Sin, Sickness, and the Medical System

[lesjude]

I praise God for the Christians that work in the medical field. There are sick people who do not know Jesus, there are sick people who need prayer. There are those in the medical fields that do believe in healing by laying on of hands and prayer, but if you are honest and you have prayed for very many people you know it that they are not always healed so...would you have them die??

Please read the OP because you seem to have missed the point of the use of the medical system.

 

[reba]

Some what like do you feed the belly of the physically hungry or only feed their soul/spirit....

 

[lesjude]

Some what like do you feed the belly of the physically hungry or only feed their soul/spirit....

I do not understand your comment.

 

[farouk]

How can any Christian without a snow flake mentality i.e no snowflake in an avalanche feels responsible, be involved in the murderous medical system based on carnal knowledge administering poison when Jesus says those who believe can and should do what Mark 16:17-18 says?
It cannot be justified by thinking the good they do outweighs the bad. That is a thought pattern which man received at the fall, not one of a mind renewed by the word and the Holy Spirit of Life.

So you mean no medical work is any good, whatsoever?

 

[Mitspa]

How can any Christian without a snow flake mentality i.e no snowflake in an avalanche feels responsible, be involved in the murderous medical system based on carnal knowledge administering poison when Jesus says those who believe can and should do what Mark 16:17-18 says?
It cannot be justified by thinking the good they do outweighs the bad. That is a thought pattern which man received at the fall, not one of a mind renewed by the word and the Holy Spirit of Life.

You know lesjude, you have many good points and some that seem to be based upon your own "thought patterns" which come from the fall? The way to bring healing back to the "church" is through the gospel and the truth of our legal and justified standing with God. To be IN CHRIST is to open doors of all the promises of God to the believer. To know the Spirit of God and walk in the Spirit is TO KNOW the things freely given to us by God. The problem is the carnal and religious mind that cannot receive these promises. The gospel when believed, will bring the "divine nature" and the church will not need a arm-twisting debate but will accept healing as part of Who Christ is.

Again I say the issue is that the "law" is the issue that hinders faith. Because the law empowers the flesh and its deceptions.

We have a "church" trying to justify itself by the flesh or living defeated lives because all they know is who they are according to the flesh.

As grace increases in the chruch the Power of God will be seen again in these last days.

One who has heard the true gospel will seek the power of the Holy Spirit if they are in fact a child of God?

 

[iLOVE]

The book of "Job" is crystal clear that somethings are too wonderful for the believer to understand "why" does certain things happen.
And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. Romans 8:28
Since we cannot trace God we must trust God.

 

[lesjude]

So you mean no medical work is any good, whatsoever?

Please read the OP again because this has been addressed. Medical mind control is one of the most powerful demonic principalities I am aware of.
I left a highly respected profession I had spent 5 years preparing for, I had nearly total job security, I was successful at for 22 years, and no one would have told me I did the right thing by leaving. Jesus made it clear I was to leave and why. Actually after I left He showed me it was MUCH worse then I first realized. God's people will leave the medical field because He will clearly show them one way or another.

 

[iLOVE]

You know lesjude, you have many good points and some that seem to be based upon your own "thought patterns" which come from the fall? The way to bring healing back to the "church" is through the gospel and the truth of our legal and justified standing with God. To be IN CHRIST is to open doors of all the promises of God to the believer. To know the Spirit of God and walk in the Spirit is TO KNOW the things freely given to us by God. The problem is the carnal and religious mind that cannot receive these promises. The gospel when believed, will bring the "divine nature" and the church will not need a arm-twisting debate but will accept healing as part of Who Christ is.

Again I say the issue is that the "law" is the issue that hinders faith. Because the law empowers the flesh and its deceptions.

We have a "church" trying to justify itself by the flesh or living defeated lives because all they know is who they are according to the flesh.

As grace increases in the chruch the Power of God will be seen again in these last days.

One who has heard the true gospel will seek the power of the Holy Spirit if they are in fact a child of God?

Amen!

 

[lesjude]

The book of "Job" is crystal clear that somethings are too wonderful for the believer to understand "why" does certain things happen.
And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose. Romans 8:28
Since we cannot trace God we must trust God.

It was made clear to Job so it would be clear to us what God was doing. If one is in Christ God does not play mind games with them. He simply expects us to believe, submit to the training, rejoice in it, and certainly not complain.

 

[lesjude]

You know lesjude, you have many good points and some that seem to be based upon your own "thought patterns" which come from the fall? The way to bring healing back to the "church" is through the gospel and the truth of our legal and justified standing with God. To be IN CHRIST is to open doors of all the promises of God to the believer. To know the Spirit of God and walk in the Spirit is TO KNOW the things freely given to us by God. The problem is the carnal and religious mind that cannot receive these promises. The gospel when believed, will bring the "divine nature" and the church will not need a arm-twisting debate but will accept healing as part of Who Christ is.

Again I say the issue is that the "law" is the issue that hinders faith. Because the law empowers the flesh and its deceptions.

We have a "church" trying to justify itself by the flesh or living defeated lives because all they know is who they are according to the flesh.

As grace increases in the chruch the Power of God will be seen again in these last days.

One who has heard the true gospel will seek the power of the Holy Spirit if they are in fact a child of God?

Yes, but the other issue is lawlessness which is just as deadly. Matthew 7:21-29

 

[farouk]

Please read the OP again because this has been addressed. Medical mind control is one of the most powerful demonic principalities I am aware of.
I left a highly respected profession I had spent 5 years preparing for, I had nearly total job security, I was successful at for 22 years, and no one would have told me I did the right thing by leaving. Jesus made it clear I was to leave and why. Actually after I left He showed me it was MUCH worse then I first realized. God's people will leave the medical field because He will clearly show them one way or another.

I guess your answer, to whether all medical work is no good, means 'yes'.

I suppose similarly, by logical extension, you would say that, for instance, a young lady doing ear piercing at Claire's is the same as mutilation.

 

[Deborah13]

Amen!

I'm sorry but you confuse me.

Tonight in another thread you said,

"For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all (over 600 laws).

James 2:10

One must be very careful judging other believers. By doing this you fall into the law and reject Jesus. Your Salvation is in question!

How do you fall into the law when you judge someone and how is that rejecting Jesus?
And how do you reconcil that with your Amen to Mitspa's post?

thanks just wondering where you stand on salvation.

 

[iLOVE]

It was made clear to Job so it would be clear to us what God was doing. If one is in Christ God does not play mind games with them. He simply expects us to believe, submit to the training, rejoice in it, and certainly not complain.

Job was never given an explanation from God why He made him suffer.

 

[farouk]

lesjude:

So do you really think that all pharmacies contain nothing but poison?

Do you think that all preventive or curative medicine is a serious error?

Do you really think that surgery is massacring people?

Do you really think that hygienic measures merely contaminate?

Do you really make no distinction between mutilation on the one hand, and surgery, or ear piercing, etc., on the other?

(Just wondered.)

 

[Mitspa]

It was made clear to Job so it would be clear to us what God was doing. If one is in Christ God does not play mind games with them. He simply expects us to believe, submit to the training, rejoice in it, and certainly not complain.

The gospel is a process of growing in grace and knowledge of Christ. The renewed mind is not forced upon any but it a process of growth. From faith to faith and glory to glory.

I find your witness and testimony of the medical field to have a sound of truth. But I suggest that medical training does not give one any weight in the truth of the gospel. All things in the Kingdom of God are subject to the gospel that Paul preached.
No one will have any place or bearing on the coming time and glory of the Church apart from being grounded upon the sure foundations laid by Paul.

So i suggest you submit these things you have seen and learned to the truth of Pauls epistles and the gospel, then your work will have Gods blessings and fulness. As a minister of gospel FIRST, your understanding and knowledge will be 100 fold. As I see your doctrines now, you seem to work against the truth you claim you want to make known to others?

 

[Deborah13]

Job was never given an explanation from God why He made him suffer.

I'm not sure either but this may be a clue??

Job 40:1-14

King James Version (KJV)

40 Moreover the Lord answered Job, and said,
<sup class="versenum">2 </sup>Shall he that contendeth with the Almighty instruct him? he that reproveth God, let him answer it.
<sup class="versenum">3 </sup>Then Job answered the Lord, and said,
<sup class="versenum">4 </sup>Behold, I am vile; what shall I answer thee? I will lay mine hand upon my mouth.
<sup class="versenum">5 </sup>Once have I spoken; but I will not answer: yea, twice; but I will proceed no further.
<sup class="versenum">6 </sup>Then answered the Lord unto Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
<sup class="versenum">7 </sup>Gird up thy loins now like a man: I will demand of thee, and declare thou unto me.
<sup class="versenum">8 </sup>Wilt thou also disannul my judgment? wilt thou condemn me, that thou mayest be righteous?
<sup class="versenum">9 </sup>Hast thou an arm like God? or canst thou thunder with a voice like him?
<sup class="versenum">10 </sup>Deck thyself now with majesty and excellency; and array thyself with glory and beauty.
<sup class="versenum">11 </sup>Cast abroad the rage of thy wrath: and behold every one that is proud, and abase him.
<sup class="versenum">12 </sup>Look on every one that is proud, and bring him low; and tread down the wicked in their place.
<sup class="versenum">13 </sup>Hide them in the dust together; and bind their faces in secret.
<sup class="versenum">14 </sup>Then will I also confess unto thee that thine own right hand can save thee.

 

[Gordon]

Here is what Jesus says to do for them:
Mark 16:17-18

New King James Version (NKJV)

<sup class="versenum">17 </sup>And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; <sup class="versenum">18 </sup>they<sup class="footnote" value="[a]">[a]</sup> will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.â€
You do "believe" right?

Lesjude if you want to pray for me I am more than willing to believe and I will find another career if healed. I live with people and I can't not take my meds. I know there was another person on here with illness who fully believed God would heal him and I am assuming he is in trouble because he is off his meds. I am getting baptized for the first time as an adult soon and I will do so with the belief I will be healed I don't see where in the Bible it says medication is evil or a lack of faith. I pray and repent and have people pray for me but since I am not yet healed I take my medication.

 

[reba]

Amen Gordon

 

[iLOVE]

I'm not sure either but this may be a clue??

Job 40:1-14

King James Version (KJV)

40 Moreover the Lord answered Job, and said,
<sup class="versenum">2 </sup>Shall he that contendeth with the Almighty instruct him? he that reproveth God, let him answer it.
<sup class="versenum">3 </sup>Then Job answered the Lord, and said,
<sup class="versenum">4 </sup>Behold, I am vile; what shall I answer thee? I will lay mine hand upon my mouth.
<sup class="versenum">5 </sup>Once have I spoken; but I will not answer: yea, twice; but I will proceed no further.
<sup class="versenum">6 </sup>Then answered the Lord unto Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
<sup class="versenum">7 </sup>Gird up thy loins now like a man: I will demand of thee, and declare thou unto me.
<sup class="versenum">8 </sup>Wilt thou also disannul my judgment? wilt thou condemn me, that thou mayest be righteous?
<sup class="versenum">9 </sup>Hast thou an arm like God? or canst thou thunder with a voice like him?
<sup class="versenum">10 </sup>Deck thyself now with majesty and excellency; and array thyself with glory and beauty.
<sup class="versenum">11 </sup>Cast abroad the rage of thy wrath: and behold every one that is proud, and abase him.
<sup class="versenum">12 </sup>Look on every one that is proud, and bring him low; and tread down the wicked in their place.
<sup class="versenum">13 </sup>Hide them in the dust together; and bind their faces in secret.
<sup class="versenum">14 </sup>Then will I also confess unto thee that thine own right hand can save thee.

Who is he that hideth counsel without knowledge? therefore have I uttered that I understood not; things too wonderful for me, which I knew not. Job 42:3

 

[farouk]

I think lesjude has gone.

I don't think he wanted to answer my questions anyway. It's fine; he doesn't have to. But when someone makes the many statements that he does, it's inevitable that people are going to put them under some scrutiny, including a Biblical one, we hope.