Questions about Mk 3, 11-12, please

[eddif]

Light came to Israel, ( the darkness could not comprehend what light is. John 1:5.)

Even though all the miracles Jesus did confirmed He was that light, nobody was able to believe in Him, to fulfil who believed the report of the Lord ?

To whim was the arm of the Lord revealed, when their eyes are blinded and their hearts hardened) the new covenant is God taking the stony heart our and replacing with a heart of flesh.) then they would not be converted and healed.

Faith comes by hearing ( this testimony) and even though the sound went into all the earth, it was also testified all the day long the Lord had stretched His hand out to a disobedient gainsaying people( Israel.)




John 12:36 While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them.
37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him:
38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

Romans 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Romans 10:18 But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.
19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.
20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.
21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.




NOW look at Mark 3 for CONTEXT.

Christ did miracles in front of Israel, they had those hardened hearts( which is why they could never believe in Christ)

The Pharisees we are told, took counsel against Christ, how they could destroy Him. ( JESUS WITHDREW HIMSELF FROM THEM.)






Mark 3:5 And when he had looked round about on them with anger, being grieved for the hardness of their hearts, he saith unto the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it out: and his hand was restored whole as the other.
6 And the Pharisees went forth, and straightway took counsel with the Herodians against him, how they might destroy him.
7 But Jesus withdrew himself with his disciples to the sea: and a great multitude from Galilee followed him, and from Judaea,





Knowing now that Christ cant be known by Israels hardened hearts, and in fact they wanted to murder Him for these miracles, it is very easy to see why the people are charged by Christ to not make Him known.



Mark 3:11 And unclean spirits, when they saw him, fell down before him, and cried, saying, Thou art the Son of God.
12 And he straitly charged them that they should not make him known.

Camboie could you help in understanding the way the light blindness is removed?

eddif

 

[Camboie]

Camboie could you help in understanding the way the light blindness is removed?

eddif

Thank you Gordon, and thank you eddif
I have a metaphorical theory. I think the blindness comes through the seeing, whereas its removal, through the believing
I'm referring to John 9,39

 

[eddif]

Thank you Gordon, and thank you eddif
I have a metaphorical theory. I think the blindness comes through the seeing, whereas its removal, through the believing
I'm referring to John 9,39

Camboie
John 9:39 kjv
39. And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.

Is this the eyesalve of
Revelation 3:18 kjv
18. I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

It’s the question of why parables (made by the disciples, the request for eyesalve? A simple request for knowledge?

eddif

 

[Tenchi]

Hi, everyone
I used to behave as a rather strict disciple of truth, and was troubled by this piece of scripture, for i interpreted it as an antithesis of my belief that every truth is a good thing to say. D'you know, please, whether this will of Jesus to keep secret his identity was intended :

• to respect some chronology for something more useful at a later date
• Not to reveal it to the disciples, for it would be barren to learn it from a possessed person, since that must become their creed
• for any other reason

d'you know, as well, since it seems the will of Jesus was to hide a truth, what distinguishes, for christian people, a good from a bad truth to say ?

Mark 3:9-12 (NASB)
9 And He told His disciples that a boat should stand ready for Him because of the crowd, so that they would not crowd Him;
10 for He had healed many, with the result that all those who had afflictions pressed around Him in order to touch Him.
11 Whenever the unclean spirits saw Him, they would fall down before Him and shout, "You are the Son of God!"
12 And He earnestly warned them not to tell who He was.

Jesus had come to earth, taken on human form, to be the "Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world" (John 1:29) He had not come to reign on the earth as a King, nor was he incarnated to open a healing clinic. But the more it came to light who he truly was - especially by way of the testimony of the supernatural (demons) - it would be increasingly difficult to fulfill his sacrificial purpose. People would want to set him up as the conquering Messiah they expected him to be, a political figure ruling from an earthly throne, not dying in terrible pain and deep humiliation on a Roman cross. And so, Jesus took pains to obscure his divine nature and what his real purpose was in coming to earth.

John 7:2-8 (NASB)
2 Now the feast of the Jews, the Feast of Booths, was near.
3 Therefore His brothers said to Him, "Leave here and go into Judea, so that Your disciples also may see Your works which You are doing.
4 "For no one does anything in secret when he himself seeks to be known publicly. If You do these things, show Yourself to the world."
5 For not even His brothers were believing in Him.
6 So Jesus *said to them, "My time is not yet here, but your time is always opportune.
7 "The world cannot hate you, but it hates Me because I testify of it, that its deeds are evil.
8 "Go up to the feast yourselves; I do not go up to this feast because My time has not yet fully come."

What was Jesus' "time"? See above.

 

[gordon777]

Why else was Christ unknown to the Pharisees, as well as modern day ones ?

Because it never entered into the ( hardened in pride unbelieving heart)heart, the things that God has prepared for those who love Him. ( so that explains why the eye cant see, no matter how much eye salve might be applied.)




1 Corinthians 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.


Who loves God ?


2 Thessalonians 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.


Those who avoided the deceiving of unrighteousness, through the love of the truth.( belief in the love of the truth.)



The preaching of the cross is that love of the truth.


It cant be preached on deceiving forums, ( it is proven as impossible) because love is not in tongue or word, but in deed and in truth...



1 John 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
19 And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him.



The talkers, will talk on

 

[Camboie]

Camboie
John 9:39 kjv
39. And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.

Is this the eyesalve of
Revelation 3:18 kjv
18. I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

It’s the question of why parables (made by the disciples, the request for eyesalve? A simple request for knowledge?

eddif

I don't know about this, eddif, for i'm not a great reader of the Revelation.Too many metaphors for my understanding.I never read this piece of scripture.
Yet i find your hypothesis interesting, besides the eyesalve could refer to the clay Jesus put on the eyes of the blind, but it's another hypothesis
Sorry i don't understand the meaning of your 2 last questions

 

[Camboie]

People would want to set him up as the conquering Messiah they expected him to be, a political figure ruling from an earthly throne, not dying in terrible pain and deep humiliation on a Roman cross. And so, Jesus took pains to obscure his divine nature and what his real purpose was in coming to earth.

i agree, but i'm not sure it was his unique reason

 

[Camboie]

Because it never entered into the ( hardened in pride unbelieving heart)heart, the things that God has prepared for those who love Him. ( so that explains why the eye cant see, no matter how much eye salve might be applied.)

It's seems likely to me the blind man turned seeer confessed Jesus was son of man through the heart as well. But i don't know why it would be uncompatible with the eye salve.

 

[eddif]

I don't know about this, eddif, for i'm not a great reader of the Revelation.Too many metaphors for my understanding.I never read this piece of scripture.
Yet i find your hypothesis interesting, besides the eyesalve could refer to the clay Jesus put on the eyes of the blind, but it's another hypothesis
Sorry i don't understand the meaning of your 2 last questions

Then

Thank you Gordon, and thank you eddif
I have a metaphorical theory. I think the blindness comes through the seeing, whereas its removal, through the believing
I'm referring to John 9,39

You are actually where you think you are not.

We can call levels what we will.
Light allows vision

Physical vision exists
See. A tree

Social interaction Knowledge exists
I understand the family concept

The knowledge of creation
The seed is the word of God

Metaphysics
Metaphorical
Parables

A physical reality
Relates to a spiritual reality :on different levels

Mark 3 can relate to a lot of things.
But
Ask someone else about parables.
Matthew 13 Mark 4
And
Mark 4 is pretty close to the Mark 3 pasage.

Maybe someone else sees a progression of thought/ seeing from chapter 3 to chapter 4.

Good call on your part about Metaphorical.


eddif

 

[Hidden In Him]

To HIH :
Could you give please the reference of this scripture ? Reminds me of the foolish and wise virgins..

The primary NT text I was talking about was Colossians 4:2-6, which was written in regard to evangelizing wisely, and knowing how to respond in ways that would be strong yet still be graciously received, as opposed to those that would needlessly arouse suspicion or opposition.

2 Continue earnestly in prayer, being vigilant in it with thanksgiving; 3 meanwhile praying also for us, that God would open to us a door for the word, to speak the mystery of Christ, for which I am also in chains, 4 that I may make it manifest as I ought to speak. 5 Walk in wisdom toward those who are outside, redeeming the time. 6 Let your speech always be with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer each one.

There is another use in Ephesians where the phrase would better be translated "making the most of your time," as it's talking there about purifying oneself in advance of the Lord's return.

 

[GodsGrace]

Hi, everyone
I used to behave as a rather strict disciple of truth, and was troubled by this piece of scripture, for i interpreted it as an antithesis of my belief that every truth is a good thing to say. D'you know, please, whether this will of Jesus to keep secret his identity was intended :

• to respect some chronology for something more useful at a later date
• Not to reveal it to the disciples, for it would be barren to learn it from a possessed person, since that must become their creed
• for any other reason

d'you know, as well, since it seems the will of Jesus was to hide a truth, what distinguishes, for christian people, a good from a bad truth to say ?

Jesus was not yet ready to reveal who He was.
As you know, the Sadducees and Pharisees conspired to kill Him once He let it be known that He was the Christ, the Messiah. So Jesus wanted to finish His teaching ministry before He died.

 

[eddif]

The primary NT text I was talking about was Colossians 4:2-6, which was written in regard to evangelizing wisely, and knowing how to respond in ways that would be strong yet still be graciously received, as opposed to those that would needlessly arouse suspicion or opposition.

2 Continue earnestly in prayer, being vigilant in it with thanksgiving; 3 meanwhile praying also for us, that God would open to us a door for the word, to speak the mystery of Christ, for which I am also in chains, 4 that I may make it manifest as I ought to speak. 5 Walk in wisdom toward those who are outside, redeeming the time. 6 Let your speech always be with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer each one.

There is another use in Ephesians where the phrase would better be translated "making the most of your time," as it's talking there about purifying oneself in advance of the Lord's return.

Camboie
Notice that Hidden In Him mentions evangelism (because of your comment).

Also what is to happen next?!
The disciples are called.
Matthew 3:13 kjv
13. And he goeth up into a mountain, and calleth unto him whom he would: and they came unto him.
14. And he ordained twelve, that they should be with him, and that he might send them forth to preach,
15. And he ordained twelve, that they should be with him, and that he might send them forth to preach,
16. And Simon he surnamed Peter;
17. And James the son of Zebedee, and John the brother of James; and he surnamed them Boanerges, which is, The sons of thunder:
18. And Andrew, and Philip, and Bartholomew, and Matthew, and Thomas, and James the son of Alphaeus, and Thaddaeus, and Simon the Canaanite,
19. And Judas Iscariot, which also betrayed him: and they went into an house.

Would not the action of your original question, directly protect the disciples as they are about to be sent forth. Only Judas would be lost.

Jesus was not yet ready to reveal who He was.
As you know, the Sadducees and Pharisees conspired to kill Him once He let it be known that He was the Christ, the Messiah. So Jesus wanted to finish His teaching ministry before He died.

wondering
Would Jesus protect his disciples too?

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[Tenchi]

i agree, but i'm not sure it was his unique reason

Oh? Why is that?