Psychology dilutes Christianity?!?!

[Christ_empowered]

I tend to agree but I dunno read if you feel like it and share your thoughts …

The Psychologizing of the Church - PsychoHeresy Awareness Ministries

We are presently living in the most ego-enlarged, self-indulged, navel-examined society since the days of Babylon, and the psychological way of dealing with problems of living has been a major source of this self-preoccupation, self-absorption, and self-deception. Psychological systems have not...

pamweb.org

 

[evenifigoalone]

I think the word "heresy" gets thrown around too casually. Aside, I'm sure my other thoughts are well known by this time. My primary critique of psychiatry is that meds are often seen as a cure-all, pushed too early in place of other things that should be ruled out first, and diagnoses are not always accurate to what is actually going on.... which doesn't mean they don't exist at all, just that patients and clinicians both should be doing better to identify issues.
I don't agree with all the official diagnoses I have received, and I did go through a few before finding my true issues. I was diagnosed, for instance, with "generalized anxiety", when the actual issue was sensory processing issues creating anxiety-like symptoms.... autism, not anxiety. And it's actually super common for autistic women to be misdiagnosed with anxiety before autism is considered.

My official diagnoses: major depression, generalized anxiety, OCD, ADHD, autism
What I agree with: depression (seasonal though), OCD (mild and connected to the autism as similar brain structure has been found between them), autism
What I also suspect may be an issue: BPD or similar behavior patterns, dyscalculia (a learning disorder)

And accurate diagnosis, treatment, medication, etc. These things take time. If you have clinical depression, you're not going to feel better or even find the right treatments (meds and other therapies) over night. It's very much trial and error. It can take months or years.

I would also put forward that while scripture does mention things that sound like depression or anxiety.... depression and anxiety are normal except in certain instances where they are excessive. And even when excessive, there are many, many different possible causes. Scripture may have some general thoughts on it. I have a devotional for depression and anxiety that gives verses to meditate on, and I find it very comforting. The Psalms speak to many different human emotions and when I'm not doing well it helps me to feel less alone. Scripture doesn't have advice, though, for every possible cause, and it's not wrong to look for extra treatment when these things become unmanageable.

Anyway. I'm gonna go take my little cocktail of psych and diabetes meds.

 

[Christ_empowered]

I dunno
Psych drugs are palliatives. Some are addictive. None fix anything.

Psychology seems to be a completely different way of looking at things vs Christianity. That’s become quite clear to me over the years…

 

[evenifigoalone]

None fix anything.

Not true. Yes, I am aware that there are studies that show that they are not always as effective as advertised, and that they don't always perform much better than placebo. But this statement goes against both my personal experience and the experience of people close to me.

Most of what's wrong with me aside from depression and possible BPD, though, is related to autism, which.... cannot be medicated, really. There are medications for specific things, like aggressive meltdowns sometimes, but not for the condition as a whole.

 

[Christ_empowered]

That’s my point. The do called antidepressants in particular don’t perform well in severely depressed people but they have anti aggressive and anti obsessive effects…

 

[evenifigoalone]

That’s my point. The do called antidepressants in particular don’t perform well in severely depressed people but they have anti aggressive and anti obsessive effects…

The data I've seen shows that they do help the severely depressed, but not the mild to moderate cases. But I realize studies are going to have different results sometimes due to variables. It's not always an exact science.

 

[evenifigoalone]

I guess overall, I do not find the idea of mental illness to be biblically suspect at all. The brain is an organ and can have issues as well, and many mental illnesses will show up on brain scans, esp if very severe. My own primary condition, autism, has a myriad of brain differences compared to non-autistic brains, which affects pretty much everything about me, even things that may not seem connected.... essentially I would be an entirely different person without autism.
(That said, autism is not pathological the way mental illnesses are. It's more a difference that should be respected and accommodated than something that needs cured. That's another topic altogether though.)

I think the rub comes from the line between normal human things and mental illness not always being a clear one, esp in practice. Like I said, everyone gets anxious. Some people are even very prone to worry and may feel nervous often, but wouldn't qualify for having a disorder unless it causes them more significant distress. I also think, unless clearly severe, meds shouldn't be so much a first line of treatment, but something that you administer when other options and treatments are not proving successful.

Trying to stay on topic, though..... I don't really see there being a significant disconnect between treating legitimate illnesses and Christianity. Sure, some of the therapy things are going to come from a secular perspective if it's taught or led by a secular individual. But I have either been in or read up on the different therapies used in clinical settings, and none of them have struck me as anti-scripture. Some may be wary of the practice of yoga or meditation, which are commonly used in therapy, but I personally have zero issue with them. Yoga is just stretching and the meditation used in therapy is more about "mindfulness" rather than a spiritual practice. (Please don't try to argue with me about yoga or meditation, I will ignore you so hard.)

 

[Christ_empowered]

The pills available now are mostly sedatives tranquilizers or stimulants. Do called antidepressants combine aspects of all 3 which is part of what makes them ineffective and dangerous at times.
Thing is…


That’s maybe suppressing symptoms not treating illnesses. Treating an illness would be like giving vitamins when deficiency involves psychosis. Or treating syphillis with antibiotics and in the process helping the craziness.

 

[evenifigoalone]

That’s maybe suppressing symptoms not treating illnesses. Treating an illness would be like giving vitamins when deficiency involves psychosis. Or treating syphillis with antibiotics and in the process helping the craziness.

That's true of almost all conditions, mental or not. Some are not curable, but only manageable. My diabetes will never go away, my meds help me manage it. Maybe I will one day get to where I can manage it via restricted diet only.

 

[SailorWriter]

To be honest, I don't think therapy is necessary, since as Christians, we have the one who can listen to us whenever we tell Him we have a bad mood, or we are miserable, God. He can help us and comfort us like no other man do and can lift our burdens.

Matthew 11:29-30
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

 

[jasonc]

To be honest, I don't think therapy is necessary, since as Christians, we have the one who can listen to us whenever we tell Him we have a bad mood, or we are miserable, God. He can help us and comfort us like no other man do and can lift our burdens.

Matthew 11:29-30
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

How you would expect a veteran cop ,soldier and fireman to deal with persistent nightmares where PTSD limits there ability to be around oh ,even in church .work .

I know a few vets in church who say .if my wife died or I divorce I have no desire to be around anyone and be homeless .

Never one the ones who killed and then saw photos of kids in the guys wallet of the man they had to kill .or the people you had tried to save dying before you in dreams ?

Anger for no reason ,I have my days where I can be around people . In my rating for PTSD the therapist who rated me said the ability to work was a struggle ,to make friends .I hate crowds at times .I hate the shallowness of civilians outside of the veteran communities at times .

My pastor doesn't grasp that we vets can not know each other and just meet and form a bond that will last until death .

My fil died .he was a vet .his kids didn't get the importance of the va headstone as much as I did ..my wife years before his death didn't think her dad was into his navy days.i bought him a hat put the sea bee emblem on it and he loved it .

Nevermind the dark humor stuff .

 

[evenifigoalone]

To be honest, I don't think therapy is necessary, since as Christians, we have the one who can listen to us whenever we tell Him we have a bad mood, or we are miserable, God. He can help us and comfort us like no other man do and can lift our burdens.

Matthew 11:29-30
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

Therapy isn't about someone saying comforting words to you or making you feel better by their efforts. Therapy is to teach you tools to take care of yourself and help yourself at your lowest points. A good therapist makes you put the work in.
Sometimes people just need a listening ear, though, and that is essentially what "talk therapy" is. Not all therapy is talk therapy.

Expecting to go to therapy to have the warm fuzzies spoken to you is like going to physical therapy after an extended injury limiting your mobility and not expect them to make you try to walk.

 

[follower]

Maybe I will one day get to where I can manage it via restricted diet only.

Maybe.
Many others have.

 

[Josef]

Hey All,
There is nothing wrong with modern medicine taking care of anxiety, adhd, and other recognized mental illnesses. If it helps a person make it through the day, then it is working.

But there are other methods that people use to deal with mental illness as well. Some Native American tribes used sweat lodges. It was a type of sweat bath. It was believed that as a person sweated, they released the illness from the pores of the skin. Then as the body is refreshed after the sweat, the illness is rendered ineffective. If the illness comes back, or still shows signs it is still there, the sweat lodge is repeated until the illness is abated.

The Chinese developed acupuncture, and acupressure as a way dealing with mental illnesses. The minute pain from the needles disrupts the nerve impulses to the brain. Doing this causes a brain reset, correcting the negative responses. The brain releases endorphins, in response to the minute pain. In so doing, the endorphins also ease the tension built up through anxiety.

Going to a chiropractor, and having your back aligned can also relieve nerve stress. The spinal cord runs the length of the torso skeletal structure and is part of the brain. Relieving tension by aligning the back also changes the nerve inputs to the brain. Once the nerve pressure is relieved, so is the stress. So is the anxiety.

Then there is tea. The Chinese have different teas believing that they serve different purposes in healing the body. For example, there is valerian root tea to relieve stress. There is some medical science to back this up. Valerian root is used to make Valium; a proven medication used to relieve stress. But the problem with it is it can become addictive. And an overdose can kill you. But the tea delivers about 1% of the strength of a Valium pill. So it relieves the stress without the possibility of addiction.

If we have the ability to do it, we need to explore alternatives rather than just relying on a pill. Pills do not fix everything. In a lot of cases pills are used to stabilize a condition; but not heal it. There are alternatives. For example Metformin is usually given to people with type 2 diabetes. We can take the drug and be on a restricted diet. Or we can completely change the way we eat and lower our A1C to the point we do not need drugs to control it.

Completely changing is hard. But the reward is worth it. It buys you time. And time is your most precious possession.

Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz