How many Americans believe in God? According to a recent Gallup poll, only 81% of Americans say that they believe in God, the lowest since 1944.
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[__ Science __ ] Survey: Fewer Americans Believe in God than Ever Before
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Barbarian
Member
The rise of the religious right was not a good thing for faith, it seems. Politicizing religion turned out to be very bad for religion.
Christ_empowered
Member
I agree with Barbarian . I'd also like to point out....secularization. Its a global phenomenon ("its a thing," as the cool kids say), and its happening...now. I skimmed some social sciences material on the subject, and it looks like this: fewer people adhere to any existing faith ; fewer people who believe are actually actively involved (attending church, etc.) in a faith ; sometimes, one sees jumps in religious groups (Pentecostals in parts of South America, apparently), but further research shows that many converts are still fairly secular as they go in...
and they remain secular (and I imagine disillusioned) as they exit. The hypothesis also holds that new converts for faith (in general) will attract more of the poor and uneducated, which...is awesome, from a Christian perspective (The Good News...He came to set the captives free, after all), but again: Christian on paper does not mean Christian in real life, outlook, or anything else. and yet...
I lost the link for this, but one sociologist (from Baylor, maybe?) made a point that Christianity seems to always have "true believers," at all strata. So...to me, that lines up with Scripture (wheat and tares, "many are called, few are chosen...," ye shall know a tree by the fruit it bears, in the last days the love of many shall grow cold...), which is oddly...
comforting? -shrug-
God gives the increase. God is in control.
and they remain secular (and I imagine disillusioned) as they exit. The hypothesis also holds that new converts for faith (in general) will attract more of the poor and uneducated, which...is awesome, from a Christian perspective (The Good News...He came to set the captives free, after all), but again: Christian on paper does not mean Christian in real life, outlook, or anything else. and yet...
I lost the link for this, but one sociologist (from Baylor, maybe?) made a point that Christianity seems to always have "true believers," at all strata. So...to me, that lines up with Scripture (wheat and tares, "many are called, few are chosen...," ye shall know a tree by the fruit it bears, in the last days the love of many shall grow cold...), which is oddly...
comforting? -shrug-
God gives the increase. God is in control.
For that matter, does it seem like we live in a country where 81% of the people actually believe in God?
If we were to define "believing in God" as "attempting to live my life as though God actually existed and pleasing him by living according to his precepts is the primary goal," I'd place the percentage at more like 8.1% based on my experience and observation.
More than the rise of the religious right, which does promote anti-intellectualism and conflates Christianity with right-wing nationalism and has been a negative influence, I would lay the blame mostly on the secularization of the educational system over the past 50 years. Because everyone passes through the educational system, this secularization has tentacles that now extend to every nook and cranny of society. When Marxists talk about the "long, slow march through the institutions," this is what they are talking about - and it's been brilliantly successful.
I had a debate with an English atheist who is now living in the U.S. and whose husband is a world-class COVID researcher. She explained that, at least as far as most of Europe is concerned, my perspective was completely out of date. Religion, she said, is a matter of complete indifference, not even on most peoples' radar screens. They don't "disbelieve" or "reject" religion - they no longer even believe it's worth thinking about, any more than the Easter Bunny is. We're 20 or so years behind, but that's the path I think were on.
If we were to define "believing in God" as "attempting to live my life as though God actually existed and pleasing him by living according to his precepts is the primary goal," I'd place the percentage at more like 8.1% based on my experience and observation.
More than the rise of the religious right, which does promote anti-intellectualism and conflates Christianity with right-wing nationalism and has been a negative influence, I would lay the blame mostly on the secularization of the educational system over the past 50 years. Because everyone passes through the educational system, this secularization has tentacles that now extend to every nook and cranny of society. When Marxists talk about the "long, slow march through the institutions," this is what they are talking about - and it's been brilliantly successful.
I had a debate with an English atheist who is now living in the U.S. and whose husband is a world-class COVID researcher. She explained that, at least as far as most of Europe is concerned, my perspective was completely out of date. Religion, she said, is a matter of complete indifference, not even on most peoples' radar screens. They don't "disbelieve" or "reject" religion - they no longer even believe it's worth thinking about, any more than the Easter Bunny is. We're 20 or so years behind, but that's the path I think were on.
stovebolts
Member
I would go one step further and look at the breakup of the family. Parents no longer raise their children. Instead, this task has been granted to the school system. Both parents are now required to work and the children spend more time outside the home than with their parents. Parents come home tired and neglect quality time with their children.
Our whole societal structure is a mess and by design, breaks up the family.
Which, to a large degree can be laid at the doorstep of the feminist movement. Way back in 1979, one of my law professors said "If you think the Civil Rights movement changed this country, wait until you see what THIS one does."
Christ_empowered
Member
the various waves of the feminist movement didn't hit the post-wwII, husband working wife at home+kids ideal (and practice, for many in the middle and upper classes), until...
economic necessity. inflation, stagnant wages, neo-liberalism getting started so...less of a safety net, weakening unions, more of the profits and wealth going upstream (that's the norm for capitalist nations, but regulations since The Great Depression hit had helped share the wealth for a while...), and...
yeah. yeah. Its also worth noting that the sort of feminism that gained traction (predictably?) served the interests of the middle and (definitely...) upper/more affluent classes of women vs other forms of feminism, many of which took a deeper look at class issues ("feminization of poverty" -- in part because of no fault divorce, more women and kids took a nose dive into poverty, starting in the late 60s and into the 70s...), and some took a deeper look at the intersections of race -and- class -and- sex/gender roles...
but it seems that the TV and the movies then --and now-- mostly deal with the white, pretty, dissatisfied (and relatively affluent) women's issues. The stifling boredom of housewifery, relieved only by various psych drugs is a common cliche (albeit one -- like many cliche themes -- partly rooted in the reality of the times...then again, its true of our times, too, and the pills are -far less fun- ...) vs the more nuanced and varied reality faced by many women...
the costs of upward mobility, being female and non-white in a world where white men were the standard; dealing with post-divorce stigma and financial hardship at times when divorce became more -legally- available, but was still often stigmatized and damaging, financially...
sorry to ramble. i have family members in the social sciences and I was precocious as a teen, so I grew up reading all kinds of stuff, some of which centered on the material above...
to be fair, its like -any- sort of history: there's the standard text book history (Big, Rich, Important Men! Big Ideas!), and then there's more subtle, nuanced approaches that provide more context to get a bigger picture of the times (sociohistorical analysis, etc.).
but yeah. secularization. Weber, a big time German sociologist in the early 20th century (see above: Big Men, Big Ideas) had some easy-to-remember and -vital- concepts. 1) Iron law of oligarchy -- note that is an "Iron Law," not a statement of the way things usually go. Basically, in any society, power and resources and connections concentrate at the top, and then at the top of the top...what a later sociologist, C. Wright Mills, terms the "power elite."
2) Disenchantment of the world -- I actually like this more than the "secularization" hypothesis, and its older. Something...poetic about it. As society progresses, religion and the supernatural lose their power and real grasp over the masses. Churches may exist, but the power is gone for society as a whole. Science and progress and...what's interesting, to me, is that a lot of it is religious, too...like Freud and Jung and then there are even cults, periodically...
but yeah. time marches on, the world becomes ever more "disenchanted." :-(
economic necessity. inflation, stagnant wages, neo-liberalism getting started so...less of a safety net, weakening unions, more of the profits and wealth going upstream (that's the norm for capitalist nations, but regulations since The Great Depression hit had helped share the wealth for a while...), and...
yeah. yeah. Its also worth noting that the sort of feminism that gained traction (predictably?) served the interests of the middle and (definitely...) upper/more affluent classes of women vs other forms of feminism, many of which took a deeper look at class issues ("feminization of poverty" -- in part because of no fault divorce, more women and kids took a nose dive into poverty, starting in the late 60s and into the 70s...), and some took a deeper look at the intersections of race -and- class -and- sex/gender roles...
but it seems that the TV and the movies then --and now-- mostly deal with the white, pretty, dissatisfied (and relatively affluent) women's issues. The stifling boredom of housewifery, relieved only by various psych drugs is a common cliche (albeit one -- like many cliche themes -- partly rooted in the reality of the times...then again, its true of our times, too, and the pills are -far less fun- ...) vs the more nuanced and varied reality faced by many women...
the costs of upward mobility, being female and non-white in a world where white men were the standard; dealing with post-divorce stigma and financial hardship at times when divorce became more -legally- available, but was still often stigmatized and damaging, financially...
sorry to ramble. i have family members in the social sciences and I was precocious as a teen, so I grew up reading all kinds of stuff, some of which centered on the material above...
to be fair, its like -any- sort of history: there's the standard text book history (Big, Rich, Important Men! Big Ideas!), and then there's more subtle, nuanced approaches that provide more context to get a bigger picture of the times (sociohistorical analysis, etc.).
but yeah. secularization. Weber, a big time German sociologist in the early 20th century (see above: Big Men, Big Ideas) had some easy-to-remember and -vital- concepts. 1) Iron law of oligarchy -- note that is an "Iron Law," not a statement of the way things usually go. Basically, in any society, power and resources and connections concentrate at the top, and then at the top of the top...what a later sociologist, C. Wright Mills, terms the "power elite."
2) Disenchantment of the world -- I actually like this more than the "secularization" hypothesis, and its older. Something...poetic about it. As society progresses, religion and the supernatural lose their power and real grasp over the masses. Churches may exist, but the power is gone for society as a whole. Science and progress and...what's interesting, to me, is that a lot of it is religious, too...like Freud and Jung and then there are even cults, periodically...
but yeah. time marches on, the world becomes ever more "disenchanted." :-(
stovebolts
Member
Ironically, I started my initial reply with the suppression of women's rights and how Hollywood responded by making the men out to be bafoons to which Desi Arnaz would never allow himself to be subject to. Fast forward to modern day Disney and it’s amazing how gender roles have changed in the smash box office hit Frozen. The men are reduced to bumbling idiots while the women have the intellect and warrior attributes only once reserved for men.
I don’t say all this to mock women and their abilities but only Hollywoods distortion. My point is this, I believe women have been treated unfairly and unjustly through our culture and honestly, the men who womanized them, paid substandard wages to them, suppressed them from leadership roles based on sex etc are as responsible for where we are at today in that arena.
But more so to my point is this. Most marriages don’t last and the kids are split in blended families. A mother who wants to stay home and raise the kids is the exception because now society pressures them into careers and makes women feel inadequate if they stay home. In addition, both parents are required to work full time jobs just to financially support their household which overwhelmingly removes the parenting role from the child. As a result, the children spend more time with peers than they do parents. Mix that with teachers not being allowed to take on parenting roles, and peer pressure is their guiding light.
Nah.... It's the fall. No religious right would cause that. As scripture teaches, men are lead astray by the desire of their hearts. It is a gradually chipping away at moral integrity. Go no further than the entertainment industry for that. The more it has been given a pass, the more moral decay. You are what you entertain. People like Elizabeth Taylor, Marilyn Monroe and the such have made it fashionable to be a whoring. Music adds to the moral decay so forth and so on through generations -loose morals. To present day vices fostered by the baby steps of debauchery from American Idols- porn and the filthiest music ever contrived. If people held that industry accountable and to a higher standard, the festering tentacles of its loose morals would not have taken hold. Find out who runs that idustry and you will find out who the perps of moral decay are. People need Christ's religion if they seek a return to virtue, beauty and truly captivating artistry. Man's muses are not humorous nor enriching.
Keeping up with the Kartrashiens? Are you Jersey Shoring it? Are you Miley Cyrus bound? Is Jay-Z who you are inspiring to be? Is Beyonce your momma and bible verses used as a feminine hygiene product by her -no big thing, then let her sing! Let every chain given by her "artistry" weigh you down like mafia cinder blocks! If you love the debauchery of satan's entertainment industry , you think it's fire 
, you have no idea! Lol! then may you follow it to where it comes from and where it is going. For the idols of men are for the fire. You will receive Brittany's Spears and Kanye's phonier than a 3 $ bill " Christian" rhymes, a mastery of lies! Time is not on their side. If given 100yrs what is that in the face of eternity? You will receive the reward of your works.
, you have no idea! Lol! then may you follow it to where it comes from and where it is going. For the idols of men are for the fire. You will receive Brittany's Spears and Kanye's phonier than a 3 $ bill " Christian" rhymes, a mastery of lies! Time is not on their side. If given 100yrs what is that in the face of eternity? You will receive the reward of your works.
Barbarian
Member
Paul Weyrich, the late religious conservative political activist and co-founder of the Heritage Foundation, saw his opening.
In the decades following World War II, evangelicals, especially white evangelicals in the North, had drifted toward the Republican Party—inclined in that direction by general Cold War anxieties, vestigial suspicions of Catholicism and well-known evangelist Billy Graham’s very public friendship with Dwight Eisenhower and Richard Nixon. Despite these predilections, though, evangelicals had largely stayed out of the political arena, at least in any organized way. If he could change that, Weyrich reasoned, their large numbers would constitute a formidable voting bloc—one that he could easily marshal behind conservative causes.
“The new political philosophy must be defined by us [conservatives] in moral terms, packaged in non-religious language, and propagated throughout the country by our new coalition,” Weyrich wrote in the mid-1970s. “When political power is achieved, the moral majority will have the opportunity to re-create this great nation.” Weyrich believed that the political possibilities of such a coalition were unlimited. “The leadership, moral philosophy, and workable vehicle are at hand just waiting to be blended and activated,” he wrote. “If the moral majority acts, results could well exceed our wildest dreams.”
www.politico.com
Weyrich got what he was looking for. But at a cost of American turning away from God. He was serving the wrong master, who led him to do exactly what that master wanted for America.
In the decades following World War II, evangelicals, especially white evangelicals in the North, had drifted toward the Republican Party—inclined in that direction by general Cold War anxieties, vestigial suspicions of Catholicism and well-known evangelist Billy Graham’s very public friendship with Dwight Eisenhower and Richard Nixon. Despite these predilections, though, evangelicals had largely stayed out of the political arena, at least in any organized way. If he could change that, Weyrich reasoned, their large numbers would constitute a formidable voting bloc—one that he could easily marshal behind conservative causes.
“The new political philosophy must be defined by us [conservatives] in moral terms, packaged in non-religious language, and propagated throughout the country by our new coalition,” Weyrich wrote in the mid-1970s. “When political power is achieved, the moral majority will have the opportunity to re-create this great nation.” Weyrich believed that the political possibilities of such a coalition were unlimited. “The leadership, moral philosophy, and workable vehicle are at hand just waiting to be blended and activated,” he wrote. “If the moral majority acts, results could well exceed our wildest dreams.”
The Real Origins of the Religious Right
They’ll tell you it was abortion. Sorry, the historical record’s clear: It was segregation.
www.politico.com
Weyrich got what he was looking for. But at a cost of American turning away from God. He was serving the wrong master, who led him to do exactly what that master wanted for America.
Correlation does not imply causation, as the saying goes. I lived through all these decades, too, and I think the decline in religious belief is complex and multi-faceted.I notice that the decline in religious belief in America coincides with the rise of the religious right and the politicization of religion in America.
Certainly the right's politicization of religion might dismay many people, but is it reasonable to conclude it's a significant contributor to the decline of belief in God? I have seen such speculation, but it seems like a stretch. 95% of what passes for Christianity dismays me, but it hasn't touched my belief in God. When people are actually asked, as in Pew polls, why they stopped believing, "disgust over the right's politicization of religion" isn't mentioned. It's a convenient narrative for the left, but I doubt it's true. It's not as though politicians on the left never play the God card.
I would guess that the drug culture, the rise of feminism, the secularization of the educational system, the New Atheist movement, the emphasis on science in general and evolution in particular, the sexual revolution, the Catholic priest scandals and other religious scandals, the slimy character of mega-churches and celebrity Christianity, the elevation of technology to god-like status, and lots of other factors have and are contributing to the decline - and that many of them may well have a supernaturally evil aspect as well.
You notice? Lol! The funny thing is, people were more religious before any polls were taken. And it is a fact, that as people began to get more rebellious-religious observance is the first casualty. Do you always quote polls? Another obvious, the less religious government people are, the less valued are religious Christian principles for society at large. That is just commonsense. It is not -I notice that the decline in religious belief in America coincides with the rise of the religious right and the politicization of religion in America.
religious people from the right caused people to reject God. If in the middle you were Lukewarm to begin with, if left simply cold. And political right does not necessarily mean 100% right minded either. Lots of Trumps walking around-simply lukewarm . Right minded in God simply means righteous. If you think the right pushed them over the edge to fall from the faith, it wouldn't take much- they were at the edge to begin with.
As Christ said " you are the salt of the earth if you lose your saltiness what then will there be to salt with?" Salt does not prevent rot indefinitely, it staves it off for a time . It is simply to prevent spread to healthy portions. At some point people have just decided to reject salt and light that is all, no push, just the exercising of the freewill to choose. Seems the popular choice is evil. Lots of double- speak in your post. Sound a lot like some Jews I know with their polls and all.
The pillars of salt will be left outside the majority. We are to simply leave the world and not look back. Hence, " Be in the world but not of it". That is the ultimate end for evil, when the sign of the pillar of salt is left outside of a society. The ultimate end of that city, nation, kingdom has begun. Pillars of salt standing outside of the societal norms means the extreme against God has taken place. The majority is corrupt!
Once called out we are to never look back , whether it is out of regret, sorrow, concern or sadness. No time to rekindle old desires or cares for debauched behavior. They have reaped what they have sown. Sin remains in the past. The old fallen ways, those old dogs who cannot learn new tricks, bring God's wrath UPON THEMSELVES. To say the religious right minded made them fall is an oxymoron. Point is, as the rot progresses to the point of no return, no amount of salt can help. The rot is done and complete and for the fire. Salt can't reverse rot it can only preserve from-under the right conditions ( pun intended).Those conditions are not unconditional, they require you to stay in the light. Anyone preaching the Word of God is salt and light. History shows there will always be those who reject it, not because they heard it too much from the right minded but because they just don't want to hear it.
Amen! And the Proverb is true-" step neither to the right or left, keep your feet from evil". That is why Christ said " My kingdom is not of this world". Christians are not home in this world, rather we are a kingdom within the kingdoms of men. We are salt light , that men and their kingdoms may apply the light to see their own inner darkness and the darkness hidden about them and to apply salt- saving knowledge, which benefits life.
I gave your answer more thought. How very true. Send your children away to college or public school they come back indoctrinated with smack and are butting heads with you. You can be a prophet like Samuel and your sons will do a disservice to your name and position. Samuel knows about that all-too-well. People are like whaaaat??? How'd that happen? You can be raising your sons to be Samsons-and some Delilah comes around and their hair gets cut off- (fall from grace )and their eyes get gauged out- (made blind by the ways of the world), and your heart gets grieved. At that point it's going to take Mercy and a self sacrificing act for them to get back what they lost.
Point is, as God fearing parents with a holy anointing we can have rebellious children. You can raise them one way and get behavior that contradicts that. But that Proverb at the end always rings true- "Raise your sons up in the way they should go and when they are older they will not turn from it". When they are older? Well that comes with their final turning. And St.Paul says: " children are sanctified through the believing spouse" husbands are too or vice versa . Point is, Christian children come back around as long as the parents stay true to the faith. The prodigal son always comes back, whether through hardships or at their final days.
Ya know what I have learned? the hardest thing to be is a Christian. It's a calling not for the pantywaste or the heartless. Probably explains why so many avoid it. You need moxie! You may be the last man standing, the only Rock of Gibraltar but if not you then who? There has to be a home base of sanctification for our youth. But I'll tell you a secret, a delivery is coming. Those dry bones will come back to life. Parents stand firm in faith. Though it seems like our youth is lost, the polar shift is coming sooner than you think. Trust me your children will remember the days when they sang " this little light of mine " and " Jesus loves me this I know" without fear or embarrassment, without a care -if someone thought it wasn't cool or hip.Your children will run home to you.