question?

 

[YosefHayim]

Your going overboard here.

How so?

 

[YosefHayim]

Brother there is in NO WAY any kind of comparable anything when you are talking about the TRINITY.
How you could even entertain a thought about drugs being anything like the trinity of God. Better yet how could you even think to ask this type of question?

You missed the purpose of my post. Of course they aren't comparable. I'm saying one is trying to conterfeit the other. That is satan is trying to play god. And satan is pulling others into the same snare. (2 Corinthians 11:14 Isaiah 14:12-14, Genesis 3:5, Psalm 100:3) Only the truth of Christ redeems.

More specifically psychedelics offer promises which are counterfeits of the true promises of the HS.

HS offers comfort. Psychedelics offer FALSE peace
HS offers enlightenment. Psychedelics offer FALSE enlightenment.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

You missed the purpose of my post. Of course they aren't comparable. I'm saying one is trying to conterfeit the other. That is satan is trying to play god. And satan is pulling others into the same snare. (2 Corinthians 11:14 Isaiah 14:12-14, Genesis 3:5, Psalm 100:3) Only the truth of Christ redeems.

More specifically psychedelics offer promises which are counterfeits of the true promises of the HS.

HS offers comfort. Psychedelics offer FALSE peace
HS offers enlightenment. Psychedelics offer FALSE enlightenment.

Look yes satan is trying to pull people down.
Brother you could say the same about food or sex or beer.
You are putting way to much into this psychedelics stuff. Drugs work different on each person and then it is never the same way twice. Drugs can give a lot of different things to peole but you can not truly compare them as you are......

All this here will do is..
More specifically psychedelics offer promises which are counterfeits of the true promises of the HS.
HS offers comfort. Psychedelics offer FALSE peace
HS offers enlightenment. Psychedelics offer FALSE enlightenment
Keep you chasing other things then drawing close to God.

 

[YosefHayim]

Look yes satan is trying to pull people down.
Brother you could say the same about food or sex or beer.
You are putting way to much into this psychedelics stuff. Drugs work different on each person and then it is never the same way twice. Drugs can give a lot of different things to peole but you can not truly compare them as you are......

All this here will do is..
More specifically psychedelics offer promises which are counterfeits of the true promises of the HS.
HS offers comfort. Psychedelics offer FALSE peace
HS offers enlightenment. Psychedelics offer FALSE enlightenment
Keep you chasing other things then drawing close to God.

I've had experience with psychedelics. Many who have done psychedelic (soul manifesting) drugs know they put you in a spiritual realm. I'm not at all chasing after psychedelics. I've been far removed from psychedelics by God (phil 1:1). And the more something is exposed, the more light people have to see theor wrong. In other words information should leave people without excuse, thus making them run towards God.

The more we know God, the more we know the enemy. And to know the enemy better is to know how to avoid him better.

 

[Karl]

I've had experience with psychedelics. Many who have done psychedelic (soul manifesting) drugs know they put you in a spiritual realm. I'm not at all chasing after psychedelics. I've been far removed from psychedelics by God (phil 1:1). And the more something is exposed, the more light people have to see theor wrong. In other words information should leave peiple without excuse, thus making them run towards God.

The more we know God, the more we know the enemy. And to know the enemy better is to know how to avoid him better.

Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices. 2Co 2:11

We are not called to dabble in or seek out his ways, but we who have been fooled by him can offer our advice.

It is said experience is the best teacher and we learn by experience, but it's much better for us if we learn from someone else's bad experience.

 

[Cturtle]

Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices. 2Co 2:11

We are not called to dabble in or seek out his ways, but we who have been fooled by him can offer our advice.

It is said experience is the best teacher and we learn by experience, but it's much better for us if we learn from someone else's bad experience.

Just to add something if i may......if we become so familiar with the real thing (Jesus and His ways) then we will know and recognize a counterfeit.

When i worked as a cashier, i once ran into a fake 20 dollar bill, when i was counting my drawer out. I brought it to the attention of the money person whom i turned my drawer into. I was worried about getting in trouble for taking this bill. She told me that if i noticed it while counting out, then i probably didn't accept it, someone else did.

So the same works in my mind towards God, no reason to do an in depth study of the devil, just know his main devices and study God so much that He is in our hearts, minds, and spirits in abundance. And we truly will know weather something is from God or not.

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

I've had experience with psychedelics. Many who have done psychedelic (soul manifesting) drugs know they put you in a spiritual realm. I'm not at all chasing after psychedelics. I've been far removed from psychedelics by God (phil 1:1). And the more something is exposed, the more light people have to see theor wrong. In other words information should leave people without excuse, thus making them run towards God.

The more we know God, the more we know the enemy. And to know the enemy better is to know how to avoid him better.

Rotfol......
I never said you are chasing after psychedelics...... I said you are way to busy trying to make this comparison and thus keeping you from spending time in the word.......
Brother I reinged in the 70's. I know about drugs too.
One way satan keeps people pulled away from God is getting them to get off track and think they are discovering some new revelation. Drugs are no more of a deception then any other worldly thing.

 

[YosefHayim]

Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices. 2Co 2:11

We are not called to dabble in or seek out his ways, but we who have been fooled by him can offer our advice.

It is said experience is the best teacher and we learn by experience, but it's much better for us if we learn from someone else's bad experience.

You articulated what I was trying to say much better.

 

[YosefHayim]

Rotfol......
I never said you are chasing after psychedelics...... I said you are way to busy trying to make this comparison and thus keeping you from spending time in the word.......
Brother I reinged in the 70's. I know about drugs too.
One way satan keeps people pulled away from God is getting them to get off track and think they are discovering some new revelation. Drugs are no more of a deception then any other worldly thing.

Funny. Cos this actually came to me in the midst of a devotional. I memorized Jn 14:26, and began meditating on it at work. I didn't "try" to compare. It simply hit me. While I was spending time in the word...

Drugs aren't limited to the 70s. Drugs are worse now. Psychedelics are sorcery, and a tool in the New Age, occult, and in Transhumanism.

It's ok if you disagree. You are right that there is a lot of equally harmful things. But you must remember that while Jesus spent time in the word, he wasn't in the word 24-7. Some people make things out like "why do this when you can read the bible," but do I get a moment to take a sip of water? Part of the life of a Christian is exposing sin. There must be balance in the whole councek of God's word: reading, praying, fastig, exposing, serving, healing, ministering, etc., etc.,

I'm not going to tell you you're wrong. Maybe you're right.

But remember that the foot doesn't say to he hand "I don't need you".

 

[Fish Catcher Jim]

Funny. Cos this actually came to me in the midst of a devotional. I memorized Jn 14:26, and began meditating on it at work. I didn't "try" to compare. It simply hit me. While I was spending time in the word...

Drugs aren't limited to the 70s. Drugs are worse now. Psychedelics are sorcery, and a tool in the New Age, occult, and in Transhumanism.

It's ok if you disagree. You are right that there is a lot of equally harmful things. But you must remember that while Jesus spent time in the word, he wasn't in the word 24-7. Some people make things out like "why do this when you can read the bible," but do I get a moment to take a sip of water? Part of the life of a Christian is exposing sin. There must be balance in the whole councek of God's word: reading, praying, fastig, exposing, serving, healing, ministering, etc., etc.,

I'm not going to tell you you're wrong. Maybe you're right.

But remember that the foot doesn't say to he hand "I don't need you".

Let it go brother.....you missed my point because I am not saying it correctly. I know drugs are not limited to the 70's. I only said it because you said that you had some experience with psychedelics as if I did not know about drugs. I just did not feel the need to get into all of that from past that is dead to me so I said it like that.
What are you exposing that is not known ? That is all I am saying.....it's nothing new.