Tattoos are sinful

[Rick W]

Ah, ok. I see where you're coming from.
Those things you mention of your son... good things, based on scripture...

The first being a sense of accomplishment that my son is a reflection of the things I and my wife have taught him and have instilled into his moral character. When I see my son making unselfish choices putting others before him, or asking tender questions about concerning others, I admit that take pride in his growth. The second is how my son wants to please God and how he lives out the lessons that he’s learned either through our discussions, or what he’s been taught at Sunday school. The third is how God has moved and worked in my life to be blessed by such a family. In short, I take pride in our Savior, who set such a great examples, and endured such hardships for our salvation.

Excellent.
You're right. Those things will survive the refiner's fire.

I take pride in our Savior, who set such a great examples, and endured such hardships for our salvation.

I can't find that verse right now : but Paul said something to the effect that if you're going to boast then boast in Christ.
Where is that verse???????
Anyway,
Very good Stovebolts. You've given me something to chew on.
:smt023

Bless you.

 

[stovebolts]

Good post Craig! Thanks!

Potluck, Are you thinking of 2 Corinthians 11?

Thanks for the opportunity to let me think out loud on all of this. I appreciate your encouragment.

 

[Rick W]

Potluck, Are you thinking of 2 Corinthians 11?

Something about if you must boast then boast in Christ (or the cross) ... something like that.

"something like that"
That's why I wanted to find that verse. I can't believe I can't find it. : Bad case of brain-lock perhaps.

 

[stovebolts]

Potluck, Are you thinking of 2 Corinthians 11?

Something about if you must boast then boast in Christ (or the cross) ... something like that.

"something like that"
That's why I wanted to find that verse. I can't believe I can't find it. : Bad case of brain-lock perhaps.

Well, I'd be willing to bet it's somewhere between Matthew and Revelation :wink: , and it's probably a letter that Paul wrote :smt103

Other than that, I'll just sit by the way : while you figure it out :microwave:
:smt110 Don't you just hate brainlock :smt101 :smt083

 

[Rick W]

1Co 1:31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

:smt080

Ever happen to you while witnessing? It's very awkward to say the least.
"Well, it's here somewhere...I know it is." :

 

[stovebolts]

LOL, yeah, it happens! That's when I generally just try and remember what book it's in and give them some homework :wink:

Anyway, your lucky that the verse was in Chapter 1 and not in Chapter 16 :-D

BTW, Great verse! :D

 

[Alabaster]

Potluck, Are you thinking of 2 Corinthians 11?

Something about if you must boast then boast in Christ (or the cross) ... something like that.

"something like that"
That's why I wanted to find that verse. I can't believe I can't find it. : Bad case of brain-lock perhaps.

Galatians 6:14 NLT
As for me, may I never boast about anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ. Because of that cross, my interest in this world has been crucified, and the world’s interest in me has also died.

 

[Veritas]

heh... its really neat to see the continuity in God's Word...

This is what the LORD says:
"Let not the wise man boast of his wisdom
or the strong man boast of his strength
or the rich man boast of his riches,

but let him who boasts boast about this:
that he understands and knows me,
that I am the LORD, who exercises kindness,
justice and righteousness on earth,
for in these I delight,"
declares the LORD. Jeremiah 9:23-24

 

[Rick W]

Nice find Veritas! :smt023
Thanks Alabaster!

Yeah, it's in there alright. 8-)

 

[handy]

he-he-he! This is why I like e-Sword. Click on 'search'. Type in boast. Bada-bing, there is it! :smt080

 

[Rick W]

I have e-sword and did just that.
But I was having an out-of-the-mind experience at the time. :
:-D

And what I was looking for wasn't "boast" which threw me off. The word I needed was glory.
There are a BUNCH of verses with glory in them :o

 

[Malachi45]

Hi SB,

I can understand what you shared in regards to the tattoos that you have.

In the healing ministry there is much hurt expressed in many ways. And once all that inner hurt is dealt with through prayer and forgiveness, then HE remembers no more.

What has been done, has been done.

But, this discussion is about a Christian who wants to get a tattoo, or that is, I believe that what the discussion is about.

Anyway, how are you travelling after your meet up with our Lord Jesus CHrist?

Yes Malachi, what has been done has been done. Christ is even quoted as saying, “It is finishedâ€Â, yet we still remember his passion each week as instituted by the Lord himself when he said, “Do this in remembrance of me.â€Â

I only brought this up due to the topic and your above words where you say, “But, this discussion is about a Christian who wants to get a tattooâ€Â

I simply stated why I wanted a tattoo, and yes, I was a Christian when I receive my tattoos. As far as my journey with our Lord, it is only the Lord who can heal the broken hearted and restores the lost. Everything else, I believe, is a vain attempt in coping with a reactive tendency toward survival.

You also stated above, “In the healing ministry there is much hurt expressed in many ways. And once all that inner hurt is dealt with through prayer and forgiveness, then HE remembers no more.â€Â

As a community of believers in Christ, we should be there for each other in deep times of distress. When I had nobody else to turn to, when my family (all but my brother) turned their backs, when the pastor of my church turned his back, when I was all alone, broken and beaten and everything of value had been stripped or taken from my inner being, … Christ was already at work with his healing ministry… it only took me several years to realize what Christ looked like, and acknowledge his grace.

Ah Sb, so well written, and have been there myself and still that place at times, as the talkers walk around not walking what they talk. :D

I find that Christian church isn't what our Lord wants it to be, but without HIM I wouldn't be here now. :crazyeyes:

You many many good points.

But actually, I try my hardest to warn Christians about many things that are practiced now, that others claim to be harmless, when it's not.

Take care, and no doubt HE has been working in your life, and I pray that I haven't been too rought on some of my comments. I do have many seniors moments at times. :-D

 

[stovebolts]

Great verses Veritas and Alabaster! Thanks for looking them up!

Take care, and no doubt HE has been working in your life, and I pray that I haven't been too rought on some of my comments. I do have many seniors moments at times.

Not a problem Malachi. As far as your comments being rough, no worries. I didn't take them as rough. Actually, I think you presented youreself (and Christ) very well and you have brought much value and truth to this conversation.

I believe it was you that wrote earlier how tattoos were like blood covenants with demons. I've been pondering that a bit and it does disturb me considering my state of mind when I decied to get my tattoos. But here is where I'm troubled. I was reading a portion of Claus Westermann, Presence in Absence and many good points are brought up how God is actually present through his absence... Have you read anything from Claus Westermann?

 

[disruptor]

I tend towards the view that God is present in his presence - ... but that's just me, though...

Interestingly, the only people worrying about the "absence of God" and "blood covenants with demons" are the anti-tattoo faction... maybe demons would be less likely to bother you guys if you had a few cross tattoos to scare them off.

By contrast, I am protected from such negativities by my Christian tattoos.

So, to clarify a couple of errors in the anti-tattoo faction's attempts at reasoning:

If a tattoo is sinful because it is "mutilation", then circumcision is also "sinful" because it most certainly is "mutilation". In fact, circumcision is actual mutilation (unlike tattooing) because it involves the removal of a piece of the body while tattooing does not. Strange that nobody is in a hurry to start circumcision: the bloody truth threads.

If a tattoo is sinful because it is "defilement" of the "temple of one's body", why is almost every "temple", church or cathedral adorned with inscriptions, symbols, murals, carvings of every kind? On this basis, if the body is a "temple", then it must be right to tattoo it with the symbols or inscriptions of our faith (as I have done and shall continue to do).

A tattoo is supposedly a sign of "pride" (in decorating oneself or in wanting to belong to a tattooed subculture). But, speaking personally, I neither belong to any "subculture" (unless 123christian counts as a "subculture"), nor do I have my tattoos on display to "impress" people. Getting the tattoos was more of an act of self-mortification, like wearing a hair-shirt or flagellating oneself on a medieval pilgrimage - tolerating a bit of pain to mark one's faith. So "pride" had nothing to do with it either.

Incidentally, there is no truth to the rumor that all 123christian mods have the 123christian symbol secretly tattooed in an undisclosed location as part of their initiation ritual.

Gal 6:17 From henceforth let no man trouble me: for I bear in my body the marks of the Lord Jesus.

 

[Rick W]

The clothes, the jewelry, the hairdo's and all the body markings will be left in the grave as extra baggage tossed aside whose worth has come to nought. It's all temporary with no value for the eternal life with Christ.

I've found it's not how we view ourselves that has worth but how others interpret us. We may not be doing a terribly good job according to some but the effort is there of which others won't so much as attempt.
If I must defend my actions or appearance to unbelievers then maybe I should reconsider what it is they may see as un-Christlike.

My point?
If you're a Christian then it's best not to get one. If you do have one already then there's not much you can do about it except refrain from getting another one.

/edit
That does not mean to imply if you're an unbeliever to go out and get one.

 

[stovebolts]

My point?
If you're a Christian then it's best not to get one. If you do have one already then there's not much you can do about it except refrain from getting another one.

I agree. Tha'ts some pretty good advice.

 

[Drew]

The clothes, the jewelry, the hairdo's and all the body markings will be left in the grave as extra baggage tossed aside whose worth has come to nought. It's all temporary with no value for the eternal life with Christ.

I have a different view than what I infer from the above.

We know for a fact that there will be a continuity between this world and the world to come - even in respect to our bodies. Jesus rises and walks the earth for some days in the kind of body we too will get - Paul makes this clear in 1 Corinthians 15. Yet Jesus' body bore the marks of his crucifixion. So we have concrete evidence that some aspects of our body may also be preserved in the world to come.

And think of the seed metaphor. Paul uses the "seed gives birth to a plant" metaphor to describe the transition from this fallen body to our future bodies. Yet we know that there is indeed a connection between the nature of the seed and the nature of the plant that it yields - the seed carries the "genetic instructions" for the future plant.

I trust that you all understand that our ultimate future will be an embodied one - we will not be in a disembodied heaven. The scriptures are pretty clear - God is going to redeem his whole creation and we will be resurrected into bodies and live eternally in a redeemed and transformed "physical world".

 

[Veritas]

I trust that you all understand that our ultimate future will be an embodied one - we will not be in a disembodied heaven. The scriptures are pretty clear - God is going to redeem his whole creation and we will be resurrected into bodies and live eternally in a redeemed and transformed "physical world".

Yup... that's my understanding! :smt023

Interesting remark about Jesus and his crucifixion marks... I had never thought about that before..

 

[Drew]

I trust that you all understand that our ultimate future will be an embodied one - we will not be in a disembodied heaven. The scriptures are pretty clear - God is going to redeem his whole creation and we will be resurrected into bodies and live eternally in a redeemed and transformed "physical world".

Yup... that's my understanding! :smt023

Interesting remark about Jesus and his crucifixion marks... I had never thought about that before..

I know that perhaps I am "generalizing" things away from the topic of tattoos, but I find it very interesting that at the end of his inspiring portrait of the world to come in 1 Corinthians 15, Paul caps it with this stuff (including some stuff from the next chapter):

58Therefore, my dear brothers, stand firm. Let nothing move you. Always give yourselves fully to the work of the Lord, because you know that your labor in the Lord is not in vain.
1Now about the collection for God's people: Do what I told the Galatian churches to do. 2On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income.....

I think that if we take 1 Cor 15:58 seriously, we see Paul as saying that even though there will be a new world, the things that we do for the Kingdom in the present world will somehow survive into the world to come, at least in some way. To quote NT Wright, we are not "oiling the wheels of a bus that will go off a cliff".

And when Paul then immediately says "pony up the dough", he is emphasizing, again, that works done for God in the here and now will not be lost - their effect will ripple forward into the world to come.

 

[gila]

Hello,

I think tattooing is a worldly trend. Christians should stay away from such trends.

I try to keep things simple. Especially things that have to do with my walk with Jesus.

g