Refining by Fire

[Mike]

In my devotionals last night, I was reading the account of David convincing King Saul that he could defeat the Philistine. Having read this (or heard it) countless times, something stood out to me in a special way last night.

2 Samuel 17
"<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7653">34</sup> But David said to Saul, “Your servant has been keeping his father’s sheep. When a lion or a bear came and carried off a sheep from the flock, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7654">35</sup> I went after it, struck it and rescued the sheep from its mouth. When it turned on me, I seized it by its hair, struck it and killed it. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7655">36</sup> Your servant has killed both the lion and the bear; this uncircumcised Philistine will be like one of them, because he has defied the armies of the living God. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7656">37</sup> The LORD who delivered me from the paw of the lion and the paw of the bear will deliver me from the hand of this Philistine.â€

I've glossed over the story of David defeating a lion and bear before, but when you consider it, it was probably a very stressful ordeal. He could have been killed, it probably made at least his day very difficult. I can imagine him seeing one of his father's sheep that he was responsible for being taken off in the mouth of a beast, and throwing his hands up to Heaven screaming, "Why!!!" Verse 37 would say why. The Lord was chiseling David through this adversity, that one day he would be prepared to stand up to the giant everyone else was afraid of.

I'm curious if anyone has anything that has stood out in their lives as a terrible hardship at the time. Anything that nearly broke you and had you screaming at God, but that you later would look at as a blessing? Perhaps you were able to draw on this experience to deal with something that would have blown you over before. :

I'm not talking about a time when you didn't get something you wanted, and you were unhappy until you got something even better. I'm talking specifically about times you can look back and see God building your character and strengthening you to do something you would one day need to.

((One more thought... If you're going through the fire and see no point in it; if everything looks hopeless and for nothing, I pray we will all still be around the board here on the day you come to realize what He was doing in your life. Just a word of encouragement... It's hard to tell when you're at the bottom, but there's a clearer view from up high. :yes ))

 

[kimberlie]

Wow, Mike. What a coincidence that I found this board today. The other board that I frequent is having some "bugs" and I can't log in. It may be for a while - I don't know. I wouldn't have looked for another board today otherwise and I wouldn't have found your question. Actually, I don't think coincidence is the right word.
<O:p</O:p
<O:p</O:p

I have been thinking about this "refining" that you talk about all day long. I can't get it off my mind. We discussed it at my ladies' Bible study last night.This was the context.

Luke 22:31-34 ...... [31] "Simon, Simon, look out! Satan has asked to sift you like wheat. [32] But I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail. And you, when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers." [33] "Lord," he told Him, "I'm ready to go with You both to prison and to death!" [34] "I tell you, Peter," He said, "the rooster will not crow today until you deny three times that you know Me!"<O:p</O:p

The denial of Christ was more than likely terribly hard for Peter when in the middle of the act. But I think that afterward, when the fear, doubt, shame, and guilt consumed him was when the “sifting” really took place. I looked up the word "sifting" this morning. I wanted a clear definition of what Jesus was I talking about. I knew the farming definition, but I wanted to know more. In this verse, it's the Greek word σινιάζω (siniazō) and both Strong's and Thayer's say it meant to shake in a sieve and figuratively meant "by inward agitation to try one's faith to the verge of overthrow." I've thought and thought about this. That’s a scary thought that Satan requests permission from time to time to shake us up and try to shake the faith right out of us. I know that he can’t have our salvation, but he surely can make us miserable.


<O:p</O:p
And what you said about the Lord “chiseling David through this adversity” preparing him to stand up against a giant that everyone else was afraid of” is EXACTLY what Jesus was trying to tell Peter. He said, “And you (Peter), when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.” He was going to be the leader. And a good leader knows that while “failure is not an option”, he also knows from experience that failure is indeed a grim reality and that life is many times troubling and frightening. I think that’s why Peter was able to say in his first letter, “Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.” He understood that personally and up close.


<O:p</O:p
I’ve been through a couple of things that you are talking about. One – not of my own doing, but something thrust horribly upon me. The other – my own rebellious fault and ignorant attitude. They both changed me – and not for the better. I allowed self-pity to rule and I thought that God must REALLY be mad at me. I felt like the proverbial “bad girl” and for many years even the small things that happened to me I always took as God punishing me for my being a huge disappointment to Him. I was wrong. So very wrong.


<O:p</O:p
I can’t help but think about Joseph from Genesis. He sat in a filthy prison pit for years for a crime that he did not commit. He thought that everyone had forgotten him and that there was no point to any of this. But what he did NOT know was that God was working about the circumstances of Joseph’s life – giving Pharaoh nightmares, confounded the interpreters, preparing a famine for Egypt, and recalling Joseph’s name to the cupbearer. God was quite busy – unbeknownst to Joseph
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<O:p</O:p
I can’t help but think about Job. He never knew that God had a conversation with the devil and that God brought up his name and that Job – the mere mortal man – was discussed in the heavenlies. All Job could eventually do was to say that God is Sovereign and I am not. He never knew the purpose of his season of suffering. All he knew was that God had been faithful to him and that when his “friends” told him that he must have done something REALLY bad to tick God off, Job told them that that was a lie and he was going to question God about it to prove it to them and that if God killed him for asking the question that he would still trust God.


<O:p</O:pOur sufferings – our legitimate sufferings – whether caused by ourselves or others can most definitely “sift” us and shake up our faith. Peter talked a good talk all day about how he was “going the whole distance with Jesus!”. And ….. he didn’t make it. He crashed and burned. And God knew it. And Jesus allowed it. Why? It was for his refining. So he could both teach and lead. Both Job and Joseph came forth from their trials refined also.

<O:p</O:p
I like what Charles Spurgeon says about sifting in context of Amos, chapter 9 where God explains to Israel that they are a “sinful nation” and that he is going to allow the exile to “sift them” and that He will not “allow one grain to fall” but that He is getting rid of the chaff.


<O:p
“I think I see you, poor believer, tossed about like that wheat, up and down, right and left, in the sieve, and in the air, never resting. Perhaps it is suggested to you, ‘God is very angry with me.’ No, the farmer is not angry with his wheat when he casts it up and down in the sieve, and neither is God angry with you; this you shall see one day when the light shall show that love ruled in all your griefs.” (Spurgeon)<O:p</O:p

I like that. Love .... it "rules us even in all our griefs". And God, our Creator, ..... uses our sorrows to bring the chaff to our surface so that HE can deal with them impurites and take them away from us. And then, we are equipped for the works He has for us - some of them very challenging indeed.</O:p

 

[Alabaster]

In my devotionals last night, I was reading the account of David convincing King Saul that he could defeat the Philistine. Having read this (or heard it) countless times, something stood out to me in a special way last night.

2 Samuel 17
"<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7653">34</sup> But David said to Saul, “Your servant has been keeping his father’s sheep. When a lion or a bear came and carried off a sheep from the flock, <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7654">35</sup> I went after it, struck it and rescued the sheep from its mouth. When it turned on me, I seized it by its hair, struck it and killed it. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7655">36</sup> Your servant has killed both the lion and the bear; this uncircumcised Philistine will be like one of them, because he has defied the armies of the living God. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV1984-7656">37</sup> The LORD who delivered me from the paw of the lion and the paw of the bear will deliver me from the hand of this Philistine.”

I've glossed over the story of David defeating a lion and bear before, but when you consider it, it was probably a very stressful ordeal. He could have been killed, it probably made at least his day very difficult. I can imagine him seeing one of his father's sheep that he was responsible for being taken off in the mouth of a beast, and throwing his hands up to Heaven screaming, "Why!!!" Verse 37 would say why. The Lord was chiseling David through this adversity, that one day he would be prepared to stand up to the giant everyone else was afraid of.

I'm curious if anyone has anything that has stood out in their lives as a terrible hardship at the time. Anything that nearly broke you and had you screaming at God, but that you later would look at as a blessing? Perhaps you were able to draw on this experience to deal with something that would have blown you over before. :

I'm not talking about a time when you didn't get something you wanted, and you were unhappy until you got something even better. I'm talking specifically about times you can look back and see God building your character and strengthening you to do something you would one day need to.

((One more thought... If you're going through the fire and see no point in it; if everything looks hopeless and for nothing, I pray we will all still be around the board here on the day you come to realize what He was doing in your life. Just a word of encouragement... It's hard to tell when you're at the bottom, but there's a clearer view from up high. :yes ))

Excellent, Mike!

Yes, whenever I am daunted by anything, I often think about David and how he hearkened back to how God came through for Him in his past, therefore He is trustworthy! We must always remember the victories, which serve to strengthen our resolve to face the challenges we face now!

Praise God! He is ever faithful!

 

[handy]

Kimberlie, hi there! Now that you've found us, I hope you'll stick around. I found your post very insightful!

I'm curious if anyone has anything that has stood out in their lives as a terrible hardship at the time. Anything that nearly broke you and had you screaming at God, but that you later would look at as a blessing? Perhaps you were able to draw on this experience to deal with something that would have blown you over before.

You know, I was single until I was 38 years old. Not by choice, I wanted to marry, just wasn't God's timing...And boy, there were times it nearly broke me, and yes, there were times I screamed at God, times I cried out in heartache and loneliness, times when I feared that I would never be blessed with a husband and family...oh yeah, all that and more in those long years of singleness.

Then, I got married. Three months after I was married, my father-in-law went through a major, complicated surgery, almost died, contracted all kinds of infections, and my husband needed to leave me in Idaho and go help his mother out in Arizona and I didn't see him for almost four months. Then about a year and a half after we married, we bought this ranch, and my husband lost his job the day we closed on this ranch. This meant that he had to find a different job, and since that time, with the economy crashing and all, he has lost several jobs and the jobs that he has found have taken him further and further away from home.

We have two kids now, and for quite some time, I've kissed my hubby goodbye either Sunday night or Monday morning and have not seen him until Friday night. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I handle things here, handle things at his folks when they are down in town with him (my in-laws see my husband far more than we do), get the kids back and forth to school (the bus stop is about 20 miles from here), crack the whip with them to do their chores and handle the discipline and parenting, do my part-time job...all pretty much on my own. I draw on my experience of being single every single day....Frankly, I don't know if my marriage would have worked out if I hadn't been single for so long, because even with the experience those years has given me to cope, it still hasn't been easy. It would be easy for me, if I didn't know better, to be bitter and complain that it isn't fair...as it is, I find my life very blessed and am glad that God brought me through experiences to enable me to handle this admittedly less than perfect yet necessary arrangement.